The Day After: Silver Linings After Losing A Shot At The Cup
by Travis Hughes on Jun 10, 2010 4:54 PM EDT
in Commentary
346 comments
The Flyers lost. The season is over. But hey, chin up! It's not so bad...
- We get to raise a banner next year. No matter what anybody tells us, the Philadelphia Flyers were the best team in the Eastern Conference this season. We were better than the Capitals. We were better than the Penguins. We were better than the Devils, the Sabres, the Senators and the Bruins. The rest of 'em, too.
- We have Chris Pronger for a long time.
- Our team played hockey yesterday. The Penguins are flushing toilets today.
- How much did our team grow this year? Our biggest complaint over the course of the regular season was that they had no killer instinct, or that they weren't a cohesive group, or that they were just a bad team. In the last two months, the Flyers threw all of that to the side. They became the team we all know they could be. With a few inevitable (and a few necessary) moves, this team is only going to get better. They've tasted the Cup, and they're going to be hungrier than ever come the fall.
- Our third round pick stays in Philly this year, baby.
- We have a whole season under Peter Laviolette to look forward to.
- Ville freakin' Leino. Holy cow. This guy is going to be so much fun to watch over the next several years.
- Think of the bandwagon that jumped on over the course of this playoff run. At least half a million people, you have to assume. If a couple hundred of those people become diehard fans, the game of hockey in our area will only continue to get better. The quality of our fanbase will only continue to grow. Flyers tradition will only continue to grow.
- Come July 1, just a short 20 days away, Mike Rathje comes off the books. Let us repeat: Mike Rathje comes off the books in 20 days.
Add to the list below.
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I’m going to repeat this one again. We got Ville Leino for a bag of pucks. Omg that guy is scary good.
Oh how about these:
-Briere is worth his contract.
-Hartnell found his game.
-Hopefully the goalie injury carousel ends.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:03 PM EDT reply actions
It increases my confidence in Homer's trading
When not worrying about cap management (eg. Upshall dump with the 2nd rounder last season), he’s made some solid trades over his GM career.
Here we turned nothing (OKT = AHL level, 5th rounder = likely AHL level) into something potentially great (Ville Leino = best rookie playoff performance ever). And it feels good.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions
He completely swindles other gm’s when it comes to trades. Look what he did to Nashville or Atlanta. In homer’s defense dumping Upshall wasn’t just getting Carbomb, it also gave us cap flexibility to fit Giroux and Briere back in.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions
It makes me somewhat more confident as to what he could get for Carter
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks!
I must say thanks to both the Flyers and Broad Street Hockey. I like the makeup of the team now I hope they get some time and training to get a 5th and 6th defensemen that do not suck completely. Between Leighton, Boosh and Backlund – sign them all (Boosh is signed) and play next year. The goalie on this team does not have to be super – just make the saves he is supposed to make. Go Flyers!
Phigment
…but the problem is that often Boosh and Leights don’t make the saves they are suppose to make. For example, Leights should have made a save on the OT winner.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 8:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Carter is a lazy player ,not willing to do the dirty work along the boards,and shoots high &wide on 9/10 shots.His play is also contageous.Upon his return Gagne dissapeared.This has been an ongoing problem that I have followed throughout the season.He is alot like Kovalchuck………….Big,Lazy and NO DEFENSE.
We don't want to lose him for nothing
Although if he gets an offer sheet for 6 million, will that get us two 1st rounders?
That said, I doubt a GM would risk their reputation by offerring Jeff Carter an offer sheet.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 7:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Depends on how much, which depends on the year, but here’s what this year’s compensation chart looks like:
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions
OK so it would likely be a 1st, a 2nd and a 3rd. I think for our purposes and considering we’re not a team that’s attempting a rebuild I’d rather go with a 1st and a solid prospect. Even though 2nds and 3rds can turn out to be good as well (look at Duncan Keith), they’re less likely to be able to step in and contribute immediately (eg. what Taylor Hall might be doing with Boston next season).
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Following up on that, we can’t be too active in the “offering dual sheets” like CNB proposes, but how much could someone with the appropriate draft picks hose up the Blackhawks by offering Hammer $1.5MM and Niemi $3.1MM? it would force the Hawks’ hand pretty badly.
Honor is no substitute for victory.
