End of an Era (or something): Randy Jones to be waived
by Travis Hughes on Sep 25, 2009 6:02 PM EDT
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Multiple sources are reporting that Philadelphia Flyers defenseman Randy Jones will be put on waivers by the team in the next 24 hours. Tim Panaccio of CSN Philly, Frank Seravalli of the Philadelphia Daily News, and Anthony SanFillippo of the Delaware County Times have all reported the news out of Voorhees this afternoon, although the exact time when Jones could be released varies depending on which report you read. Some say it could go down tonight, while some say it could happen tomorrow.
The consensus is clear though -- Jones will not be a Flyer by the end of the weekend. He was on the ice at practice today, though, and afterward, he said he wasn't nervous about his seemingly bleak future with the orange and black.
"It hasn't happened, so why think about it?" Jones said. "Until it happens, that's the only reaction I can give you." Of course, this really isn't his fault. Jones has felt the scorn of Flyers fans ever since signing a two-year contract extension in July 2008, but every single one of us would take $2.5 or $3 million if it were offered to us, regardless of whether we're worth that much or not.
Jones suffered a hip injury that limited him to just 47 games last season, but in his time on the ice, he never showed any promise of being worth his $2.75 million cap hit. Here's how our own Geoff Detweiler summarized Jones in our Grading the Flyers series this past offseason:
This year should be his last in a Flyers uniform. He is getting paid far too much for the type of player he is, and the team has far cheaper options in the minor leagues - Danny Syvret, Oskars Bartulis, and to a lesser extent Marc-Andre Bourdon and Michael Ratchuk - that should be ready to step up next year. With the team needing to resign Braydon Coburn and Ryan Parent after this year, Jones' $2.75 million will go a long way to off-setting that cost.
In this training camp, however, the Flyers have clearly noticed a stronger urgency to clear that cap space sooner. With the emergence of James van Riemsdyk, Mika Pyorala, and Blair Betts, the team needs to find a way to squeeze these guys onto the roster. With Danny Svyret showing some promise in camp and Ole-Kristian Tollefsen getting better, the organization is hoping that the hole created by Jones' departure will be filled satisfactorily.
Therefore Jones, in an ironic twist of fate, becomes a victim of his own contract. In waiving the sixth year pro, the Flyers gain, as Geoff mentioned, $2.75 million in under the salary cap. Tollefsen and Svyret combined will impact the salary cap less than that. Expect one of those guys to become Flyers, while any combination of Betts, Pyorala, and van Riemsdyk should also be added to the roster. The added flexibility given by waiving Jones really does solve all the Flyers current salary cap issues.
If Jones is claimed off of waivers, he will become property of the other team, the Flyers will get nothing for him, and his cap hit will go to the other team. If he clears waivers, the Flyers will assign him to Adirondack, where he will likely get the "Denis Gauthier treatment". Gauthier was placed on waivers -- ironically it was so the Flyers could call up Jones -- by Philadelphia prior to the 2007-08 season and when he cleared, he was assigned to the Phantoms. He played 78 games there before finally being traded by to Los Angeles the following summer.
If called back up, Gauthier would have been subject to re-entry waivers and if claimed, the Flyers would've been responsible for a portion of his cap hit and waiving him in the first place would've been a moot point. It's the same situation with Jones. If he clears waivers, don't expect the Flyers to call him back up this season. He'll either be traded or he'll spend the entire season in upstate New York.
There is a chance a team could claim him off of waivers, though. It's not as if Jones has zero upside. He has had success -- albeit limited -- in the past and could help out a team that is thin on defense. Also, a team could take a chance and hope that his poor play is just an effect of his hip injury. With his contract up after this season, Jones isn't a huge risk for a team that has enough cap space to accommodate him.
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Two steps forward, one step back…
Are the Flyers trying to improve their defense, or not? They now have two first pair defensemen, a couple mediocre second pair defensemen, and three guys who are barely third pair defensemen.
