Where's The Outcry? Begin, Savard, Bruins Goon Up Game 5
by Travis Hughes on May 11, 2010 1:46 PM EDT
in 2010 Playoffs
Email
Print
It really speaks volumes about the way the Philadelphia Flyers are perceived around the NHL, doesn't it? If they were to pull off the antics that the Boston Bruins pulled out on Monday night, all hell would've broken loose in the hockey media. All the stories this morning would be about those dirty Flyers who have no class -- love when that term is thrown around -- and no respect for the game.
But when the Bruins do the same, you can barely even find the thing on YouTube.
Typically, it takes about 30 minutes -- maybe an hour --- for a questionable hit or a questionable play in the NHL to make its way from broadcast to Internet. I was planning on writing this story in the early morning hours following Game 5, but I couldn't find any clips of the incidents on YouTube. Why is that? Is it because Marc Savard was one of the parties gooning it up? Is it because people just don't care that the Bruins were gooning it up? Is it the playoffs? I don't have an answer to those questions.
This morning I did find one relevant clip on YouTube, finally, seemingly captured by a Flyers fan since it's from the CSN broadcast. We'll watch some tape and review some things after the jump.
We'll start with the less egregious of the two major incidents in this game. With less than six minutes left in the third, Mike Richards hit Marc Savard in the corner. It looked to me as if Savard turned into the hit, and Richards hit him from the side. Savard certainly wasn't facing the boards and he had the puck, so to me, that's a clean hit.
What isn't clean is the reaction from Savard and the retaliation involved. To that lone YouTube clip...
Savard just absolutely goes ballistic on Richards there. He gets up, goes right after him, turns him around, cross checks him in the face and rides him into the glass. Milan Lucic then double teams the helpless Richards, who holds on for dear life until his teammates realize what is going on behind the play and come to his aid.
Richards, Lucic and Savard all get two minute minors out of the deal. Here's what the rule says on the subject:
Rule 59 - Cross-checking
[...]
59.4 Match Penalty – The Referee, at his discretion, may assess a match penalty if, in his judgment, the player or goalkeeper attempted to or deliberately injured his opponent by cross-checking.
Anybody with a brain in between their ears can see that Savard clearly intended to injure Richards in this situation, and I know it's the playoffs, but if the rules are the rules, Savard deserved a match penalty and possibly more. I don't see how there can be any debate about that. Notice how that case isn't being made anywhere, though.
The craziest part about Savard's night, though, was how the media just ate up his quotes about how "enough is enough," never mind that his words are completely rooted in a fantasy land, of course.
Here's the quote from The Bruins Blog:
"I just got fired up. I got one the other night in Philly from behind [which was called boarding against Darroll Powe], and then I was facing the glass again in the same situation and then I look back at [David] Booth, [David] Krejci, those guys … I mean, enough’s enough. I mean, I don’t know. That’s all," said Savard after the loss, which sends the series back to Philly for Game 6 Wednesday night.
Richards' hit on David Booth from earlier this season has created a scenario where media people have the opportunity to paint Richards as a bad guy. In reality that's just not true, but it's pretty evident in today's press that journalists will cover the attractive story, the truth be damned.
No, the truth is that Savard's quote is absolutely laughable. Yes, Savard was hit from behind by Darroll Powe in Game 4, and yes, it's understandable that he's touchy about potential head injuries given the way his season was derailed by Matt Cooke. But since when does that give a guy a right to attack a player in the way Savard did in Game 5, adrenaline or not?
And since when does the media not have the balls to corner him on that? They ate up his "enough is enough" quote and asked no further questions. Video of Savard's post game media availability is conveniently absent from the Bruins site, but CSN New England does have part of it.
Nobody confronted him. Nobody pointed out how the Krejci hit was 100 percent within the rules. Nobody pointed out how, no, Savard wasn't facing the glass in this Richards hit like he said he was. And nobody called him on his absolutely bonkers retaliation. Nope, it's part of the game, and hey, Savard's been victimized this season, so he can't possibly be in the wrong anyway. It's just ridiculous. Really disappointing stuff.
But believe it or not, that wasn't even the worst showing by a Bruins player on Monday night. There's no video of this other one, either, unless you delve into the TSN highlight package. It's 1:24 in on this video, linked here, but even there, it's only briefly mentioned and shown for a split second. No mention of how Giroux was slow to get up. No mention of how Giroux only say 15 seconds of ice time after that hit. No mention of how, as I write these words on Tuesday afternoon, Giroux is in testing to see if he has a concussion.
