To Touch Or Not To Touch? What To Do With The Prince Of Wales Trophy
Broad Street Hockey Staff Writers Geoff Detweiler and Ben Rothenberg teamed up for this piece. And an update, HE TOUCHED IT.
As much as it may seem presumptive to be discussing this topic before the series is over, there's no other sensible time to have this debate.
Ben: So I was watching the final game of the Western Conference Final, which like the previous three was won by the Blackhawks, giving the team its first conference championship since 1992, way back before the "Western Conference" even existed.
But when they wheeled out the Clarence Campbell Cup to present to Chicago captain Jonathan Toews, he acted like there was nothing else in the world he'd rather be doing. Barely even looked at the trophy.
Why has it become so commonplace for players to reject the prize for winning their conference?
Geoff: Why? I wish I could answer that, but I don't know the origins of it. But I imagine the reason it's become so common place is tradition. When something is done for so long, it tends to stick. That's a pretty lame answer, so let me try these two.
(Way more debate after the jump, click on)
First, it's not just the NHL. Last year, when the Lakers won the West, they didn't touch the trophy or seem too excited about it.
Why the NBA and NHL does this and the NFL and MLB don't is a good question. But hockey players are extremely superstitious. They won't touch the Stanley Cup until they've won it, they grow playoff beards (or mullets), and eat grilled cheese before every game. And when one thing isn't working, they change it. Like Brodeur shaving his beard or Crosby picking up the trophy in 2009 after not touching it and losing the Cup in 2008.
But the real answer? Why celebrate when you haven't done what you set out to do? Yeah, it's an accomplishment to win the East, but it's also an accomplishment to get to the final four. That's not the goal. There's still more work to do and there's no time to celebrate.
Ben:
I understand that the Stanley Cup is forever the ultimate goal in the NHL, and that to a degree anything short of that goal is considered failure.
It would be one thing to ignore a conference championship if there wasn't an entire ceremony built around it, but there is. Toews was wearing a "Western Conference Champions" cap, and the screens around the arena read "Chicago Blackhawks 2010 Western Conference Champions." Regardless of what happens in the finals, the Blackhawks will hang a "Western Conference Champions 2009-10" banner at the beginning of next season, which is a pretty undeniable expression that what they accomplished yesterday is worthy of commemorating.
If Mike Richards is fortunate enough to be presented the Prince of Wales trophy tonight (or Wednesday or Friday), as a fan I don't want to see him take that moment for granted. Sure there's a greater goal in mind, but there's also the (depressing) possibility that it could be the most important piece of hardware he is handed this year, or (more depressingly) maybe even in his entire career.
Take this photo of Eric Lindros from 1997 (right). He didn't touch the Prince of Wales trophy, and then his team was swept in the finals. Lindros was never on a team that won its conference again, so in some ways that photo represents the pinnacle of his achievement in the sport. And yet he's not smiling, not seeming to embrace the moment at all, and is even doing that same hand-on-hip thing that Toews did. That 1997 team was the most successful in terms of playoff achievement of any Flyers team in the last 22 years, and yet Lindros seemed to think that his #3-seeded Flyers making the finals was nothing worth relishing for even a moment.
You know who deserves to relish that moment if they achieve it? Veterans Daniel Briere and Simon Gagne, each of whom is in his fourth Eastern Conference final and neither of whom has ever won one before.
And so do the rest of the 2009-10 Flyers, if only because of the improbability of their run. That a team with the 18th-best record in the league during the regular season who made it into the playoffs in Game 82 through a shootout could win their conference is an absolutely remarkable achievement, and its not something anyone should scoff at, much less the team itself.
Touching a trophy is not tantamount to hanging a "Mission Accomplished" banner across the Wachovia Center. But it would create a moment that could be looked back at fondly for the rest of the team's history. And if the Flyers go on to hoist a more famous trophy in a couple weeks, the moment of winning the East could very quickly be sent into the archives.
Geoff: Well, those are all excellent points. But there are some flaws.