Jones is a #4 Dman in the NHL. Now, when Pronger or Timmonen are out of the lineup, the blue line is worse than it was last season. The goaltending is worse than it was last season. And the scoring is, hopefully, equal to last season.
Just a stupid, regrettable move unless there is another good, veteran, dman the Flyers are going to acquire in the next couple weeks.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 5:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
what Flyers games are you watching?
Randy Jones may be a #4 Dman on some NHL teams, but he is not a #4 Dman on THIS team. He is a #6 Dman on this team, and you don’t let a #6 Dman have a $2.75 million cap hit.
OKT and Syvret are servicable, plus there are a few options on the Phantoms that could deserve a call up by mid-season. If a long-term injury to one of the top 3 happens, Randy Jones would still not be the answer.
by SanDiegoScraps on Sep 25, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Randy Jones may be a #4 Dman on some NHL teams, but he is not a #4 Dman on THIS team
That’s exactly my point. You have to pay a player his value in the market, not his value to your particular team.
Randy Jones in his last healthy season was the answer when both Coburn and Timmo went down. He and Hatch played out of their heads in that series. Jones was poised for a breakout year, then injured his hip, had training camp on the fly, and was paired with Andrew Alberts, who he had to learn how to play with.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have to pay a player his value in the market, not his value to your particular team.
I disagree. If I am a GM – I want my #6 dman to have a #6 dman cap hit. Not a #4 dman cap hit…
Randy Jones got his big contract b/c of how he performed when Timmo and Coburn went down – and I agree – he filled in admirably, and before last season, I was excited about Randy Jones.
I will even give him a wash for most of last season and chalk it up to injury. However, he obviously is either 1) still not 100% or 2) not as good as we hoped and still not on track for that “breakout year” because he is sucking up the preseason. (Otherwise, they wouldn’t be looking to waive him).
Regardless – his $2.75 mil cap hit is doing more harm than he can do good…
by SanDiegoScraps on Sep 25, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you want a #6 dman as your #6 dman, sure.
But that brings us back to my original point: The Flyers plan was to build a strong blue line. They are going to have a top pairing Dman on their second pair. Then you put a second pairing Dman on your third pair and that’s how you get an above average blue line corps.
Only paying for guys who belong in the position they are playing gets you an average team.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ok I'll agree with that
I guess I should have stated that I wouldn’t mind paying Randy Jones’ salary/cap hit if he played like a #4 dman – which he didn’t last season (even if it was due to injury) and hasn’t performed up to the standard his contract demands so far this preseason.
If my # 6 dman is getting paid like a #4 and he plays like a #4 – I’m okay with that. It is when my #6 dman is getting paid like a #4 and yet still plays like a #6 (or worse) that I am not okay with.
by SanDiegoScraps on Sep 25, 2009 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we lose Timonen and Pronger we have a worse defense than last year? No shit man.
Your whole post doesn’t take into account what we gain out of moving Jones.
by SJPhillyVT on Sep 25, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I said Timmo OR Pronger and both players WILL MISS GAMES this season. And, given their age and history, may even miss playoff games.
Pronger’s last three season: 82gp, 72gp, 66gp. Kimmo has been more reliable in the regular season, mising only five games last year and no more than five the last five seasons. But he also was lost in the 2007-08 playoffs and is getting older and his body beat down as well.
The fact is, we can expect, easily, 10-15 mangames lost to injury between Kimmo and Pronger this season. When you count expected games lost by Carle and Coburn, you’re gonna probably need someone to fill in those two “shutdown” pairings for at least 1/4 of the season. Jones can do that. Danny Syvret cannot.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you are out of your mind if you think jones can come close to shuting down anyone as a #1 or 2 dman, he looks terrible if he plays 15 minutes he will look even worse when you get him up in 20 minutes or more. he is way over paid and any other option on this depth chart is a better option.
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The 2007-08 Eastern Conference Finals beg to differ.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
your really basing your views on his abilities on one series? a series we lost in 5 games
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its the only time he’s ever been asked to shutdown a top line in his career, so: yes, I am.