No outcry. If a Bruins player deserves a suspension for any action in Game 5, it's Begin for his hit on Giroux. An elbow to the head from behind deserves punishment every single time, and the fact that there's been absolutely no uproar about it screams hypocrisy from the hockey media as well.
Honestly, I don't really care if either player gets suspended. To be completely honest, I'd rather see them back on the ice so the Flyers can continue to hit them cleanly and get under their skin, because these actions are what rattled hockey players resort to and it's clear that a rattled Bruins team can't beat these Flyers.
But to say it doesn't piss me off that the Bruins aren't called out by the sports media when they goon things up, while the Flyers are always, ten times out of ten, held to that standard is the understatement of the century.
137 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Puckity puck puck
Replace the “P” with “F” and you get the idea.
Giroux being tested for concussion. Big surprise.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
From that video, it’s impossible to tell if Begin’s elbow hit head.
I didn’t like the hit. It was unclean. But I don’t particularly care if anyone outside the Flyers locker room gets heated up about it.
As someone with a background in journalism, I guess I might care about this more than other people. It’s a big time concern to me because it alters how people view the story. It alters how people will view the Flyers, Richards, Savard, etc. And the way the narrative is told does find its way onto the ice.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on May 11, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m sure Savard would’ve stood up for himself and fought Richards if Richards removed his visor…
OH WAIT:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puck_daddy/post/Bruins-player-wimps-out-after-Crosby-removes-vis?urn=nhl,149143
i really was surprised there wasn’t a game misconduct doled out on either incident.
i saw the giroux hit as an elbow to the head worthy of a a major,
i saw savard crosschecking richards in the face (drawing blood)and then subsequently hauling back and trying punch richards in the head as lucic held him.
Eat what the monkey eats, then eat the monkey. -U.S. Navy survival guidance
As soon as the Savard incident happened, I thought for sure they’d hand out a match for that; but then I calmed down and realized it’s the playoffs, it’s Savard, it’s not gonna get called. That doesn’t change the fact that I thought what Savard did there, under the current rules, is absolutely a match penalty, and I’m surprised I haven’t read about that anywhere today as well. Good right up Travis. I am concerned that this hasn’t gotten a little more attention b/c I feel like it further supports my suspicion that no matter how the Flyers are built, they will always be viewed a certain way.
From a Pens fan:
Every team has its “rep”, you just have to overcome when you hit the ice. Savard is one more hit short of permanent frontal lobe damage like a certain QB we all are sick of hearing about. If I were worried that Boston was gonna win this thing, I’d kindly ask that you fellers take care of his dumb-ass and Begin as well. Lucic is the least dangerous b/c you know what he brings, and where he is on the ice.
All of that is pointless because:
Flyers are better than the Broooooooooons, so just point, laugh and win. We’ll see you in the ECF.
Last I checked you guys still have a game to play too. ECF matchups are still completely up for grabs.
by bfrank27 on May 11, 2010 3:04 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Really? I must have missed that. ;-)
U slow? The point was, we’ll take care of our stuff, you take care of yours, and see you in the ECF. . .
I’m rootin for you, but you go ahead and be a mook about it, see how fast that gets you to the next round.
Knee jerk reaction when we see Pens around here…we haven’t exactly had the best experiences playing you guys recently hahaha. But yeah I agree Flyers > Bruins, Pens > Habs, but unfortunately that doesn’t always translate in to series wins. So, in the mean time, I’ll be biting my nails and hoping the Flyers get to play another game after Wednesday before I start thinking about another round.
Well 2 things Max. First off, welcome to the board, but lose the chip. ;)
I honestly don’t know why you would be rooting for us, unless you really think that the Pens match up better against the Bruins, which I think is pretty far from the case.
You guys are literally the cross the Flyers bear right now. The Pens are the team where the Flyers who are generally a pretty loose group, get tense and do things wrong that they literally don’t do wrong against any other team they play. The Pens are our personal demon, our personal rock of Sisyphus. I don’t want to play you guys, although I fear that for the team to ever truly live up to its potential it needs to play and beat you guys.
I didn’t take it this way, but people here could easily take your post as a back handed compliment.
Speaking candidly, I root against the Pens in every game I see them play. I am absolutely loving what is happening, and if I was a Pens fan, I would be crapping my pants right now.
