Report: Flyers release Bill Guerin
by Travis Hughes on Oct 4, 2010 11:47 AM EDT
in Philadelphia Flyers News
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He seemed like such a lock. From his affable persona in the locker room to his now-curious inclusion on CSN's annual Meet The Flyers program, everybody thought Bill Guerin would be a Flyer when they started the season against his old team, the Penguins, on Thursday.
But it didn't happen. According to CSN Philly, Guerin has been released from his professional tryout. The almost-40-year-old told Tim Panaccio via a text message this morning. The Flyers have an off-day from practice today, so we likely won't be hearing anything official on this until tomorrow, at least from the coaching staff.
So, was this the right move? After it seemed so certain early in camp that Guerin would be here, the news slowly came out that Guerin was not exactly impressing the coaches. The young guys, such as Andreas Nodl, Mike Testwuide and Ben Holmstrom were apparently more impressive, as were some vets who were considered on the edge, such as Dan Carcillo and perhaps even Darroll Powe.
The moves aren't done -- the Flyers still have cuts to make and a young guy or two could still make the team. With Ian Laperriere's absent, it appears that at least one of them will make the team. But Guerin won't be one of those guys.
Where will he go from here? Retirement? A seat on the couch, waiting for a call? All we do know is that the call won't come from Paul Holmgren.
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And Andrej Meszaros
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Oct 4, 2010 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
We can’t do that at this point .. that’s just throwing a 2nd round pick away for nothing. He’s still young, he’s never played in the left wing lock, and with Walker off the roster we’d be fine for salary room. He doesn’t have to play on the first or even the second defensive pair, and if/when he does he’ll benefit from having guys like Pronger and Timonen to teach him how to be competent defensively.
that’s just throwing a 2nd round pick away for nothing.
While I agree, it has been done before…
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
I just can’t see it happening at this point. After one season, if he truly remains poor, then I could see it. But they obviously saw something they liked to go out and acquire this guy with his hefty salary on a salary-strapped team for a 2nd round pick. I don’t think a mediocre preseason is going to get him cut.
Oh, it’s definitely not happening. And I wouldn’t even argue that he should be waived. But man, he has been less than impressive.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s sad. We’ll have to see how he pans out over the course of the year but it seems like from what Tampa people were saying we should have expected this. If the fans knew it and Yzerman was aching to get rid of him, what did our FO see?
Whatever the case I’m pretty excited to see the final roster makeup.
He’s still young
And still terrible. He’s a slightly less expensive Wade Redden.
Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"
by Ed Van Chimp on Oct 4, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
If Meszos is waived, the team would be stuck with Walker or Bartulis, maybe both. Meszos has disappointed so far, but he’s far better than Walker or Bartulis.
by memphisbrando on Oct 4, 2010 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
He’s been a disappointment in preseason, sure. But let’s give him a few months in the regular season before we call him an unequivocally awful defenseman. We sound a bit like Eagles fans freaking out in August on WIP right now.
Give him a chance. Maybe he’ll be terrible, maybe he’ll surprise. But a few preseason games is far from a large enough sample size to make a judgment on his fit with the team.
I just scanned the twitterspere and didn’t see anything about this.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
PHilabright just tweeted it.
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Oct 4, 2010 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Just b/c there is loving, doesn’t mean they are making the team. Remember that Guerin guy. So yes, even witht he Bob love, I thought if Backlund was healthy, he’d be here.
I’m still not comfortable with Bob, he has only played a handful on preseason games in the NHL.
So to reiterate my answer to your question: YES. And I believe I’m included in anyone…
Is this the right room for an argument?
I don’t know. I have not seen anything in the preseason personally. I am just going off what I am reading and they seem high on him.
I was already reading about waviers today (and bear with me on this one). Apparently once you clear waivers for the year you don’t have the clear them again if you get called up as long as you don’t spend 30 days on the NHL roster or play 10 games (might be slightly different with a goalie).
I don’t know if they are thinking like this, but if the Flyers wave him now and he clears now (which the though that it would less likely for a team to pick him up; not too many teams need a backup atm) and then you can recall him and send Bobrasky down before his roster bonus kicks in since he won’t need to clear. Now you have your emergency backup clearing waivers and you have a stop gap with bob in case of an immediate emergency.