The result of that series is about as relevant as his astrological sign is to this conversation.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
then at what point was he so good to make you think he can step up and be a top pairing dman. he wasnt even relied upon then as top pair smith and hatcher were the top 2 dmen left and even that waste of space modry. and them losing the series is relevant because he was not even good then and is not capable of playing more then 12-15 minutes a night which is not someone that deserves 2.75 million
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
at what point during that series i mean.
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let me just set your facts straight, which will demonstrate why you’re wrong.
In that series, with Coburn and Timmo injured, these were the defensive pairings:
Hatch-Jones
Smith-Kukkonen
Modry-Parent
Jones TOI in that series were:
19:46
26:14
24:51
26:04
20:59
None of those were overtime games, all only 60 minutes of play.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
just because he played more then 20 minutes doesnt mean he should or is really capable of competing at that level for over 20 minutes a night. cobourn played the first game which is why he played less then 20 and kimmo played the last which is why they are down again. 3 games on a first pairing does not qualify you as someone that is so great like your making him out to be. and are you sure about those pairings? have you watched stevens coach he changes lines left and right that may have been the base for those whole 3 games but was not always the case
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m sure about the pairings. They were what I remembered, then I pulled the box scores and the TOI clearly corresponds to those having been the pairings.
so great like your making him out to be
I said he’s #4 dman in the nhl…
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha
seriously? Randy Jones is a #4 Dman? what Jones are you watching? he is 6 at best and way overpaid for that. and i know we all appreciate you mentioning how if our #1 and #2 dmen go down that we will be worse because none of us knew that before this so thank you. Cobourn is a great #3 carle is a decent #4 and parent is a fine #5. as for #6 id rather see how OTK or syvret do then have to watch any more of randy jones.
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 5:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
OTK who can’t stay healthy and a guy who’s never played an NHL game. Paired with a kid (Parent) who has only played 50 NHL games. Awesome plan.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Syvret has 28 regrettable games in the NHL (-12, one assist), but he had 57 points and was a plus 7 on the Phantoms last year. Asking him to play 10-14 minutes a night in the NHL isn’t going kill the team.
It’s definitely an uncertainty, but I’m not a big fan of “the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t” since, who says Syvret can’t play in the NHL? We KNOW Jones is inconsistent, and downright scary last year. So, thank you Jones for your one good playoff series, but it’s not worth it. This allows us to keep JVR, Betts, and Pyorala – if we so choose.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 25, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Read my 2:48 PDT post above this on why
Asking him to play 10-14 minutes a night in the NHL isn’t going kill the team.is an pretty big underestimation of how much they’re asking of him.
There are a ton fo reasons for Jones’ 2008-09 season to be considered an anomaly.
I thought syvret was just one of the Phantoms prospects, off to hockeyreference to learn about him…
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what reasons are there? is it because of his outstanding career that he had up to that point
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As I posted above, Jones played in May 2008 in the playoffs, then didn’t play again until December 21, 2008.
At that point, he was basically in training camp, but on an NHL roster.
And he had a new partner (previously his partner was Hatch) who wasn’t even on the team the last time he skated.
Finally, he was playing hurt all of last season.
Jones underwent hip surgery in the summer of ‘08 and missed about half the season. When he came back, he still didn’t feel right but played anyway.
When the season ended he went back to Nashville and had a second procedure performed by specialist Dr. Thomas Byrd. This time Jones believes the problem has been completely solved.
…
“Last year, each and every stride felt like there was a knife sticking in there, a sharp pain,” he said. “Right now it’s not there at all. I’m skating with a lot more power.”