You are down Stahl, Crosby and Malkin are completely snakebit by Halak, and Cammalari is unconscious. Worse yet you are playing against a team that doesn’t seem to know that they aren’t supposed to win, and suddenly all that youth is looking like a asset.
We’ve been up against the wall since the last month of the season, so we’re used to it here.
How do you overcome the rep when it dictates what happens when you hit the ice? Then all of the people that say we are wearing tin foil hats follow up with there is no bias against the Flyers you should expect that kind of treatment seeing how you have conducted your selves since the 70’s. Leaves me scratching my head.
Just Call Me "M"!
Edwards is a clown and embarrassment to the league
Unfortunately I got the Bruins feed on Direct TV and had to watch with the sound off until the last few minutes……did anyone hear Edwards at the end? I can’t believe a professional organ-I-zation would employ that clown.
I was too busy jumping up and down and yelling at the TV to hear it. During the 1st period, I was so sick of listening to the NESN commentary that I tried to tune 610 WIP on my computer and play that along with the NHL Center Ice video feed, but the 2 feeds were way off timewise. Seemed like the 610 WIP audio feed was delayed by more than 5 minutes against the live game – not sure why?
Got stuck with the NESN feed myself. All in all, it probably wasn’t the worst Edwards broadcast I’ve ever heard — no cackling at Randy Jones getting boarded, no “Snowball 1, Hell 0” — but on the minus side, I’m pretty sure I heard him say, with typical Edwardsian flair, “And there’s a third man in!” (obviously hoping for a game misconduct) directed at Gagne when he was actually the 4th man in trying to get Lucic (the actual third man) off Richards
by SteelBirdFlyer on May 11, 2010 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Here here, Travis. I cannot describe how sick of the national media slant I am. It’s why every article you read that mentions a Flyer will be littered with the comments “FuK The FLYERS THEIR A BUNCH OF CHEAP AHOLES AND THE DIRITIESST TEAM IN SPORTS I HOPE THEY DIE” even though the Booth hit may very well be the only truly dirty hit thrown by a Flyer all year (and yes, at the time it was technically within the rules, but no to me that will always be a dirty play). And then our fans are perceived as whiners because we want justice to be handed out fairly.
Personally, nothing gets me more upset than when I see an advertisement for a Sunday afternoon NBC game that goes something like “Tune in Sunday to watch the high-flyin, fast-skatin, goal-scorin Penguins take on the Broad Street Bullies!” Like, no. We are not the Broad Street Bullies. We haven’t been for thirty fucking years- let it go already.
"He told me, 'Keep your head up.' I didn't realize he meant the whole season."
Claude Giroux has been skating around the Bruins much of this series, and I’m sure that the message delivered from the the coaching staff was:
“Are you gonna let that SOB continue to dance around out there, or are you gonna KNOCK HIM ON HIS ASS?”
If you saw the game, it was clear the Bruins were targetting Claude earlier, which I have no problem with. But the hit from behind was just as dirty as they come, and the fact that there’s not been even a mention of it, nor the hint of an NHL review is ridiculous.
Compare that hit to the similar hit by Powe on Savard in game 4, where you could see that Savard turned and Powe, who was committed to the hit, clearly let up and got him in the back torso and shoulder area.
Both hits were penalized, but the the hit on Giroux was so much worse, with Begin literally staring at Giroux’s numbers and the back of his helmet as he delivered the hit up around his kneck and head, and drove him face first into the dasher.
We all know Claude Giroux is one of the NHL’s next generation of stars, yet … not a word. Could you imagine the reaction of the NHL if this had been a Canadien player knocking Crosby out of the game? I imagine it would be front page news at nhl.com and there’d be a press conference as we speak.
Truthfully, I didn’t think my respect for the NHL commissioner could get much lower.
At least the Yotes are headed back to Winnipeg.
“If you saw the game series, or any part of the Devils series,” it was clear they were targeting Claude. Seriously, both teams have/had taken more runs at him than at the entire rest of the team combined. It is clear who the rest of the league considers our most skilled player.
Also, in regards to the rest of your post- agreed. Totally.
"He told me, 'Keep your head up.' I didn't realize he meant the whole season."
Here’s an article that puckdaddy linked about a Flyers fans experience in Boston last night….
I hope to god that Flyers fans seriously aren’t this bad tomorrow.
Managing Editor - HockeyOutsiders.com
by HockeyOutsiders on May 11, 2010 4:18 PM EDT reply actions
Wow...