It makes sense, but I don’t give Homer credit to be thinking that far ahead.
Interesting thought, I’m not sure how it works. I’m just saying, I really thought Backlund would be backing up Boosh if he was healthy when Leights went down. Just figured he was more of a known entity to the Flyers than Bob. But that is interesting…if I wasn’t at work, I’d research it more, but since I am, I’ll just go with you on this one.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Where did you read this:
Apparently once you clear waivers for the year you don’t have the clear them again if you get called up as long as you don’t spend 30 days on the NHL roster or play 10 games (might be slightly different with a goalie).
I’m not at all saying you’re wrong – that much specificity has to be grounded in some sort of fact – but I’d like to read it myself.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know how up-to-date it is, but I read it here:
- Every year is treated as a new year with respect to waivers – so a player who was waived [and cleared] in 2006-07 and was not recalled at any point during the season will have to re-clear waivers to be assigned in 2007-08.
- If a player cleared waivers and is subsequently recalled during the same year, he does not have to clear waivers again unless he has either played 10 or more NHL games or has spent 30 or more days on an NHL roster since last clearing. Otherwise, he will have to re-clear waivers to be assigned.
http://www.nhlscap.com/waivers.htm
Honestly I have not read all the way though the page just because I am at work. Also I didn’t look into how re-entry waivers works yet for the same reason.
From the CBA:
Subject to the provisions of this Article, the rights to the services of a
Player may be Loaned to a club of another league, upon fulfillment of the following
conditions, except when elsewhere expressly prohibited:
(a) Regular Waivers were requested and cleared during the Playing Season
Waiver Period; and
(b) the Player has not played in ten (10) or more NHL Games cumulative
since Regular Waivers on him were last cleared, and more than thirty (30) days
cumulative on an NHL roster have not passed since Regular Waivers on him were last
cleared.
I read this as: he doesn’t have to clear REGULAR waivers again, but he does indeed have to clear re-entry waivers if the Flyers want to bring him back up. 13.3 says pretty clearly that a guy who requires Regular Waivers must go through re-entry waivers.
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by Travis Hughes on Oct 4, 2010 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I think what you’re quoting carries. So, if the Flyers decided to waive Riley Cote two weeks after he cleared waivers (around the trading deadline), he could just be sent to the Phantoms then without going on waviers.
In other words, if he clears waivers October 3rd and the club doesn’t reassign him (carrying him on the NHL roster), he can be sent down to the Phantoms without having to be waived on November 1st, after playing 9 games for the Flyers.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
If your uncomfortable with Bob, what makes Backlund any better? Hes not any more proven.
Flyers 10-11 season slogan: "Remember Emery?"
2,491 minutes against North American shooters compared to 0.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions
against AHL’ers though……
I know you ride Backlund, I know I ride players that most people hate(Carcillo, Zherdev, Leighton, Boosh, Powe to name a few) but I’ll admit that Im open for improvement on all those guys. You just seem hell-bent on making sure that your right and that the organization is dumb.
Flyers 10-11 season slogan: "Remember Emery?"
I don’t think Geoff is saying the organization’s dumb here. All he is saying is that with Backlund, you have a more “proven” commodity. This is not to say that Backlund is better than Bob, but Backlund has gone through the growing pains adjusting to the NA game, where as Bob has not yet, and maybe he never will b/c he is that good. You asked the question of why Backlund is more proven, and both Geoff and I have the same answer. Neither of those answers bash the organization, and both of those answers address your question with a simple and factual response.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Im just saying that I want the guy who has played better on the team. At best, I would consider both players at the same level, where Bob has more upside. Backlund hasnt impressed at all really, he was an average goalie in the AHL last year, and has looked shaky at best against NHL level talent. Bob has at least looked decent against NHL level talent. Therefore, the decision should be easy, and it was if the organization made him the #2 so fast.
Flyers 10-11 season slogan: "Remember Emery?"
in a perfect world
If Leighton was healthy, I’d start him over anybody, and Bob is in the AHL starting. If Backlund wasnt hurt, and played somewhat good, I would have liked him to be our backup. But, with Boosh as our starter(which is already kinda pathetic) and Backlund looking like he did last night, I’d rather have the better looking goalie as my backup. cause if Boosh stumbles, and we put in Backlund, then were screwed for the year If Leighton cant come back.