That’s why last season should be seen as a setback, not his natural progression.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jones alone is a bit of an anomaly. When grading him, I called him Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. He does things that are good, then he does things that are really bad. I accept that he was hurt last year, but let’s go back to the two years prior:
06-07: 2.36 GFON/60; 3.75 GAON/60 (qualcomp -0.04, qualteam -0.05)
07-08: 2.73 GFON/60; 2.42 GAON/60 (qualcomp -0.05, qualteam -0.09)
08-09: 2.77 GFON/60; 2.41 GAON/60 (qualcomp -0.01, qualteam -0.01)
He’s gotten better every year, but yet his best year (last year), he was third worst in PTS/60, despite being on the ice for 2.77 GF/60. Also, having a decent GAON/60 was counteracted by giving up nearly 33 shots on net per 60 minutes, and 14 missed shots per 60 minutes. Combined, opponents were firing seven more shots per game on net when Jones was on the ice than when he wasn’t. When the play is in your end more than when anybody else is on the ice, and the opponent is shooting at the net more than they are when you are off the ice, what exactly are you doing to help the team?
Broad Street Hockey -
Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 25, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what exactly are you doing to help the team?
Keeping Lasse Kukkonen in the press box?
Setting salary numbers aside, just reading what you posted and anything else you know about his play, do you truly believe OTK or Syvret are going to have a better season than Jones would?
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
First of all, yes, I believe that OTK and Syvret will make up just fine for the loss we encounter by waiving Jones.
But after all, the real question is: Do we want to have Jones as our #6 Dman or do we want to have JVR as a top 9 forward on our roster. That’s the question it all comes down to.
Looking at Jones’ history and JVR’s preseason impressions, for me, it’s not a tough decision.
And, just another thing to keep in mind:
Pronger averaged almost 27 minutes of ice time last season. Kimmo and Coburn, who are expected to be our second pairing, averaged over 24 minutes. So what’s left for our third pairing?
9-10 minutes?
If we had the cap space for it, sure, let’s go for Jones (at least he’s on a contract year, so you never know…)
But having to choose between an overpaid #6 Dman (with two serviceable backups in place) or a top-9 forward (with carcillo as backup), it’s a no-brainer for me!
Plus, I like the idea of dealing him to the Rangers (as mentioned in some article today). Imagine Briere, Giroux and JVR as our third line playing against Jones…
by sudhaus on Sep 25, 2009 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Straight up, no. OKT and Syvret are unlikely to have as good of seasons as Jones would. But this is largely about salary numbers. If Jones was getting paid as much as Coburn, he wouldn’t be waived. The team could then afford to keep whoever they wanted, since they’d have the financial flexibility to do so. Since he isn’t, and they therefore don’t, being able to afford Pyorala and JVR, plus Syvret/OKT should be at least equal to, but likely better than, Jones and one of Pyorala or JVR.
Broad Street Hockey -
Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 25, 2009 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Straight up, no. OKT and Syvret are unlikely to have as good of seasons as Jones would.
I can appreciate that Holmgren’s job is very complicated. But this is my point:
After an offseason of consciously weakening the offense to improve the defense, now Holmgren is going to weaken the defense by cutting Jones so that fucking JVR (congrats to him for finally last night playing a game and not being on the ice for a goal against) and Pyoralla can stay with the big club?
For this season, this equation doesn’t look balanced to me:
Knuble, Lupol, Sbisa, Jones
for
Pronger, JVR, Pyoralla, OTK, and Syvret
Remember, there are two reasons to improve the blue line:
1) It sucked last year
2) Improving the blue line to make up for the drop off from Biron to Emery
Waiving Randy Jones hurts the blue line in order to put a defensively poor rookie winger on the team. How is that consistent with either the offseason plan or the needs of this team?
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Like I said in the VUKOTA projections, the drop off from Jones to Syvret isn’t as bad as you expect. The difference is only 2.2 GVT, and it’s even less on the defensive side – 1.5 GVT. Over 82 games, that’s minimal. That can be offset by simply having Claude Giroux play in 14 extra games (bring his total to 66. Or just having Riley Cote NOT play in 73 games. When you look at the defense as a whole, it certainly did get better – swap Alberts for Pronger, and Syvret for Jones. Huge increase, minimal loss.