I had a softball game last night so I missed the entire first period and the 2nd half of the 3rd period.
I did see the obvious boarding penalty on Giroux. Should have been a match penalty, but wasn’t. Missed call there for sure.
I didn’t think Richards hit on Savard was all that bad. Richard was about to hit him from the side but Savard turned in to it as passed along the boards towards the direction of the net. Savard turned in the direction of the pass he was making and thus turned into the hit. If anything it was more a matter of timing gone wrong.
But then to get up, chase Richards down, cross check him, then turn him around and cross check him in the face and then started throwing punches.
At first I thought Lucic getting involved was just him sticking up for a guy about to get demolished by Richards but then as I watched it over and over I realized that Lucic saw the whole thing and very clearly saw Savard go after Richards…so then why be the 3rd man in. Savard “picked a fight” so to speak, so why get involved? Bush league if you ask me. I used to like Savard but the more I watch of him the more I see Briere, whom I also do not like for many of the same dirty tactics.
Either way, the best part of all of this was when Gagne came flying in and threw a shoulder to Lucic, then ripped him off Richie and took him down to the ice, all the while Hunwick is in there trying to get a hold of Gagne. Boy did I miss OMGAGNE!!!
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
Why the Briere hate?
Briere is probably what? 5’9? He’s one of the smallest guys in the league. Savard isn’t big but he’s certainly bigger than Briere. I’m a bit bigger than Mike Richards, and when I played hockey in college I was one of the smaller guys on the team, although I did play in the era when Hockey was looking more like the NFL than the NHL. It takes a lot of courage to be a little guy and play one of the fastest and toughest sports on earth. You act like you expect a guy who literally survives purely on the basis of his speed and quickness is a wimp. Briere isn’t going to win a physical battle ever, yet he goes into corners against guys who are 50-80 pounds heavier than him, and comes out with the puck on a regular basis. I’m kinda sick of the Briere bashing quite frankly. Yeah he has a bad contract, but that is not his fault, and he’s been contributing exactly where it’s expected — on the score sheet.
I think it’s awesome that Savard is so frustrated he went after Richards — a guy who he is quite lucky didn’t decide to drop his gloves and give him a fresh concussion. That bodes well for us.
Lucic probably jumped in there to save Savard from himself. I don’t blame Lucic — I blame the refs. Boston did end up with the extra minor, but that’s just not even remotely the right call — it should have been a 5-3, and very possibly, if you really wanted to get serious about the rulebook (which let’s face it, nobody expects in the playoffs) then yeah, you could be looking at instigator and 3rd man in.
Overall, it was a scrum and the real travesty is that the refs couldn’t pull their heads out of their ass, and their anti flyers bias, and actually call what should have been called. Again, this is where the Flyers get uneven treatment — even though he’s the team captain, because Richards is one of the most physical guys on the team, the refs just expect him to take care of himself, even when one of the true heavyweights in the NHL goes after him.
I can’t believe that no one in the Philadelphia media even covered this?!? That’s just terrible. I don’t know how the press works after a game but are media from other team’s papers allowed to question the opponents? I.E. was Boruk or Panotch or anyone allowed to talk to Savard after the game?
Travis, I agree with your journalism point of view. It’s injustice and a reporter should want to cover that whether they’re a lowly beat writer or a veteran columnist.
The hit and the ensuing beat-down make me incensed. People can say all they want about Flyers fans griping about a conspiracy but I would have been that mad if it was Patrick Kane on one of the Sedins. The NHL really is a joke when it comes to punishment and handling their players. After watching that Broad Street Bullies documentary it almost makes me wish that Carcillo and Asham could have just leapt the boards and taken care of Savard/Lucic themselves. It probably would have ended there.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
That was a bad hit by Richards IMO and Savvy had every right there.
Just my opinion, not trolling.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 4:57 PM EDT reply actions
But do you see that Savard turned into the hit just as Richards was delivering it?
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
no. He was hit from behind and did not see the hit, IMO
but im just a homer, what do i know?
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly.
Thats why I am not afraid to admit it.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Savvy has every right to square up to Richards and ask to fight, heck I’ll even give him the slash for a little payback as acceptable, but no player ever has the right to intentionally hit another player in the face with their stick…ever. It’s one thing if you bring your gloves up, and your stick catches the player unintentionally, but it’s never right to intently hit a player in the face with your stick. Regardless of how you view the hit, you can’t possibly condone that type of action…please tell me you don’t think it’s right to do that…
I never said it was right.