The ceremony built around the trophy presentation isn't exactly awesome. All of the players are stiff and they're forced to wear hats and t-shirts. The celebration occurred after the game was over when everyone surrounds either a) the goalie or b) the overtime hero. The players celebrate their feat in much the same way as MLB and the NFL does, they just don't care about the trophy. There's something to be said for players who walk past their conference/league championship trophy and just pat it, but I don't think the ceremony demands that players do something. They can celebrate their win how they choose.
And if the players choose they want the pinnacle of their careers up to this point - as in Briere or Gagne - to be cherished, I'm pretty sure they can do that in ways other than touching a trophy. They can enjoy it in the post-game scrum, the post-game locker room, the ride home, when they spend the evening with their wives, when the season is over and they get their Eastern Conference memorabilia, or when they see the banner raised the next year. But this is getting away from the act of touching the trophy.
It is the Captain who shuns the hardware publicly, but I'm sure you're not advocating for the entire team to touch it, carry it around the ice, or even pose for a photo with it. So really, this is a hypothetical argument involving only Mike Richards.
Truthfully, I bet Richards could care less about the Eastern Conference Trophy. I mean, the guy has won a Memorial Cup, a Calder Cup, a World Juniors Silver Medal, World Juniors Gold Medal, and Olympic Gold. The only thing left for him to win is a Stanley Cup. If he never wins one, I'm pretty sure he's not going to look back at the time he won a Wales Trophy and didn't touch it as a mistake.
Maybe players should smile when the accept the trophy. I mean, it's not like they're standing next to Gary Bettman. But touching it? Being happy that they won a trophy only about 500 people know the name of? Nah. The players can be proud of their accomplishment - as they should be - but wait another 2 weeks before they giggle like school girls over a trophy.
51 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Touch the Wales Trophy?
Are you out of your mind?!?! I saw the Stanley Cup and I wouldn’t touch it, and I’m not even on the Flyers. That’s a curse. We’ll take the next one, thank you. Every Hockey Player alive knows you don’t touch the Cup until it’s yours, and you NEVER touch the conference trophy. I know last year the penguins did, but only because in the previous year not touching it didn’t work for them. There’s no way Richards should touch that trophy. If he does I’ll probably scream for two solid hours words that rhyme with truck.
Touch the Wales Trophy…BAH. Heathens.
You won’t even get your picture taken with it? I did, and when I refused to touch it, everyone mocked me. Hey, I played hockey. Thems the rules.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on May 24, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe if they touched the year before they wouldn’t have lost. They touch it and win the Stanley Cup.
I wasn't even a year old but I stayed up to be outside the Vet with my Dad and Mom when the Phillies won the World Series 1980.
by Christopher A on May 24, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
You never ever touch the Cup before you earn it!
Your never ever supposed to be content winning your conference.
If you chose to show this by not acknowledging the trophy and not touching it, thats fine.
If you chose to lift the Wales trophy up and still know, now, more than ever the season is not yet a success, thats fine too.
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on May 24, 2010 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m in agreement with Pardini, you don’t touch it. I thought what the Penguins did last year was kind of neat, but like Pardini said, they got there last year, didn’t touch it, and lost, so it gave them a different perspective. Enjoy the run, enjoy the trophy, it’s an accomplishment, even though it isn’t the ultimate goal. However, I feel they earned it by getting there the second year and were trying something different. First year to get there = do not touch.
Why isn’t their an option for “Doesn’t Matter”? It’s not going to change the outcome of a single game, and the only person it might piss off is Don Cherry. Just as long as you don’t carry the thing around the rink like it’s the last time you’ll ever come close to touching a team trophy, who cares what they do with it.
You know who touched the Prince of Wales Trophy?
This guy!

That was in 1985, right before the Flyers lost to the Oilers in 5 games in the Finals. He did it again in 1987, and the results were slightly better (7 games instead of 5) but ultimately still the same.
Lindros didn’t touch it in 1997 and the team got swept.
I really don’t care either way. I voted Yes because I felt like it. Had the spirit moved me I’d have voted No.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Looks like it didn’t matter to touch or not I voted yes too.
