The Penguins don't like it rough

by Travis Hughes on Apr 20, 2009 3:12 AM EDT in 2009 Playoffs

We don't want to get into those, like, wrestling match. We want to stay, um, like we wanna keep like playing our system and our game. And we know we're not a team that runs around and like, search for little battles or little wrestling. We're just like, stay composed and just play our game.

>> Kris Letang

We knew that they were gonna try to suck us in and play their style and, you know, like get those scrums, get those little fights. And I think that's the way they wanna beat us. You know, it worked tonight because we got sucked in, and for us to be successful we have to play like we did at home. Just change your lines, get away from the scrums, just keep getting at it, because I feel our top three lines when we play five-on-five we've got a better hockey club and that's how we're gonna beat them.

>> Petr Sykora

If you can look past the fact that the Flyers held a 2-0 lead before Game 2 got even close to anything that could be called physical, then yeah, I think these guys might have a point. If you ignore the fact that the Flyers had six power plays and only scored on one of them, then yeah, maybe Sykora is right. Or, you could just pretend that the Flyers didn't score three goals at even strength and two goals while playing down a man (one being the empty netter, of course).

If you ignore the truth, then yes, the Flyers played physical, got the Penguins off of their game, and that's why Pittsburgh lost on Sunday afternoon. If you live in the real world, then Petr Sykora, Kris Letang, and anybody else that agrees with them is just plain wrong.

I'm not saying the Flyers don't try to play physical and try to get the Penguins off of their game. That's 100 percent, unequivocally what the Flyers try to do each and every time they hit the ice. But to say that's the reason Pittsburgh lost yesterday? You've got to be kidding me.

Pittsburgh lost on Sunday because a) the Flyers beat them to loose pucks, b) Philadelphia was absolutely suffocating on defense, c) the Flyers depth players put pucks in the net and the Penguin equivalents didn't come close, and d) the Flyers played a better hockey game.

Nice attempt to justify your poor outing though, guys.

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I disagree with the assesment that the Kunitz hit on Timonen was clean. Timonen was fighting off a check from another Penguin, Kunitz targeted him from the blue line and came flying in with an elbow. he went strait for Timonen’s head. It even looked like he left his feet to make the hit. Carcillo got suspended for punching a guy in the face at the end of the game, big deal. Kunitz has been targeting arguably our most valuable player all series and that hit was delivered with an intent to injure. Imagine if that was Carcillo delivering that hit to Crosby. the NHL would probably suspend him for the rest of the playoffs well into next season.

The NHL is trying to cut down on goon behaviour. Kunitz is targeting Timonen and trying to injure him everytime he’s on the ice. does it get any more goon then that?

and also, notice how after that hit Timonen didnt skate up to the refs and whine for 5 minutes like a member of the Penguins? he got right back on his feet and continued the play, allowing his teammates to deal with the hit.

by njh3293 on Apr 20, 2009 9:41 AM EDT reply actions

Kunitz got off his feet because he ran right over Timonen not because he jumped. He hit Timonen’s head because Kimmo was so low to the ice. It may have been charging if anything.

Kunitz is targeting Timonen and trying to injure him everytime he’s on the ice. does it get any more goon then that?

He’s trying to forecheck. It’s no surprise that a forward is constantly hitting a defenceman.

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by PPP on Apr 20, 2009 9:46 AM EDT up reply actions

Trying to forecheck? Really? That didn’t look much like forechecking to me. I thought you Canadians knew about hockey? That looked like some good old fashion head hunting. Leave it to us Flyers fans, we know about the physicality aspect of hockey.

by Mitchell Green on Apr 20, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions

unfortunately

there is no penalty for holding up a player while the other head hunts… like the chop block in the NFL. Fortunately, Timonen is in great shape and can take an awkward hit like that.

by fitzy first on Apr 20, 2009 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions

I share your anger, because that hit pissed me off when I saw it live. I thought it was a charge and an elbow to the head. When I watched the replay, it might have been a charge, but the elbow stayed in on his body and caught TImonen because his head was down. It was brutal to see (Timonen flipped and landed on his head) but the hit was clean.