Just Savvy had the right to be pissed right there.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions
We have differing opinions about the Richards hit (it looked borderline at worst to me), which is cool as far as I’m concerned, and if Savard really thought it was dirty I could see him getting pissed.
But it is wholly inexcusable for TWO professionals like Lucic and Savard to gang up on one guy behind the play, to say nothing of Savards sticks and such to the face. If Lucic wants to play enforcer, fine, let him. Then Savard needs to back off and let Lucic be the enforcer. If Savard wants to handle it on his own, that’s fine, then Lucic needs to walk away. Either way, their actions, combined, were completely indefensible.
I agree two on one is unfair
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Why is that, because Richards had the temerity to lay a legal check on him? That’s absurd. You don’t wanna see what happens the day that Savard decides to drop the gloves with Richards.
As much as the fighting in hockey kinda bores me, that’s something after the crap that went down, I’d like to see. But that match-up would be like watching a wolverine decimate a racoon.
yeah Richards would get killed.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions
I actually hope you’re kidding. Although it doesn’t hold too much merit, just counting regular season:
Marc Savard, 1 fight in 02/03
Mike Richards, 22 fights since 05/06
Richards pretty much became our Captain because he is skilled but he always knew when to through down. Richards would literally shove Savard’s head up his own ass in a fight.
"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."
Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson
nah savvy would kick ass ;)
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions
we need to set up this Savvy-Richards fight so we can find out.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions
No. We don’t.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on May 12, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
why not?
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Richards would re-concuss Savard. He ain’t exactly Josh Gorges, you know.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on May 12, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions
nah Savvy would win.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
This is why we get frustrated with you.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on May 12, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Im joking. ;)
Seriously, he would get killed.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with you completely. I have no issue with Savard going after Richards. I have an issue with how he did it and Lucic jumping to the aid of the guy who instigated it.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
Lucic was just defending Savvy, a guy who doesnt fight. And Lucic is a goon.
It was a little cheap how Savvy used his stick. I just liked the way he stood up for himself.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
It was a little cheap how Savvy used his stick.
And that’s the issue here. If he just shoved Richards or hit him legally or whatever we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
Actually we still would because Lucic had to get himself involved.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
true
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
But why is Lucic defending a guy who went after Richards? It would have been one thing if Richie went after Savard, then I would get it.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
I agree. Maybe Lucic should not have gotten involved. I just understand the thought process.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I will go one further, since he did get involved where is the third man in game misconduct? That would have been the right call, seeing as we all agree Lucic’s actions were bush league at best.
Just Call Me "M"!
yes third man in for sure
suspension worthy?
if cooke wasnt suspended, no one will be.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions
When Gagne got boarded, much worse that Savard hit, by Volchenkov Gagne dropped the gloves and fought Volchenkov. Gagne doesn’t fight is much smaller than Volchenkov and was almost killed on the hit that also lead to a goal. He didn’t use his stick he dropped the gloves threw some punches and subsequently got 19 minutes in penalties. Savard barely contacted the boards and got up drew blood with a stick to the Richard’s face and threw a bunch of punches when Lucic was holding Richards who couldn’t defend himself or fight back. Two wrongs don’t make a right and Savard is a pussy for going about in that manner.
um, I agree with most but Savard is no pussy.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Really? Because going after Crosby and then not fighting Crosby because he has a visor on, only for Crosby to take it off and challenge Savard to a fight, and then Savard declining a fight…with Sidney friggin Crosby tells me that Savard is actually a huge p*ssy.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
Can’t agree with you there. Because I was thinking third man in (Lucic) as well until I realized it wasn’t a fight. It was just some pissed off guy who couldn’t control himself trying like a spoiled brat to get “even” for what he felt was a cheap hit. He’s carrying the puck, is heading up the boards as Richards is coming in to check him, and he pivots just before Richards hits him—it’s close to the boards, but still not a penalty. He then proceeds to go apeshit. Man up and DROP your gloves—his are still on at the end of that scrum. There was never a fight.
As stated above, when an actual boarding penalty—which wasn’t called—happened to Gagne, he got up and fought, no stick no nothing. Sure he jumped the guy slightly, but he still fought. Your guy doesn’t have either the courtesy or the balls to do the same, and if he’s worried fighting will give him another concussion, tell him to get off the ice or just skate away.