That’s entirely true, but it wouldn’t be too bad. The Hawks would be able to a) Retain draft picks; b) save some cap money (if they choose Hammer); and c) have most of the hockey world feel bad for them as Bowman can bitch like Burke.
But offering what you just said would be a shrewd move for a GM.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 15, 2010 1:29 AM EDT up reply actions
The flyers provided a team that makes Philly proud.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:07 PM EDT reply actions
-Mike Richards has seen someone else lift the cup in his house. Mike Richards doesn’t like, gets hungry, decapitates star player on every team he faces.
-Scott Hartnell shaves.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:11 PM EDT reply actions
We were better than the Penguins. We were better than the Devils, the Sabres, the Senators and the Sabres.
One of those “Sabres” should say “Bruins.”
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I said Canadiens, but Bruins is a lot better.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Easily add Canucks and Sharks to that list
Hopefully after a little waiting period it’s OK for a Chicago guy to say the Flyers really impressed in the finals. I didn’t think it would be that tough, but this could easily have gone 7 and if we’d have switched goalies would have probably been a different result. Great team that deserved to be in the finals.
Also, I have to say a lot of class on the BSH blog in handling the series and the hard losses. While Canuck and Shark fans are STILL trying to convince the world and themselves that they have a better team this year than the Hawks, you guys gave a lot of credit when it was due. And after watching all the Hawks playoff games, I have no doubt you’d have swept the Sharks and maybe even the Canucks as neither are remotely close to being as solid a team as the Flyers.
Great series and I think you may enjoy another CUP soon in the near future after the Hawks get CAPstrated.
While…Shark fans are STILL trying to convince the world and themselves that they have a better team this year than the Hawks
What? Where
"Sorry guys, I’m not going to try and hit (Douglas) Murray anymore. It doesn’t work." - Steve Ott, Dallas Stars.
by SwisherThresher on Jun 11, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions
flyer’s eulogy is up
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puck_daddy/post/Eulogy-Remembering-the-2009-10-Philadelphia-Fly;_ylt=Atq0chZ88aAqNqi.oNDFj4x7vLYF?urn=nhl,247345
done by Pens fans. It’s sad but true. They actually give us props but it most of it focuses on leights
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:21 PM EDT reply actions
Not bad. Two things:
1) That image of Leighton down with the puck in the net is just… bad.
2) In that same image, you can tell Leighton is still wearing his pads from Carolina. There’s a Hurricanes logo on his right leg.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions
you expect him to buy new pants on his salary? are you f’ing crazy?
Managing Editor - HockeyOutsiders.com
by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions
me too, but that’s not the point. If you’re a goalie on your 18th NHL team, maybe spray painting over the last team’s logo is the way to go.
I didn’t think the Eulogy was that great, btw. It was ok….they should have gotten DGB to write it though.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
going off this idea, I think we should petition puckdaddy to let the loser of the SC final pick the writer to do their Eulogy. How great would that be?
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
If you can buy a mask, a blocker, a glove, and a set of pads, why stop at pants? OR, why not get one of those covers that a lot of skaters use when they have the wrong color pants?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Dude can’t buy a sharpie even?
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on Jun 10, 2010 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
comfort? He didn’t expect to be around as long as he was?
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
perhaps he was a Carolina plant all along sent here by the Hurricanes to sabotage our cup run? Ever thought of that?
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
perhaps he was a Carolina plant
Hmmm… I’ve never seen him at team meals. He just drinks water and stands out in the sun… because he’s a PLANT. He feeds himself through photosynthesis.
That would be awesome / creepy. He could then speak unironically about wanting to “put down [his] roots” in Philly.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
he’s gone at the end of the year anyway. no need to get new pads
TAKE THE FALL, ACT HURT, GET INDIGNANT
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 10, 2010 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions
the more I see images and videos of that goal the more it just seems terrible. how the hell did that get through? seriously
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
That failing to choke paragraph sums up why I love this team.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on Jun 10, 2010 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
How about...
… The Flyers are a goalie, a 3rd pairing, and a scoring winger away from being a Cup Contender again. While that may seem like a tall order, we now have more flexibility in tradeable assets and cap money than we have in recent years.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Well they are a cup contender. They are just a couple pieces (see site’s tagline) from being champions. I think I will permanently have the image of Leights looking like swiss cheese while some d-bag with a mullet celebrates implanted in my brain.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions
are we really?