I wasn't even a year old but I stayed up to be outside the Vet with my Dad and Mom when the Phillies won the World Series 1980.
by Christopher A on May 24, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
he also played the greatest team of all time. He could have touched jesus and it still wouldnt of mattered.
"Shugah n' rainbows"
"We will steal the show, jolly Rogers go, we are wolves of the sea."
"Werwolf Bar Mitzvah. Spooky Scary. Boys becoming men. Men becoming wolves."
Jesus would have just said, “Dude I have no power over Gretzky, he is the great one. I’m just the savior of the world…”
"Game 7's are tough... It's a game that's made for men and our guys proved to be men today." -Laviolette
by PatterPoet95 on May 24, 2010 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Would Jesus have addressed Dave Poulin as “Duder” or “His Dudeness” or “El Duderino” if he wasn’t into the whole brevity thing?

Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I am not sure- I just love having Jesus utilizing surfer/Lebowski lingo… It can’t be helped on my part, I apologize if it offends.
"Game 7's are tough... It's a game that's made for men and our guys proved to be men today." -Laviolette
by PatterPoet95 on May 24, 2010 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Richards should touch it. But he better not think for a second about raising it above his head or doing anything more than smiling for the picture.
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here, this is the war room."
by Grp_Cpt_Lionel_Mandrake on May 24, 2010 2:01 PM EDT reply actions
Oh to have this be the most important debate regarding one's team.
Richards should take it and throw it off a bridge.
The Guess Who sucked, the Jets were lousy anyway
by Plea From A Cat Named Felix on May 24, 2010 2:09 PM EDT reply actions
I don’t really care whether he touches it or not, but hopefully he can avoid looking like he doesn’t want to be there. Toews looks like he doesn’t even want to be in the same time zone with that trophy.
Honor is no substitute for victory.
he did do an awkward shrug thing like “yeah, I know and no way am I touching that thing.”
Watch it with the jinxing!
Time for some thrillin' heroics!
A well written and interesting topic. I am not a fan of superstition or superstitious players. As has been pointed already them touching or not touching the trophy won’t mean jack in terms of them winning the cup. To win you do need some lucky breaks to go your way but mostly you have to play well and be better prepared then the other team.
I also think there should have been a distinction made between the “superstitious” things done prior to a game that goes with having a routine. For example Giroux eating a grilled cheese before every game is as much about him preparing himself mentally and getting focused as it is about trying to create good luck (or stay away from bad luck). This is at least somewhat different then not touching a trophy as a part of what amounts to a superstitious ceremeony.
Finally, and a much smaller point, there wasn’t any real mention of the fans in this discussion and I think there is something to be said for the team enjoying the moment and sharing the accomplishment with the fans. I mean I care about the team and all but really I am the most important person out there and I want them to celebrate damn it
"Game 7's are tough... It's a game that's made for men and our guys proved to be men today." -Laviolette
I voted don’t touch it!
Off subject, but where would the finals be if the Flyers win the series and how do they determine it?
Chicago has home ice advantage, if that’s what you mean, since the Hawks had 112 points and the Flyers had 88.
Watch it with the jinxing!
Time for some thrillin' heroics!
Thanks, I didn’t know they went by points. It been a while since I had to think about it
by SkookFlyerfan on May 24, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions
A bit off-topic, but this was a good story on Fanhouse yesterday:
http://nhl.fanhouse.com/2010/05/23/flyers-hold-team-tradition-history-close-during-cup-run/
P.S. I voted against touching it – fans’ superstitions are meaningless to on-ice action, but players’ superstitions potentially could be, if enough of any given team believed it.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on May 24, 2010 2:57 PM EDT reply actions
could be meaningful, I meant to say
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on May 24, 2010 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Pish-tosh to superstitions, I say!
Don’t worry about touching the trophy or not — My first ever playoff beard is what is carrying this team right now anyway!
Touch the Damn Thing!
This is ridiculous all this omen stuff. Celebrate the win. As in the last win I will not be on line during the game because the only game I have been in this series so far was game 3. :-)
Just Call Me "M"!
just get the feeling tonight is going to be like 2006 vs buffalo, except the flyers are the ones handing out the pain.
and yeah, touch the thing. if nobody(team captains) touches their respective conference trophies, this jinx only works half the time.