And after the game he gives the “time to kill” defense, as if he’s the judge of all that has happened in the league this year and gets to decide when he’s allowed to hit a guy in the face with his stick. What a joke.
by JerseyDriver on May 11, 2010 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions
The rule states:
47.16 Third Man In – A game misconduct penalty, at the discretion of the Referee, shall be imposed on any player or goalkeeper who is the first to intervene (third man in) in an altercation already in progress except when a match penalty is being imposed in the original altercation. This penalty is in addition to any other penalties incurred in the same incident.
This rule also applies to subsequent players or goalkeepers who elect to intervene in the same or other altercations during the same stoppage of play.
You see the section I highlighted in bold…it says altercation, not fight. What Savard was doing with Richards, at the very least can be classified as an altercation. There are a ton of other words that could be used to describe what Savard was doing but altercation at its root fits this.
One would think a guy who just missed a good part of the season due to a concussion would be more careful then as to go at someones head…with a stick no less.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
Thanks for the info, wasn’t aware. And yes, if you had your wits about you, I would agree with your last statement. Drop your gloves and get down to business. Savard’s way was classless and showed no respect.
by JerseyDriver on May 11, 2010 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions
But that rule is still a subset of the fighting rule. I don’t think it can be called without fighting being called, just like I’ve never seen an Instigator penalty called without a fight being called. Even if 47.16 meets the “altercation” definition up above, I’m not sure it can be called on it’s own.
by DragonGirl0583 on May 12, 2010 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
What do they call when someone drops his gloves to fight and the other guy doesn’t? Isn’t that an instigator penalty without a fight? Or is that roughing?
Go Go Gadget Gagne
I’ve never seen them call an instigator by itself in that situation…. I’ve definitely seen roughing, and I think that it’s possible for one person to get fighting + instigator without the other guy getting fighting; I just don’t think you can get third man in or instigator if no one gets called for fighting. I could be wrong, I’ve just never seen it called that way.
by DragonGirl0583 on May 12, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions
I think it was 19 minutes of penalties including his game misconduct and a 9 minute power play for the other team.
"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."
Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson
That was Carcillo in December…. I think Gagne’s was 17 in that Ottawa game.
by DragonGirl0583 on May 12, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
He got 5 for fighting, 2 for instigating, 2 for fighting with a visor and a 10 minute misconduct. The other guy got 2 for roughing or something and we ended up with a 7 minute pk that we killed off.
I still can’t believe we are one of the only teams in the NHL that can find a way to get a 7 minute PK and a 9 minute PK in the same season!
"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."
Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson
That’s a lie. You can totally believe that, of all the teams in the NHL, we’d be the most likely to have that honor.
"I did my walk of shame this morning and everyone was so much nicer," she said. "People were inviting me to parties at 9 a.m."
What the poor video of incident in question doesn’t really show is the boarding on Savy by Richards. That wasn’t a legal check and should have been a penalty.
In what phantom universe is that boarding and are you absolutely sure that Savard spinning 90 degrees right into Richards’ hit at the last second had nothing to do with what you perceived happened?
Proudly supporting a Flyers team with "no honor."
Would also add Savard is looking across ice before he turns, so he should have clearly seen Richards coming towards him.
by JerseyDriver on May 11, 2010 8:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. Like I said before, it seemed to be a matter of poor timing. Savard turned into Richie’s hit and it looked like boarding and truthfully, if they had called it, I wouldn’t have been pissed about it…had they also called Begin’s obvious board on Giroux.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
Oh god it’s jones/bergeron all over again
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on May 12, 2010 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
dont go there
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree Begin should be suspended, that was wrong.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:05 PM EDT reply actions
good article
I disagree with almost all of it, but its well written and makes a good point
A+
by delta on May 11, 2010 5:08 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
hahaha
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions
no I agree I just find it funny how you said it and I was afraid to ;)
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Just wondering, what are the parts you agree with?