Because I’m not nearly as optomistic as you.
I’m of the “damn, we were really lucky the stars aligned and we made this run, but….” mind.
Maybe I’m just a consummate Philly fan.
Once again, I hope I’m very, very wrong.
It doesn’t take away what an amazing spring this has been though.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions
If they keep this roster exactly the same as it is now, then no, they will not contend for the Cup again.
If they get a goalie, a decent third pairing, and a scoring winger to complement Richards and Gagne, then I believe they WILL be a contender again.
But you’re right, this roster was pretty damn lucky to make this run. They need some tweaks and they need to stay healthy. If they can do that, then they’ll be back in the Finals. In essence, they need to do what Pittsburgh did between 2008 and 2009; they need to keep the core intact and make a few adjustments to the periphery of the team.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Well, I know everyone is pointing to this as an example of how you can get a “mediocre” goalie and make a run, I’d say, that’s probably false.
I’d say we need a goalie that is not a reclamation project, I think that might cost some money.
As for the third pairing, it wonder how easy that is going to be considering we will probably still be snuggled against the cap.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Depends how much Coburn costs, but remember that Bettman predicted the cap would go up around $2 million and we’ll lose the remains of Randy Jones’ salary.
Plus, with Rathje coming off the books, the Flyers will have flexibility and be able to take on players’ salaries on a per-diem basis if they have any more scrap-heap pickups like they did this year.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I was actually told that Rathje’s contract was the thing that killed the Carter for Vokoun deal.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Coburn’s season, matched with his Finals showing (he was good, but the stats aren’t as kind) should keep his salary down, I would think.
Who was the d-man on waivers that Mario was so hot on? Stuart? Too bad we didn’t get him.
I’d think Bartulis is at least one half of that third pairing regardless.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
He actually wanted Nick Boynton. I wanted him, too. Of course, Chicago got him and he was a big improvement over Jordan Hendry in the last 3 games.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I thought it was Boynton, but couldn’t remember. Figures, Kane>JVR, Boynton>Krajicek
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I wanted Boynton too!
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess you should become more of an insufferable like mariod and then people would remember it. haha.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I wrote a story about it! It was on the front page!
But honestly, while Boynton>Krajicek, Lukas wasn’t terrible. Yeah, he’s not very good, but Boynton was getting scratched for Hendry.
If Hendry>Boynton, Boynton can’t be too much better than Krajicek.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
didn’t he get cut from the Panthers? So yeah, I’m sure he’s not that great.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Lightning.
But still. Boynton got cut from the Ducks, so yeah, I’m sure he’s not that great either.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I know Krajicek was from the Lightning, but Boynton played for the Panthers for a time anyway, it was last season.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, Boynton was either cut or traded, but I think he was just cut in the offseason…floated around for a bit. He played out here in Phoenix for a few years. Great guy, has fairly serious diabetes, has to monitor his blood sugar between periods and everything…
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by Jordan Ellel on Jun 10, 2010 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Shit, Bob Clarke is diabetic. That means if we get Boynton here, we’ll win the Cup!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I forgot that…and I’ve watched the Broad Street Bullies doc at least 5 times now…
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by Jordan Ellel on Jun 10, 2010 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Krajicek was drafted by the Panthers.
If you go on YouTube, you can watch the video of Mike Knuble in 2005 scoring a shortie against the Panthers in with 3.2 seconds to go in the game. The play was started when Robert Esche made a save on a point shot from Lukas Krajicek.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
so Leighton was sent by the Hurricanes to sabotage our cup run and Krajicek by the Lightning?
F the southeast division!
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions
woot! maybe we can spend some on a goalie but there’s not much out there.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I’d say we need a goalie that is not a reclamation project, I think that might cost some money.
This is why Homer wanted to get a young, talented goalie this summer. They need an improvement back there, but they won’t be able to bring in Tomas Vokoun and keep the team around him intact.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
While I know I am “mariod’ing” the Carter for Vokoun trade, I only wanted to do that at the trade deadline because I thought at the time that would make a difference and actually make this team a cup contender.