And to answer your last question, “defensively poor winger” (although not a rookie) was Joffrey Lupul. And your equation is improperly weighted. You can’t add in Knuble, since if we got rid of Jones earlier, who’s to say we wouldn’t have been able to resign him? Free agent losses are unfair to use in this analogy. Especially when you think Knuble’s cap hit is $2.8 million, while Jones’ is $2.75 million. If we had waived Jones in June, maybe we spend that money on Knuble instead.
So, Lupul, Sbisa, and Jones
for
Pronger, JVR, Pyorala, and Syvret
looks excellent to me.
Broad Street Hockey -
Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 26, 2009 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the drop off from Jones to Syvret isn’t as bad as you expect.
I guess this is beating a dead horse, but… Vukota doesn’t take into account the intangibles as to why Jones had an aberational season last year. I believe Jones will far exceed his Vukota projection.
You can’t add in Knuble
I’m criticizing Holmgren’s roster management, so I can include Knuble.*
Nothing prevented Holmgren from signing Knuble in July. He just would’ve had to clear space under the cap by the end of next week, which releasing Jones would do.
But in July, the plan was to improve the D. Now, reportedly, Holmgren has changed course.
- - I wouldn’t have resigned Knuble, by the way, for sure. Getting old, takes too many penalties, and the Caps are retarded for giving him all that money. But this season he’s certainly the best of the four forwards we’re discussing.
by MarioDi on Sep 26, 2009 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
wow- you guys are seriously going at it over a clown like jonesy, segway into future nothing Syvret… does anybody miss meyer or Seidenberg- how about delmore for that matter… no… they are all clowns!
no disrespect, thanks jonesy for your time with the flyers
by fitzy first on Sep 26, 2009 4:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seidenberg is a solid second pairing dman. He went to the conference finals with Carolina last season and will make $2.25m with the Panthers this season. He’s a good player.
Meyer is on the last year of a contract with the Isles, on the official site they project him as being on the third pairing this season. He’s a depth player at the NHL level.
Delmore, after two seasons in Germany, was signed by the Detroit Red Wings, who have a pretty good eye for talent, to a two way deal.
by MarioDi on Sep 26, 2009 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve always liked Seidenberg. Also liked St. Jacques, so whatever that means. But Seidenberg is definitely the best of those three.
Broad Street Hockey -
Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 26, 2009 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Biron to Emery is an upgrade, not a dropoff
by JpH89 on Sep 26, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please attempt to use logic and facts to justify your position. I need a good laugh.
by MarioDi on Sep 26, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Emery has been consistent and very strong in net for a few years now. Remember that he was not banished to Russian leagues for lack of talent. He was sent out of the NHL for being a head case (which even he has acknowledged). Whether he’s an upgrade or not, remains to be seen. I guess we’ll know in a few weeks. But historically, he’s very consistent and much cheaper than Biron. Emery could very easily become the steal of the off-season.
If they had the cap room, Biron would most likely still be around. I thought he did very well here in Philly, and enjoyed his time.
by Mike B on D on Sep 26, 2009 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And now for something completely different...
Since when did Philly become so forgiving we’re giving everyone a second chance? Between Emery and Vick, they may start thinking we’re a nice town…
by Mike B on D on Sep 26, 2009 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if they had the cap room i still think that we would of signed Emery, but he would of split with Marty.
by JpH89 on Sep 26, 2009 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Remember that he was not banished to Russian leagues for lack of talent.
No no, he was untouched by NHL teams because he put up this stellar season in 2007-08:
3.13 GAA, .890 save percentage
And lost his job to MARTIN GERBER.
But historically, he’s very consistent and much cheaper than Biron
I have no idea what your definition of “consistency” could possibly be. Emery’s only played 40 or more games in one NHL season. Look at his career stats:
2002-03: 3gp
2003-04: 3gp
2005-06: 39gp, 2.82, 90.2%
2006-07: 58gp, 2.47, 91.8%
2007-08: 31gp, 3.13, 89%
That is not a “history” of anything. Also, he’s not cheaper than Biron, it’s the same price.