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on May 11, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions
i’m leaving work so i cant write a full response, but i agree that him cross checking in response is a bit uncalled for even though i understand and support his decision to do so……
i also agree that the national media doesn’t really bash the B’s quite as much to an extent
i’ll elaborate a bit more when i get back
not much else to explain really…..
i mean honestly, how many hockey teams get attention on a national scale? not many. hockey is still a smaller market sport. i never heard shit talking about philly to be honest with you. sure, i heard about the “dirty” richards hit, but i didnt think “oh wow, philadelphia is the cheapest team in hockey”….
savard cross checking…….i would cross check you too if i just got a devastating head injury two months ago. and if i was lucic, or anyone else on the ice, i would beat the piss out of whoever touched him. nobody responded after his injury, so i bet that the team feels an even bigger need to protect their playmaker from future injury, no matter how borderline it might be (as well they should)
I see the point you are making, but typically when a Flyer commits and major penalty—like a cross check to the head, for instance—you would see it everywhere. Now add to the fact that there was a possible (and I don’t think it was) boarding call right before. Now add to that you have two guys beating/grabbing/mugging one player from the opposing team behind the net (still not sure either one of the Bruins dropped their gloves, I know Savard didn’t). Not fighting mind you, just “roughing”. I myself would think that would be everywhere just because for me, that has to be one of the top ten weirdest things I have seen this year. But to see NO coverage of it, that’s just strange.
by JerseyDriver on May 11, 2010 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not sure if we were expecting anything on a national scale but at least something in the hockey world.
I don’t mind that he was so pissed off, I understand why he was so pissed off. But you know who else got pissed off? Todd Bertuzzi, Marty McSorely and hell, even Ron Hextall. Now of course I’m not likening Savard’s crosscheck to Richie’s face to punching a guy in the back of the head, slashing him across the face or force feeding him your waffle board, but the thing is it could have had a similar result.
There is also a big difference between Lucic protecting him, which would involve him stepping between Richie and Savard to take on Richie himself, and Lucic punching Richards in the side of the head while Savard attacks him from the front.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on May 11, 2010 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks, that is the exact same point I have been trying to make. There is a huge difference between protection and double teaming.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
No problem. Btw, I hope you don’t mind but I’ve been taking over the Go Go Gadget Gagne duties since I haven’t seen you in the game threads.
Also, last night the guy doing the live chat for CSN reposted me saying it on the chat after the game!
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on May 11, 2010 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Not at all my friend. Actually…I have missed the last two games due to a Phils game on Friday and softball game last night.
I am just glad that someone is putting Go Go Gadget Gagne to good use, no one better than you.
Can't think of something catchy to say here...I suck.
No problem. If all goes well soon I should have my GGGGags raglan shirt.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on May 11, 2010 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions
i’ll give you that. yeah, this definitely should have been better covered in the hockey world.
if you look at this from a flyers standpoint, i’d be outraged too.
maybe the hit was unprovoked, maybe it wasnt. either way, the bruins were getting beat to shit and the players felt that they needed to react— whether it was warranted or not. sure, you could say they took it out on the wrong person, but its hard to say that given the history of savard’s injuries and the lack or reaction from his team. it looks ugly, seeing two bruins beating up on a single player, but bruins fans are eating that up right now. we’re glad they’re showing some form of fight…something they’ve lacked all game (or all of regular season for that matter)
regardless, marc savard and the bruins needed to react. whether it looked bad or not, they needed to show some intensity and that was their frustrations coming to a head right there
I can understand that. As a fan who gets angry at a lack of passion I can see your point but there are times when that passion and that anger would warrant a punishment and that should be black and white, not whatever rainbow of grays the NHL has set as a precedent.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on May 11, 2010 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions
And if it was a FIGHT, I could deal with it. No problem, but that was just brutal. And Savard should have gotten at least 4, if not 5. He hit a guy in the head with a stick, period. One of the worst comments made (in general) is “nothing will happen because no one was hurt/injured”. We now have this “blind-side hit” rule because of just that, and there are so many concussions now, players ARE getting hurt more and more it seems.
The league as a whole with the “discipline” is pretty bad, no consistency it seems. I couldn’t believe the Cooke hit wasn’t a major suspension. I think they need to do away with the instigator and let the players police themselves. Most teams have a guy or two, and if you go after a guy like Savard did, or feel that Richards hit was blatantly running a guy, you pay for it right there. You may have to deal with the league later, but getting your ass kicked is sometimes worse.
by JerseyDriver on May 11, 2010 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions
How this crosscheck by Carcillo got a match penalty and Savard did not is a clear example of the utter hypocrisy that exists in the NHL and bias against the Flyers. That Carcillo play was in this playoff against the Devils and Carcillo was suspended for 2 games. Savard got nothing drew blood and clearly had intent where Carcillo did not he was clearly trying to jab Clarkson in the chest and the stick deflected up off of Clarkson’s glove.