Now, I’m definitely in the Carter for picks + young goalie prospect camp.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
If the Flyers re-sign Leighton, I’d love it if they could swing Carter, Boucher, and a pick/prospect for Brown and Bernier.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I don’t think the Kings will give up Brown + Bernier for Carter, but what do I know.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think the Kings will give up Brown
You probably could have stopped there.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
How about Simmonds? I want someone good to play with Richie and Gags.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I don’t think LA is giving up either of those guys.
Do we want Justin Williams back?
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
no to williams back. he is too injury prone. I’d rather have sharp back
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Honestly, if we’re trading with LA, they’ll give us a D before they give us a RW.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
how good is Thomas Hickey?
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Not sure. he is coming off an injury, I believe.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
who is out there? Carey Price? Young and has potential but has issues. Dan Ellis? not sold. Nabby? too old and pricey, can’t win big games. Turco? ditto.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I still say we put up offer sheet for Niemi, if for no reason other than to piss the Hawks off
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Price is on the list, seems that one of the Caps prospects is there, Bernier of the LA Kings and I’ve also heard Schneider who is in the Canucks system.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I say we form a posse and tell Homer to get on the phone with the Kings now to get Bernier and Brown for Carter
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
None of the people you mentioned match the description of young and/or talented.
People are thinking more along the lines of AHL-star-that-is-NHL-ready.
Oh I know that. the market for goalies is terrible for the Flyers unless they trade for a young stud
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Montreal’s turned him into a headcase though by putting him under all this pressure so young. So the talent’s there, but not always used.
So perhaps the best thing for a VERY young but VERY talented goalie would be to have a very strong back-checking and shot-blocking team in front of him. Not that the Habs were bad at shot-blocking, mind you – they were awful at backchecking. Hmm, I think I know such a good team … I seem to remember them wearing horrid orange jerseys … :)
Yes but the pressure in Philly could be worse than the pressure in Montreal, especially if Price is coming in being talked about as the final piece to a team that finished 2 wins short of the Cup.
by historywillbemade on Jun 12, 2010 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Entirely true. But anybody who thinks Price is the savior is best referred to as a “WIP caller”.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 12, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed.
That’s one thing I don’t miss living abroad.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jun 12, 2010 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions
They were a contender starting the year, came up empty during the regular season and played like they should in the playoffs. The Flyers are back in a big way next year, NO DOUBT.
Despite my optimism, they boys played poorly last night and even with chicago playing great, the Flyers still would have won easily if some of the softest goals ever don’t go in. The game winner was the definition of a soft goal. it’s etched in my mind.
Silver Linings
NHL11 is going to kick ass.
- We won’t have to switch the away team to the Flyers, it will be the Flyers on default!
- Junior teams
- Everything that was mentioned in Geoff’s fly-by link
- There is no way that Patrick Kane will be on the cover next year!
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
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Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on Jun 11, 2010 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Doesn’t sound like a fair trade to me…haha.
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on Jun 11, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Why was the banner changed? It should have stayed the same with the pic of leights from the eulogy
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 5:56 PM EDT reply actions
hey boys-I read your gameday comments and I for one was very impressed with the class shown here. My reason for commenting now is why the hell were the majority of fans at the Wach booing Toews when he got his trophies? We here in Chicago thought that was quite disrespectful and classless. I am not trolling just commenting. I know you guys were not there. Anyway-your team played one heck of a series. Easily could have been a different game 6 outcome then who knows what would have happened friday. Thats all I have . Flyers should be very strong next year – no doubt.
I think they were all still booing Bettman.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Some folks thought Pronger had a shot at the Conn Smythe and were a little upset about him not winning it, I guess. The Flyers have had two people from losing teams get the Conn Smythe trophy – Reggie Leach in 1976 and Ron Hextall in 1987 – so this wouldn’t have been the first time this happened.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
They weren’t Boos, they were saying MOOOOOOOOVERS for when they take the Hardware back to Chicago.
Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"
by Ed Van Chimp on Jun 10, 2010 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions
“Are you saying ‘Boooo’ or ‘Boooo-urns?’”
“I was saying ‘Booo-urns…’”
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I wholeheartedly support this statement
by Hansmoleman on Jun 13, 2010 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I was there. There were a handful of boos. 95 percent of the crowd applauded or stood silently.