What I do agree with, is that Kunitz is targeting a key member of our team. Hartnell stepped up, as someone needed to, but if that was on Crosby, everyone would be screaming for a suspension. But since it’s Kimmo, all the Pens fans think we’re the dirty team for Briere’s high stick on Orpik. Come on…

by Geoff Detweiler on Apr 20, 2009 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions

true that… most smaller players are allowed more of a chance to legally defend themselves from bigger players in the NHL, where does this bias end? in philly… thats why a smaller player can sometimes get away with leaving his feet on a hit. briere had the right move by blocking with his hands, but he followed through with his stick and that was where he when wrong i guess…

by fitzy first on Apr 20, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions

I dont know, I just think it was a dirty hit because Timonen was in a defenseless position. If someoe held up Crosby while Carcillo came in and whacked him in the head Gary Bettman would be lobbying to throw Carcillo in jail.

on another note, I loved it when Crosby got called for an obvious hooking penalty down behind the goalline. There was absolutely no question about it and he was shrieking at the refs as if to say “Im Sidney Crosby! you cant call penalties on me!”

by njh3293 on Apr 20, 2009 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions

Totally agree.
I have no problem with physicality obviously. I am a Flyers fan and have grown up following a Flyers team that is always skilled and tough. That is hockey. I don’t have a problem with Kunitz hitting Kimmo (I mean I do. I prefer for Kimmo to never come into contact with anyone honestly) but it is the fact that Kunitz and others have deliberately targeted Kimmo, not to get in his head or shut him down, but to physically injure him. Everyone talks about wanting to hurt the opposing teams best players but no one actually wants to see it happen. At least I hope not. I mean, I know I don’t; that is just wrong. But you can tell Kunitz is head hunting. He is not a player that normally gets into the rougher stuff and the way that he flew in like that just looked dangerous. Those idiots that do color commentary for the Penguins TV, Paul Steigerwald and Mike Lange, always hate on Hartnell talking about he is going to hurt someone. Well look at the pot calling the kettle black! Hartnell plays with emotion, Kunitz just plays dangerous. And I will say that I LOVED how Kimmo got right up and skated down ice. That is the biggest way to respond after getting crushed. That is Kimmo saying “bring the best you got because you laid me out and I still got up.” And did anyone see Kimmo post game interview with that mole Pierre McGuire? McGuire asked Kimmo about the hit and Kimmo took full credit saying that he was in bad position. Ha! I just can’t get over how awesome Kimmo is!

And you guys are absolutely right. If it were Carcillo on Crosby or Malkin there would be a suspension. Milan Lucic cross-checked a Montreal player in the face and, right fully so, got suspended. With that said it wasn’t that awful and it made what Carcillo did look like a love tap. I at no point call for a suspension for Kunitz’s hit, however, as always, I call for EVEN refereeing. When a player is playing with an intent to injure, however subtle, something must be done. This is where Carcillo would go over, beat Kunitz ass and we’d be done with it.

by Mitchell Green on Apr 20, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions

Letang should hang up the mittens cause Giroux laid an an old fashioned whopping on him. yes, maybe his game doesnt involve toughness and determination. Sykora has no room to talk as well, he sucked it up all over the ice yesterday… teams that are so cocky like this are delusional… you must have a little humility. maybe their point is they felt like they were in the game the whole time. that may be true. And the flyers dictated the pace of the game, true. if the penguins play their game, it’ll probably be only on a powerplay situation… a little help refs, fellas?

by fitzy first on Apr 20, 2009 10:01 AM EDT reply actions

My question is when did Letang get it through his head that he was “one tough hombre” as Pierre McGuire called him during fight. I also think its funny that Letang picks fights with guys like Claude Giroux . . . and still gets his ass kicked.

Its amazing how even Penguins players blame losing on the physical play like they got bullied out on the playground during recess. It didn’t seem like the Penguins were shying away from the rough stuff to me, just getting outplayed, out checked and outscored.

Travis makes a great point in that the Penguins think the Flyers only play them this way. Hellooooo? This is how we play night in and night out. THIS IS HOCKEY! Its not a game for the faint of heart of someone who wants to avoid getting roughed up. Learn a lesson Penguins fans from watching the Flyers and other tough teams play. This is how hockey is supposed to be played; rough, fast, skilled, mean. Sadly, because of teams like Pittsburgh and players like Cindy, the game of hockey has been disrespected and diluted. We as Flyers fans take exception to that . . .

by Mitchell Green on Apr 20, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions

I apologize, I meant Kennedy not Letang, but my comment still stands. What does it matter really? Kennedy and Letang they are both punks. Nothing more . . .

by Mitchell Green on Apr 20, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions

all 4 lines scored yesterday

i love it when this happens.

otherwise, i am going to go as far as to say jones had a better game than coburn.