Flyers 10-11 season slogan: "Remember Emery?"
Again, you aren’t really getting my point, he is the more known commodity of the two not that he is necessarily better or has more upside. For me, it’s too tough to tell who is better, but I know much more about Backlund in NA than Bob, so for my back up for the Flyers this season, I’d prefer Backlund.
It’s find to say you prefer Bob, he has been impressive, I just prefer what I have more information on for my back up.
Also, in the preseason, a goalie is not facing exactly “NHL level” talent either.
Just saying.
Is this the right room for an argument?
I’m not saying I’m right at all. In the Backlund thread, I said this was the right decision.
But to say Backlund is not any more proven than Bobrovsky has 2,491 minutes against North American skaters in your way. You may differentiate between the NHL and the AHL – and there certainly is a difference – but you also have to differentiate between the KHL and North American hockey. Especially since Paul Holmgren, Johan Backlund, John Stevens, Jeff Reese, Ray Emery, and Sergei Bobrovsky all admit that it takes time to adjust from the KHL to playing in North America.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Did Backlund play in the KHL? I thought he played in the Swedish league.
But my point above stands, with our goalie situation right now, I’d rather have the better playing goalie in the NHL. Lets face it, no matter what, this team will be a decent contender after this season, but we have the best chance of winning now then later. again, IMO, Bob is less of a risk then Backlund.
Flyers 10-11 season slogan: "Remember Emery?"
Backlund has not played in the KHL, but that’s not the point since neither has Jeff Reese. Instead, all those individuals admit that a transition needs to be made to the North American style of play, something Bobrovsky has not done yet.
I’d rather have the better playing goalie in the NHL.
How do you know who the better goalie is? You have seen Sergei Bobrovsky play 205 minutes against semi-NHL, semi-AHL competition, in a semi-full speed hockey game. You have seen him make 92 saves in this situation.
He’s tied for 8th in the NHL with a 0.939 save percentage after those 205 minutes. You know who he’s tied with? Brian Boucher. Who has a career 0.900 save percentage. Mike Smith is in 4th in the NHL with a 0.961 save percentage. He has a career 0.907 save percentage.
The point? Mike Smith is not a better goaltender than Ryan Miller, nor is Brian Boucher a better goaltender than Henrik Lundqvist. But these preseason games suggest otherwise. Maybe we can’t rely on such a small sample size?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re totally right, it’s not like he spent last year in the Flyers organization being the only bright spot on a horrible Phantoms team…
Oh wait he was…that must be where I’m getting it from.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Again, hes proven that hes an above average AHL starter. But he hasnt done anything to warrant an NHL job. I just want to know what hes possibly done to deserve a spot?
Flyers 10-11 season slogan: "Remember Emery?"
Well, the question here is not just dessert. It’s a matter of relative merit. Backlund has done more to warrant his inclusion—that’s indisputable. Whether you value that more than Bobo’s upside is something different, but it’s still a matter a relativity.
Somebody help me out, I’m not good with cap stuff and contracts and rules… (I should work in the front office!)
Was this something we HAD to do so that Backlund could play for the Phantoms this year? Or is this some sort of stupid gamble?
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
Backlund has reached the age where if he is sent to the minors he must clear waivers. I don’t know the exact rules, most of the time it has to do with the amount of games you’ve played in the NHL. This just means that we want him to play in the AHL and not be the NHL backup, and were willing to take the risk that no one else would scoop him up off waivers.
It either means we’re keeping Bob as the backup until Leighton gets back or we’re gonna send them both down and get a UFA or something. Probably the former, depending on what happens with the salarycap-logjam at defense.
It was the right move really. Not saying he couldn’t be an asset to the team in some capacity, but there is such a log jam at forward for this team that it would be nice to have that #12 forward be someone who could benefit from NHL experience to help his development (untill he gets sent down to the minors or gets traded away just like 95% of the youth the Flyers “develop”)
Yes, but Lappy being out opens a spot on the team to put in, say Powe (Who I think has that 4th line spot). If they keep Carcillo, doesn’t that mean the top 9 is filled?