Eat what the monkey eats, then eat the monkey. -U.S. Navy survival guidance
Hmmmmm so maybe in order to not have the jinx Richards needs to touch it since Towes already did not touch it? Kind of like a reverse-reverse jinx…
"Game 7's are tough... It's a game that's made for men and our guys proved to be men today." -Laviolette
by PatterPoet95 on May 24, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions
well, I’m a pretty superstitiuous guy. I wore the same shirt for the last 3 wins of the devils series. They lost the first bruins game, I wore a different shirt every time, until they won again, then I wore that shirt for 7 games and of course, now I’m onto a new shirt with a one game winning streak.
That said (if and when we close out the Canadiens), I say he should touch the trophy. Smile and celebrate and enjoy the accomplishment. This team was left for dead so many times this season and the playoffs and they’ve battled back and every win is litterally icing on the cake at this point. *Raise your hand if you thought they would be even sniffing the Stanley Cup Finals. Mikefive, you don’t count.
Already, every talking head/sportswriter, even myself gives this team NO SHOT of winning against the Blackhawks, so superstition be damned. Let’s go out with guns a blazing.
Managing Editor - HockeyOutsiders.com
by HockeyOutsiders on May 24, 2010 3:39 PM EDT reply actions
Why don’t I count? Are you referring to Travis’ digging up my comment from last year?
If so, that was then and this is now. When these playoffs started I expected that they’d beat New Jersey since they did so well against them during the regular season. That’s it, though. I expected nothing else after that.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Crash Davis sums up my feelings below quite nicely
Crash Davis: I told him that a player on a streak has to respect the streak.
Annie Savoy: Oh fine.
Crash Davis: You know why? Because they don’t – -they don’t happen very often.
Annie Savoy: Right.
Crash Davis: If you believe you’re playing well because you’re getting laid, or because you’re not getting laid, or because you wear women’s underwear, then you ARE! And you should know that!
"Tortorella’s got it all wrong ... Gaborik shouldn’t be messing with our skilled player." -Peter Luukko
“How does Kevin Costner keep getting work?”

Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Touch it!
Superstitions didn’t get us where we are…being a great hockey club is what it is all about. So I say TOUCH IT! Not dance around like this the ultimate prize, but in recognition that, hey, we earned this! Enjoy it for a moment…then go get ready for Chicago…
This got sort of raised before, but since all the comments are just re-hashes of “yes” or “no”, I’ll rehash in my own words too.
If it were a situation where the whole team gathered around, I couldn’t care less what any individual guy decided to do.
But in this situation, where Richie as captain is up there for everyone, I think he should shun it. Nobody on the team is going to be pissed that he shunned it, and some might be pissed if he touched it. So as a representative, he needs to represent his team, and I suspect the only strong opinions are the “no” votes.
I don’t think they should touch the trophy, but I also hate when they wear shirts and hats that say “Conference Champions”. If I was a player I wouldn’t wear either of them for the same reasons.
On a side note, I don’t like it either when fans by shirts and hats that say “Conference/Divison/League” Champions. It’s a pet peeve of mine. It’s another form of celebrating and being contempt with where you are, regardless of winning the championship of respective league.
Only buy Championship gear, that’s the only one that matters.
Flyers, the only Philly team that matters
Wow, the voting on this has totally swung. No led 75-25 early, and now the yeses have it at 50-49.
The Daily Forehand -- SB Nation's Tennis Destination.
Broad Street Hockey.
Ben nailed it. I remember how “awesome” it was when Lindros didn’t touch it in 1997. A week later when we were the laughing stock of the NHL I wish we had enjoyed that moment.
In 2008 when the Phils won the pennant we went out in the streets. It felt amazing. The team had a real accomplishment, we enjoyed it, and it made the celebration two weeks later even better.
If we win tonight, let’s party, cause I’ve waited 13 years for this moment. Then they need to turn around and get ready for Chicago (IF we win).

by 


