Looking at it from a mutual homer perspective, the suspensions the fan bases could want:
Begin for boarding
Richards for boarding
Savard for intent to injure
Lucic for third man in
Ference for third man in
Honor is no substitute for victory.
Krajicek bar as 5th man in.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on May 11, 2010 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Begin should be suspended and thats it
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 11, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I would agree his is the most egregious, and I could possibly see Savard getting one or two games in the regular season if he didn’t get a match penalty. Third man in seems to be an extremely rare call, but the first three on that list are all ones that it wouldn’t surprise me to see a suspension from Campbell if a Flyer did it in the regular season.
Honor is no substitute for victory.
Richards didn’t board Savard because Savard doesn’t hit the boards. The hit is by the boards and he comes close to hitting the boards but he doesn’t hit them. So it’s not a boarding. Also who does Savard think he is by saying “enough is enough” and talking about the Booth and Krecji hit? He thinks he’s the hero, standing up to the players Richards hurt and fighting back against the big bully Richards? Screw him. By the way, the hits on Krejci and Booth were clean hits too.
I thought the same thing Travis. Thanks for voicing what thoughts for me.
@Mitchman88 on Twitter
by Mitchell Green on May 11, 2010 10:52 PM EDT reply actions
I hate to say this. I really hate to say this.
I’ve played hockey since I was 8 or so. I’ve always respected my opponents, and never used my stick as a weapon in any case (did come close a few times). I’ve fought plenty of times, removed my lid every time. I did once jump a guy blindside, but he had just kicked a teammate in the gut, in front of our net, and I beat the refs to him by three strides. I got three games, after knocking him cold. He was banned.
As long as the game is in hand tonight, the Flyers should fuck some shit up. Listening to the Savard quotes….priceless for a no-balls assclown like him. Cindy fucking Crybaby backed him down by just pulling off his lid. Quotes like his just make the rest of the league laugh at him…for years. Napoleon syndrome and all.
This series just went to a place where none should. They’re taking runs at Giroux. They’re running Richards, but when isn’t that the case anyway. They’re scared, and they’re trying to take it out in blood. I’m sure Gagne is in the crosshairs tonight, as well as newly anointed mancrush Leino.
Well, if it were my team, I’d be putting on the foil tonight. Win or lose. We’d be taking our own bit of blood from these scared clowns.
I mentioned this on BSH Radio (which will be up soon, shameless plug) but I only want a suspension for these guys because of the situation the Flyers are in. They can’t retaliate — not in their situation. In that case, since the Flyers can’t being down justice of their own, what other options are there? Suspensions.
But that’s not going to happen, so hopefully the Flyers can run up the score and then handle Begin and Savard like they have to.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on May 12, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I dont care what you do to Begin. He sucks anyways and deserves it. Savvy not so.
Join the NLL community at http://www.nationallacrosseleagueblog.blogspot.com/
Talk about Boston sports at http://www.bestbostonsports.com/
by bestbostonsports on May 12, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Look,
I have a crush on Richie just like you have a crush on Savard and if Richie was to act like an gutless punk like Savard did, I’d have no problem with him getting fucked up. Would I like it? No. Would he deserve it? Yes, especially if he crosschecked someone else in the face and drew blood. Hockey justice hurts.
"Want a donut go to dunkin donuts, want a linebacker go to Penn State."
- Cris Carter, NFL Draft, 4/25/09
twitter: @princessblueezy
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Latest Puck Daddy - NHL from Yahoo! Sports
- Puck Headlines: Heritage Classic in Winnipeg?; Prospal re-signs; hockey stick DVD rack
- Booze and bucks: How NHL, Michigan secured The Big House for 2013 Winter Classic
- Marek Vs. Wyshynski Radio: Staged fights, Winter Classic and Dave Lozo from NHL.com
- Lindy Ruff’s broken ribs turn James Patrick into head coach vs. Bruins
- 2013 Winter Classic plan revealed; college, OHL games included
Latest stories and headlines from NHL.com
- Matt Frattin scores winner as Marlies defeat Rochester 4-3
- Flames D Smith signs 2-year deal for $1.55 million
- Michigan board gives AD go-ahead on Winter Classic
- Flames defenceman Derek Smith signs two-year deal worth US$1.55 million
- Injured Sabres coach Lindy Ruff won't be behind bench against Boston Bruins
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