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
Meh. Disagree with the move because now it means one of our top 3 lines with have dead offensive weight on it, but at least Richards, Carter and Giroux won’t get overused on the PK now.
Optimism: Maybe Carcillo turns into a 20 goal scorer as a season-long top-nine forward. Or maybe Nodl develops a scoring touch.
Pessimism: If Testwuide is the one that makes the roster, this move was even worse because he’s not a PK guy and won’t score much this year. If it’s Nodl, I can deal.
Corrected
Or maybe Nodl develops a scoring touch in the pro’s.
Is this the right room for an argument?
He was a point per game guy in college, but that was three years ago. He wouldn’t be the only guy who had a offensive game that didn’t translate. Geoff’s done good work in trying to prove that Nodl is capable of putting up legitimate top-nine numbers in the AHL/NHL, but he still has to go out there and actually do it.
Yes I’m aware, I watched him at St Cloud St., on the Phantoms, and on the Flyers, hence my correction of the sentence. Geoff hasn’t been the only doing the work to prove that case. The correction says nothing about him being able to score in the AHL or NHL, just simply that he has been a scorer.
He also wouldn’t be the only guy that had an offensive game in college, left early, and took some time to find his confidence at the pro level (read pro = AHL/NHL).
Is this the right room for an argument?
Ben Eager was a decent scorer in juniors, but he never developed a scoring touch in the pros. When I say “develop”, I mean that he has to improve or adjust his game a bit in order to score in the pros. It’s not like he can just go back to the way he played in college (although he could shoot more often, that might help), because the level of competition is so much higher in the pros.
Maybe re-develop should have been the word. But if you have been putting up mediocre numbers for two seasons in the pros, I think some straight up “development” is still necessary. His offensive struggles can’t solely be blamed on misuse, a too-early call up, or unlucky linemates. In the end, Nodl still has work to do.
In no way have I disagreed with that in what I wrote at all. Clearly Nodl has to take the responsibility for not performing on the score sheet so far at the pro-level despite the tough situations he has been put in with this organization. All I did was add 3 words to your sentence to say that there is potential there, nothing more, nothing less.
However, Eager is a horrible comparison:
Eager, 4 years in Juniors: 139 points in 243 Games, 0.57 Points per Game
Nodl, 2 years in USHL, 2 years at St Cloud: 165 Points in 182 Games, 0.91 Points per game (if you exlcude his first year with Sioux Falls, he is at 1.07 Pts per Game)
Eager on the Phantoms: 35 Points in 123 games, 0.28 points per game
Nodl on the Phantoms: 55 points in 107 games, 0.51 goals per game
Nodl also had the issue of being “rushed” to the NHL, spending half of his first full year as a pro on the Flyers when he clearly wasn’t ready for it. I still think that crippled his confidence and hindered his development, but Geoff and I have both brought that up before. But Eager got to spend almost two full seasons in the AHL developing. For players who aren’t ready to make the jump (and I think most of us can agree players coming from Juniors are more prepared), the extra time in the AHL helps a player develop and gain confidence. Eager is a bad comparison in both statistics and development…not to mention they are two completely different types of players.
Is this the right room for an argument?
It’s definitely not a perfect comparison, but if Eager next season miraculously scored 25 goals, I don’t think we would say that he re-discovered his scoring ability from juniors – we would say he developed into a scorer.
Really just a semantics argument here. I’m not selling Nodl short – I wouldn’t have mentioned that he could possibly become a decent scorer in the pros in my OP if I didn’t think it could potentially happen.
I think the point that Nodl is underrated is a correct argument. But at the same time, we should be careful in making too many excuses for him. In the end, he does have to get better.
But at the same time, we should be careful in making too many excuses for him. In the end, he does have to get better.
This is entirely true. There’s no doubt that Nodl has to actually do something. I’ve never disagreed.
But while there are only two people (me and DLJr) making any excuses for him, I’ll take the risk that we make too many excuses as opposed to getting shouted down by those who don’t give him any.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s true, if you’re going to have a contrarian viewpoint, sometimes you do have to over-emphasize a bit to counteract the majority of people opposed. I’m just looking for something of a middle ground.
haha, I commend your searching for a middle ground. And that ground is almost certainly the most accurate.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Now I’m going to nitpick about Eager since I agree with everything you said about Nodl.