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by psudrozz on Apr 20, 2009 10:23 AM EDT reply actions

I hate Randy Jones, and while I don’t think he had a better game, Jones has escaped my ire so far because he hasn’t been noticed. Since he isn’t making mistakes, that’s all I can hope for from him. However, Coburn had some great defensive plays, and I’m thinkin of his hit on Staal without a stick in the third period in particular.

Props to Randy Jones for stepping up his game. Seriously.

by Geoff Detweiler on Apr 20, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions

the only real flub coby made was being forechecked and losing the puck on their first goal… maybe there were other moments, cant remember…

by fitzy first on Apr 20, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions

by Jborg10 on Apr 20, 2009 10:31 AM EDT reply actions

they finally played a physical aggressive game but without taking stupid penalties. great game to watch yesterday.

by zerofischer on Apr 20, 2009 10:45 AM EDT reply actions

clowns

I love it…Pitt runs around head hunting but they acuse philly of being goons!!!
What a bunch of losers at least be honest about it.If philly hit Crosby like that the guy would got a major/game misconduct and everybody knows it….

by hapijac01 on Apr 20, 2009 10:52 AM EDT reply actions

phantom penalty in Goonland

The penalty call on Staal early in the first period was an absolute ‘phantom penalty’ which was huge in that it lead to the Flyer’s 2nd goal. Had any Flyer been penalized for that, Flyer Goon Nation would still be screaming and whining about biased refs having it out for them. In fact, Goon Nation is still whining about the Kunitz’ legal hit on Timonen even AFTER they finally WON a playoff game. It’s tough playing the bad ass while constantly whining about unfair penalty calls… Flyer Goon Nation can dish it out but they sure can’t take it!

by Chancewayne on Apr 20, 2009 7:37 PM EDT reply actions

You say there was a phantom penalty in the first period and mention how it was huge in determining the Flyers 2nd goal, but then you ridicule Flyers fans for “whining about unfair penalty calls.”

Talk about a double standard.

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by Travis Hughes on Apr 20, 2009 7:41 PM EDT up reply actions

Actually

You guys seem to dish it out and not take it well, either—see above players’ commentary. Your Pens play our “goon style” as you so eloquently refer to it as well or better than we do these days, but now are crying about how they got drawn into our “style” of play, whatever that means.

There have been phantom penalties throughout this entire series and both teams’ fans have a right to complain. Just terrible officiating all around.

by doubleh on Apr 20, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions

Kunitz hit

There’s a world of difference in my book between the ferocious Kunitz hit and a coach intentionally sending out a goon to take a face-off so he can sucker punch the opposing player with only seconds left in a game with the outcome already decided as per game 1.

by Chancewayne on Apr 20, 2009 7:50 PM EDT reply actions

Sort of like the scrum at the end of yesterday's game

When the Pens’ more aggressive and physical players were on the ice and ended with punches thrown?

Look: the Flyers aren’t the only team with “goons” as you put it. No, the Flyers don’t help themselves by constantly bringing in these Carcillo types (who does have some skill IF they can develop it—no certainty there), but it’s not like they exist in a vacuum. What Carcillo did was wrong, but I’m not so sure it warranted a suspension at the time when the league was letting a much worse situation (Mon/Bos) “play out” as it were—and turns out they did have to suspend someone just yesterday for something way worse than Carcillo did.

by doubleh on Apr 20, 2009 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions

They haven’t been scoring on the PP, and Crosby’s been fairly quiet, but that’s what bothers me. I can’t see Crosby doing this year what Malkin did last, so I have to put a lot of faith into Timonen, Coburn, Parent, and Jones. They played an outstanding game on Sunday, and they absolutely need to do so again, more so than any of our forwards, to a certain degree.

And yes, I don’t see anyone backing off either. It could make for a phenomenal first round series, but this is the kind of series that should be saved for the ECFs or the SCFs.

by CTFlyer on Apr 21, 2009 3:00 PM EDT reply actions