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by Travis Hughes on Jun 10, 2010 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions
congrats. Enjoy it. Sorry about the cap situation.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
We’ll take Niemi off your hands. As you can tell from the comments on this site, we need a goalie. Keep Huet though. We won’t help you out of that mess
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
But as HO said, the boos were mostly for Bettman.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
hell, i was booing Bettman at home for 20 minutes after the game ended. Then my wife told me I had to go to bed.
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by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 10, 2010 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I was booing him from home too. My wife the told me if I woke the baby she would beat me senseless. The beer beat to that though.
Chicago Tom, Honestly it was bettman they booed. To be honest, they wpould not have waited around after THAT loss just to boo Toews. Seriously, they would only stay to pay respect for the win.
That and we love to boo bettman.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Jun 11, 2010 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
I wonder if Homer will try to get contract extensions done with Carter, Giroux, and Leino since they are all heading into the last year of their deals.
Hopefully not until he resolves the goaltending situation. I think he should do it for Giroux and Leino pronto
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions
As much as we harp on Homer for all those long-term deals, I’m 100% okay with him giving long-term deals to Leino and (especially) Giroux. If it knocks down the cap hit for G a good bit, I’m okay with a NTC (not a NMC). I’m not okay with Leino getting any kind of Homerrific clause unless it means his cap hit remains at 6 figures.
I read yesterday that pretty much every day leading up to the trade deadline Homer kept on getting phone call after phone call about Giroux so it wouldn’t surprise me if he gets a NTC
Agreed.
He’s a keeper.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jun 11, 2010 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
if they let Giroux get away, I’ll have a difficult time continuing to support this team. I’ll do it, because I don’t know any other way….but I won’t be happy about it.
If they trade away Giroux we should tattoo “MORON” across Homer’s forehead.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Jun 11, 2010 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Giroux for, say, Luongo or Lundquist? Straight up? Ryan Miller? I realize that’s dreaming, but there are trades that would make me say “hmmm”.
If he is traded, I may climb a clock tower…just sayin
by JerseyDriver on Jun 11, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Giroux stays. Homer would agree if he posted here.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jun 12, 2010 6:03 AM EDT up reply actions
i’d take Miller for Giroux. Not Lu, though. Lu’s lousy at taking any kind of responsibility. An embarrassment to any NHL club.
Of course you would – you’re a Blackhawks fan. ;)
There is no Flyers fan who would let Giroux go anywhere else. He is part of the nucleus of our team going forward.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jun 14, 2010 4:12 AM EDT up reply actions
For the next offseason
We have Gagne and Leino (UFA) and Carter and Giroux (RFA). If Gagne takes a bit of a paycut and Carter gets a bit of a raise, we don’t have the money to re-sign both Leino and Giroux. Remember Leino was never in the long-term plans before that trade and these playoffs. Now that he is, we need to adjust around it. So they can’t re-sign all four of them.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. One of them has to go and I say it has to be Carter as he has biggest contract and would net us the biggest return. Gags is a lifer and will take a pay cut and Giroux and Leino are the future.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions
We probably wouldn’t get much back for Gags either. And this organization is like a family – which is part of what I really like about the Flyers – and so I would think there would be a strong group saying Gagne should stay a Flyer till he retires.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m kind of thinking we shouldn’t do it yet. We need to evaluate the progress of Giroux, JVR, and Leino and then if that all seems set then goodbye Carter hello something nice
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions
There are too many centers. And the ones we have all have value. Most obvious answer is one will be moved. I’d rather keep them all, but that does not seem to be as effective as we’d like.
It looks like Carter will go, but we’ll just have to wait and see.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Jun 11, 2010 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
We can brag that we have lost more finals then every team in the league but the canadiens have ever been in. We got that going for us.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 10, 2010 6:35 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
have we really? jeez 6 finals loses. You’d have to think that at one point this franchise has to break through especially when they put up a good quality team every year.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
That would be called optimism, and it has no place in this city.
Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"
by Ed Van Chimp on Jun 10, 2010 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Blame 2008 Phils for optimism, but very quickly is it getting warped away again after watching Damon’s steal and Leighton’s brain fart.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions
yep, it’s true just looked it up. Boston is pretty close though. They have 5 losing appearances since winning the cup and have a longer drought
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions
It can be seen as a positive in that just getting to the finals is a hell of an accomplishment and being in so many shows this organization has always strived to be the best. However it hurts like bitch to keep losing these things. Damn it was so improbable but it was so close you could smell it.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 10, 2010 8:38 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Apart from this season, we’ve been coming up against dynasties and losing. Every team we’ve lost to apart from Chicago had won or did win more cups soon while we’ve been watching our drought extend and extend and extend…
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. Look at the dynasties the Flyers lost to: the 1980s Islanders, the late 1970s Canadiens, the 1980s Oilers, and the late 1990s Red Wings. Those dynasties have 15 cups between them.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions
You can probably also add to that the Flyers lost to the Marty Brodeur Devils in the Eastern conference finals 2 of the 3 times they won the cup
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Tampa Bay as well.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 10, 2010 8:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
yeah but Tampa wasn’t a dynasty. The Devils are arguable a dynasty as they won 3 cups in less than 10 years
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions
I totally could. After they tied the game, all I could think was that this is going to game 7 and we are going to win. I’m so proud of this team and believed in them the entire time (well after game 4 in Boston series). This organization really wants to win.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Great post..that helped a bit. In my 20’s I used to get crazy angry, now, it’s just depressing when we lose. Even still, as a Hockey lover, this was a great run with such amazing memories. Anytime we get to play into June..it’s a plus. I look for the boys to back next year. Rathje coming off the books is huge. Very huge.
Any chance Ryan Miller wants a trade out of Buffalo? He makes 6.25 Million until 2014…who could we unload to grab him…I hear he wants a trade, of course that’s just wishful rumor speech though :/
6.25 million through to 14/15
It’s a big contract.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Other silver linings ...
— We might have too many goalies next year. If Leighton and Backlund are re-signed and a certain stellar veteran from Dallas who says he wants a chance at the cup is signed, that’s a glut of goalies. What a great problem to have.
— The farm team might be good next year. Something tells me Homer will make some moves to add youth to the roster. Just a hunch.
— Chicago’s about to be dismantled. They’re capped out. Somebody has to go. Look for them to offer crazy buyouts to some of their veterans (Huet? Sopel?) and trade guys like Versteeg or Sharp.
— Our Eastern foes are capped out, too. Washington’s got some tough decisions to make. So do Pittsburgh and New Jersey.
— If you’re not already looking forward to October yet, you don’t deserve to be a Flyers’ fan.
I’m not so sure about Turco. He has been sliding last few season, unless he is going to take a deal worth 2-3 million a year, it’s a bad idea. Even if we do sign Turco for dirt cheap, we still need to develop a goalie of the future.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
We might have too many goalies next year. If Leighton and Backlund are re-signed and a certain stellar veteran from Dallas who says he wants a chance at the cup is signed, that’s a glut of goalies. What a great problem to have.
There’s absolute no way even two of the goalies you named are in Philadelphia next year, let alone three.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah. If we sign Turco, Leights won’t be back or if we sign both, boosh has a one way ticket out of town via trade
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Leighton and Coby just got introduced at the Phillies game and were given standing ovations. I think there’s a silver lining hidden in that — remember like two months ago when it sounded like Coburn wasn’t thrilled with the prospect of staying in Philadelphia next season? I bet that’s changed.
I pray to all that is holy that Leighton isn’t starting next year
Please Baby Jesus, say it ain’t so
TAKE THE FALL, ACT HURT, GET INDIGNANT
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 10, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t mind keeping Coburn. Does anyone else think that he might turn it arond next season and return to being that potential top pairer that people thought he was?
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Coburn is going to be fine if they just let him keep it simple and not expect him to be an offensive puck moving defenseman. He finally got his game together and looked really good. He has to be here next year. They need to ad a couple NHL capable dmen to spell pronger and timonen without losing too much.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 10, 2010 8:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
This is so true. He looked good and seemed to be playing strong. Shoring up that 3rd pair will be a must to help Prongs and Kimmo.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Jun 11, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
-Chicago is in terrible cap hell for next year.
by historywillbemade on Jun 10, 2010 7:35 PM EDT reply actions
In the last 50 years...
you know, since the Hawks last won the Cup, only 26 teams have even been in the Final, let alone won it.
The Flyers have now been there 8 times and won it twice. Only Montreal and Detroit have been to the big dance more than Philadelphia, and the Flyers only started in 1967.
What’s more, the Flyers were the first non-“original six” team to win it.
Broad Street’s Back Baby!