Again, if Holmgren would’ve decided in July that he would waive Jones and his $3m hit, they could’ve signed both Knuble and Biron.
by MarioDi on Sep 27, 2009 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreeing with most of that, except for the fact that the team wanted to sign a goalie, and Biron would not have signed for as much as he did early in free agency. It took how long for him to realize his worth was as low as Emery’s?
Broad Street Hockey -
Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 27, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But if Holmgren was planning to waive Jones and free up the $3m in cap space, he should’ve kept in contact with Biron’s new agent and signed him when Marty’s price came down to $1.5m.
Again, I’m criticizing Holmgren’s lack of sticking to a plan for the last four months.
by MarioDi on Sep 27, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would Marty’s price ever come down to $1.5m? What leverage do you have? “Oh, that’s fine if you don’t sign for that amount, Brian Boucher will just be our starter?” Holmgren would have no starting goaltender and Biron would quickly become the only option, so why would Marty’s agent come down to Holmgren’s terms?
by Ben Feldman on Sep 27, 2009 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are you talking about?
First off, if Marty didn’t sign in my scenario, they’d be exactly where they are right now: With Emery and Boucher.
Second, Marty’s price DID come down to $1.5m. That’s what he signed for. So your “what if” makes no sense…
by MarioDi on Sep 28, 2009 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because Emery has shown before that he can be a consistent starting goalie in the NHL, where Marty can look amazing some games and then looks like an AHL backup the next. Emery wasn’t sent to the KHL because of talent, but more of the fact that he was a cocky towards his coaches and teammates(though i would assume it was because he was on something, which was said that a good amount of players from that Ottawa team went to some kind of rehab). I did like Marty, but assuming that Razor can play a full “healthy” season should result in better goaltending.
by JpH89 on Sep 26, 2009 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, Emery has barely played one season as a starting goaltender. He has shown no consistency whatsoever over his career.
Emery has never in his life played a “full” NHL season.
by MarioDi on Sep 27, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i didnt realize that whoever replaces jones was automatically paired with parent…i apologize
by Eric10689 on Sep 25, 2009 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s not being released, he’s being waives. It’s impossible to just release a player. If he’s waived and picked up by another team, then we’re off the hook for his cap hit. If he clears waivers and isn’t picked up, then he’s sent to the Phantoms and can’t be recalled unless he goes through re-entry waivers, exactly like Gauthier two seasons ago.
by SJPhillyVT on Sep 25, 2009 5:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, generally speaking released = waived. I changed the title though just to avoid any confusion.
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by Travis Hughes on Sep 25, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They’re pretty not equal. Someone can be waived and end up still on the team.
by SJPhillyVT on Sep 25, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well aware of that. I’m not saying you’re wrong, hence why I changed it.
Broad Street Hockey - SB Nation's Philadelphia Flyers Blog. Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Travis Hughes on Sep 25, 2009 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I only wish we traded him over the summer. Im sure we tried but no one took the bait.
by Prometheus74 on Sep 25, 2009 9:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
While Parent is only a “#5” defenseman, he showed great chemistry with Timonnen last year, lets just say our pairings look something like this:
Timonnen-Parent
Pronger-Carle (apparently theyve been clicking in preseason?)
Coburn-OKT/Syvret.
looks pretty damn solid and balanced to me. I don’t see us missing Randy Jones anytime soon. Granted we dont have much depth in case of injury however it boils down to what all the other posters have been saying…would you rather pay one guy 2.5 mil to add depth or would you pay a couple of promising new players (JVR, Betts, Pyorala) peanuts to fill out the forward positions. Nevermind what we gain by adding cap flexibility
by njh3293 on Sep 25, 2009 9:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
This is all kinds of wrong.
First off, they’ve spoken repeatedly about two shutdown pairings, Timmo/Coburn and Pronger/Carle. They don’t want balance, they want two top pairs.
Second, Parent is a #6 right now, he still hasn’t played a full NHL season and while he’s shown a lot of potential, he hasn’t realized much of it at all. If he regresses this year, this team is fucked.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since when Di? Whatever happened to D?