If Eager scored 25 goals this season, I would say it’s an outlier or fluke since he has already spent 255 games playing NHL hockey, and we know what kind of player he is at this level. Where as Nodl, if he scored 15 or whatever this year, I would say is developing b/c he has only spent 48 games in the NHL. Again, I just think Eager is a very poor comparison, and felt like nitpicking.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Kind of what I am hinting at, that a majority of players drafted in the 1st and 2nd rounds (Eager and Nodl respectively) have some sort of scoring upside. You also need to consider style of play to make a better comparison. Nodl was drafted to play on a scoring line. He was rushed in to the NHL and failed, in the mean time he has become a very good two way player. Not counting the 3 games he played for the Phantoms in 07/08, Nodl has only been a pro for 2 seasons and is still just 23 years old. Frankly we just don’t know who he is at the NHL level yet b/c outside of when he was rushed to the Flyers, he hasn’t really been played in the role he was drafted to fill. He may or may not turn in to that player, who knows, but regardless, Eager is not the right comparison.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Yeah, Eager wasn’t a good comparison in terms of playing style or experience – main reason why I used him was because he’s known to all Flyers fans and he was fairly productive in amateurs while never carrying that production over to the pros. I’m just saying that it’s possible to score in amateurs and never do the same in the pros. It’s obviously far from a guarantee.
haha, Thank you. :)
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
i love the carcillo show, but i think it should be over. he exemplified in the preseason that he has not changed the way he plays the game and contains more cost then benefit. which is why guerin being released upsets me even more.
The issue I have is, however, how can Carcillo change the way he plays when the play-calling in the NHL is so damnably inconsistent.
During the Sabres game, Bundy was pointing out a Sabre (Kaleta?) who is known for being absolutely dirty. He jumps Powe, they get equivalent calls, nothing else. Carcillo opens his mouth, gets a 10 minute.
Yes yes, I know it’s pro-sports and that the referee’s are never totally impartial, but this blatant BS prevents players from truly understanding what the hell they’re supposed to do.
Johan Backlund, Mike Testwuide, Ben Holmstrom, Erik Gustafsson, Marc-Andre Bourdon, Jon Kalinski and David Laliberte
All on the Phantoms
Hexwall.
Johan Backlund, Mike Testwuide, Ben Holmstrom, Erik Gustafsson, Marc-Andre Bourdon, Jon Kalinski and David Laliberte
All on the Phantoms
Hopefully we can say that about Backlund come this time tomorrow.
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by Mitchell Green on Oct 4, 2010 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
At least the Phantoms should be good this year
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
Seriously, they really should be half decent. The defense is pretty awesome and, assuming Backlund is able to regain last year’s form, the goaltending situation is pretty rock solid.
Phantoms might struggle to score a littler bit unless Legein and Maroon tear it up. Someone needs to replace Matsumoto’s spot centering the top line. Should be a good year for Wellwood and Pither though.
@Mitchman88 on Twitter
by Mitchell Green on Oct 4, 2010 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Pither should be the top-line center and easily replace Ross’ production.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Also, for those who care (i.e. me and Geoff), Jon Matsumoto did not crack the the Carolina Hurricanes line-up and was sent down to the Canes’ affiliate in the AHL, the Charlotte Checkers – a.k.a. the new Albany River Rats.
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by Mitchell Green on Oct 4, 2010 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Who do they have beyond Staal and Sutter as C?
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
Patrick Dwyer?
I just posted a question about it at Canes Country so hopefully soon I will have an answer for you…
@Mitchman88 on Twitter
by Mitchell Green on Oct 4, 2010 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok thanks. I would look for myself but I have run out of bandwidth and it is painfully slow.
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
These were all guys that are listed as centers for the Canes. Not sure how many of them are actually on the Canes in NHL: , Zac Dalpe, Patrick O’Sullivan, , Eric Staal, Brandon Sutter.
@Mitchman88 on Twitter
by Mitchell Green on Oct 4, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
O`Sullivan is a great story.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions
He is actually from North Carolina although he as born in Toronto!