I didn’t know where else to ask
by Alon on Sep 26, 2009 3:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The other account was through OpenID. Im out of town and when I try to log in, I get an error about OpenID not being able to connect… so I had to open a new account.
by MarioDi on Sep 26, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
even if Parent regresses then he is still only a “number 6” defenseman. I wouldn’t say a team is fucked if it has one defenseman who isn’t necessarily a stud. If parent really sucks it up (no reason to believe that will happen) finding a serviceable 6th defenseman won’t be very hard. Especially with the cap space created by getting rid of Jones. We picked Andrew Alberts up out of the scrap yard and I think he did a pretty decent job in his role.
you can make the argument that the flyers dont have depth on defense, but you dont get depth by overpaying, you get it when your young players step up and show they can handle NHL responsibilities. by getting rid of Jones we free up cap space to fill the thinnest part of our roster-the wings.
by njh3293 on Sep 26, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone else catch this:
In Panotch’s article about Jones, he said this:
Waiving Jones would imply the Flyers want to sign Blair Betts and carry both rookie James van Riemsdyk and Finnish winger Mika Pyorala on their roster.
My question is, why? Asham, Betts, Briere, Carcillo, Carter, Cote, Gagne, Giroux, Hartnell, Laperriere, Powe, Pyorala, Richards, van Riemsdyk. That’s 14, meaning two people sit every game. Presumably, that would be Cote and either Asham, Powe, or Pyorala. It’s definitely nice to have two of those guys sitting in the press box in case of need, but… don’t you want them on the ice somewhere?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Sep 25, 2009 11:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
You have to remember, its been a while since the Flyers had this problem… the Phantoms are now in Glens Falls, NY and not across the parking lot. They can’t just call someone up at 5pm anymore, it’s gonna take a day to get a player up from the AHL.
by MarioDi on Sep 25, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
First sign
My doubts about Jones started when Freddy Meyer was waived from the Islanders and Alexandre Picard was traded for an expiring contract. I always grouped them together because they all got unplanned but significant playing time during the horrible 06-07 season. I thought the team traded Picard because they didn’t even think he could be anything more than a #6, and they’d rather give the 1st defenseman callup spot to someone with more potential.
Jones’s performance in the playoffs two years ago was admirable and elevated him above the other two, but he got paid to be on the second defense pair because the Flyers didn’t have anyone better at the time. But injuries forced the team to get Carle and let Parent, who is 6 years younger, get some NHL experience. I think it’s more important that he was the least important guy whose salary would have a significant effect on the cap was more important than that he’s overpaid for his role.
by thasmin on Sep 26, 2009 2:05 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It’s just too bad we dumped guys like Seidenberg and company just to keep this guy, and for what? a couple years of not too much
by fitzy first on Sep 26, 2009 4:04 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
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Atlantic Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
New Jersey
|
58 | 36 | 20 | 2 | 74 |
|
Pittsburgh
|
59 | 35 | 22 | 2 | 72 |
|
Philadelphia
|
57 | 29 | 25 | 3 | 61 |
|
New York Rangers
|
59 | 26 | 26 | 7 | 59 |
|
New York Islanders
|
58 | 23 | 27 | 8 | 54 |
(updated 2.9.2010 at 12:41 AM EST)
Flyers Schedule
Next 5 Games
|
@
New Jersey
|
Wed 02/10 | 7:00 PM EST |
|
Montreal
|
Fri 02/12 | 6:00 PM EST |
|
@
Montreal
|
Sat 02/13 | 7:00 PM EST |
|
@
Tampa Bay
|
Tue 03/02 | 7:30 PM EST |
|
@
Florida
|
Wed 03/03 | 7:30 PM EST |
Last 5 Games
|
New Jersey
|
Mon 02/08 | W 3 - 2 |
|
@
Minnesota
|
Sat 02/06 | L 1 - 2 |
|
@
Edmonton
|
Wed 02/03 | L 0 - 1 |
|
@
Calgary
|
Mon 02/01 | W 3 - 0 |
|
New York Islanders
|
Sat 01/30 | W 2 - 1 |
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