Dude had a tough childhood thanks to an abusive father and then he dropped to the second round in the 2003 Entry Draft depsite being projected as first round draft pick.
Glad to see he is getting time in Carolina. Hope he does well.
@Mitchman88 on Twitter
by Mitchell Green on Oct 4, 2010 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks for that. Sad, honestly.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions
So if Nodl makes the team over Testwuide and Holmstrom...
who gets more top-nine ice time? Carcillo or Nodl? Could be an interesting debate.
That will be an interesting thing to watch.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
and i dont understand why the flyers wouldn’t even sign him even if they didnt know where to put him yet.
even carrying one of leighton or lappy w/o ltir, they could have carried guerin, carcillo, powe, shelley, and betts. so take your pick as to where they go or who sits in the pb. but if they signed him, how could it have hurt? this is assuming 23 man roster with 7 dmen. it could still be worked out the other way with 8 dman, one less forward.
but, do you guys think one of carcillo, powe, shelley, or nodl is really of more benefit than guerin?
He certainly would have provided more value than Shelley, but there was no way that Shelley wasn’t making this team after the contract the organization gave him.
The other guys, it’s all about roles. Powe can play both center and wing and give good minutes on the PK. Guerin can only play wing and wouldn’t have played PK. Carcillo is an agitator who draws penalties – always a good thing to have, particularly when you have a great power play like the Flyers have.
As for Nodl, well, there’s where the debate comes in. The organization obviously felt that Nodl’s guaranteed contributions on the PK and potential offensive improvement outweighed Guerin’s 20 goals and power play ice time.
While many thought that Lappy’s injury guaranteed Guerin’s spot on the roster, it actually may have been the other way around. Had Lappy been available, the Flyers wouldn’t have needed another penalty killer – Betts, Lappy, Powe, and then Richards/Giroux/Carter would have been sufficient. They very well may have felt that the benefit of Guerin’s offensive production was outweighed by the negatives of subjecting top-line forward talent to heavy PK minutes and potential injury/exhaustion.
Excellent analysis.
I think the huge thing was Shelley’s contract and almost guaranteed role.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I still hate that contract…and probably always will. I got in to a big argument at the Isles preseason game with some who thought bringing in Shelley was the smartest move the Flyers made. First I burst out laughing b/c I thought he was kidding, then the argument started.
Is this the right room for an argument?
lol, I’m sure the laughing helped keep the debate civil.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Oct 4, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions
i don’t like the contract and just because he had it, isn’t justification for him being on the roster. holmgren could have just signed guerin and gotten rid of shelley. in the playoffs, who matters more? and im not disagreeing with anything you guys said, just my thoughts on the post season
Theoretically what you say is true, but in reality, that would not happen. Clearly Homer wanted him here, or else he wouldn’t have given him that horrific contract. You don’t sign someone for 3 years, only to immediately get rid of him b/c someone who was available all of free agency, who you did not sign before Shelley, is now on a try out.
Even though we might wish it, it doesn’t make sense in reality for that to be a real possibility.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Agreed, though I think I’m the only person here that doesn’t think Guerin was going to hit the 20 goal mark, which is why i was even more convinced he wasn’t making the team. I also don’t think he would have seen much PP time with Richards, Carter, Giroux, JVR, Zherdev, Briere, Leino, and Hartnell all possibly ahead of him, I really don’t know if he would get any PP ice time, which would even further support what you have already presented. Very well said.
Is this the right room for an argument?
i didn’t think he would hit it either. i just think his benefits of putting up some points would have outweighed carrying a fighter OR an agitator.
Difference is, said fighter and said agitator were already signed. I don’t know if he out weighs Carcillo, and that contract would be the one that may have been the only realistic one that they could get rid of…Shelley, no matter how much we don’t like his contract, was never a realistic option to be moved.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Based on their careers, no. Based on what I saw in the preseason, I think Nodl deserved the spot over Guerin. If that was Guerin competing to keep his career alive, he clearly doesn’t have much left in the tank, and Nodl showed me more. Granted I’m hugely biased, but take Nodl out of it, and I just didn’t see any reason from Guerin’s play in the preseason to say he deserved a spot.
Is this the right room for an argument?
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