This factor would assert that they really never leave, right. And Montreal cheated, lied and stole all the best Canadian talent for decades so they need to be removed from the competition.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 10, 2010 8:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Well, I wouldn't call Sam Pollock a liar, a cheat or a thief...
if he had used his talent for good (the Flyers) instead of…
Anyway, using Detroit and Montreal was for comparison purposes only…pretty much the only use I have for them.
by TopShelfTony on Jun 10, 2010 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Question:
What is up with all of Chicago bitching about the Wachovia Center booing last night? I heard booing Bettman and modest boos for Toews, but by the time the Cup was given out there were plenty of Hawks fans in the lower level.
Was I too shocked to hear the boos, or does Chicago already have nothing else to talk about?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 10, 2010 8:49 PM EDT reply actions
They are still bitching about pronger cross checking people in front of the net as if this isn’t how the sport is played. That 260 pound baby and his cry baby coach whined like infants.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 10, 2010 8:54 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You (addressing chicago fans) won the cup
Please concentrate on enjoying it. Do it justice.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 9:05 PM EDT up reply actions
They are too sensitive
Are were listening for them. I watched it and barely heard any except for Bettman (deserved) and Toews (some thought he prob shouldn’t have won the CS, sue them). I thought the Philly fans were very respectful.
I would ask the Chicago fans if the situation were reversed, how would they have reacted? Plenty of other teams fans have booed while our Flyers stood in the handshake line getting to the SCF.
"Tortorella’s got it all wrong ... Gaborik shouldn’t be messing with our skilled player." -Peter Luukko
There was a fair amount of booing when Toews was awarded the CS, but I thought the fans were booing the choice of Toews for the award, not Toews himself. While Toews did alot in the rounds leading up to the Final, he was ineffective against the Flyers. I was far more impressed with the play of Duncan Keith.
In Latvia, they're rooting for Bartulis' team, the Filadelfijas Flaieri!
Agreed.
Keith (if the winner was from the Hawks), and Briere (if the winner was from the Flyers) were better choices.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jun 11, 2010 8:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Hey, you buy a ticket you get to watch and express your opinions on anything that takes place at the game:
before, during or after.
Oh, right. Things are different in Chicago. There you also get to drown out the national anthem.
by TopShelfTony on Jun 10, 2010 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Wasn't all of Chicago
The bar I was watching in, we all knew the booing was for The Beav (our nickname for Bettman).
That was one helluva series. Your guys did you proud. See you next year.
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Best. NIckname. Ever.
I might steal that like Pronger on a post game puck.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Jun 11, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
lucky!!!
if holmgren hadn’t gotten the luckiest break in the world when detroit gave him leino for the sorriest excuse of a d man in the league, the flyers would have gone absolutely nowhere… if leighton hadn’t played on a few occasions they’d have been toast… the truth is the team needs serious help… one, JVR has to come up with some heart or he’ll be gone in a year… two, carbomb and asham are marginal players at best… the team needs a serious upgrade at right wing… someone to like knuble to play alongside richards and gagne… a third line d man who can lay a real hit and a real starting goalie… that said it was a great ride…
by Elmo the faithful fan on Jun 10, 2010 9:52 PM EDT reply actions
We do our fair share of Homer bashing around here, but Detroit needed to get rid of Leino when they did to fit under the salary cap. Someone was going to get him for a virtual pittance. Call it lucky, but Homer knew exactly what Leino could bring and he was the only GM who jumped at the opportunity to acquire him.
by Ben Feldman on Jun 10, 2010 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah
I would like to think Homer knew exactly what he was getting.
In regards to some of your other points:
- JVR played with heart in the playoffs I felt. It’s just that he’s not conditioned to a long NHL season. Let’s see him work through a proper off season, put on a few more pounds, and hopefully translate what we saw early this season (him producing at a ppg on the third line) into consistent play for the whole season
- One out of Asham and Carbomb will be gone by the end of this offseason
- We do definitely need a winger and a 5th D-man and a starting goalie
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m guessing Carcillo is gone. He didn’t even dress for half this series which translates to he wasn’t needed or didn’t fit with Lavi’s system.
Honestly, I wouldn’t have a problem with trading Carcillo’s rights out west (where we won’t see him too much) for a really late draft pick. Something about him doesn’t sit well with me. Can’t put my finger on what it is, though.
by Ben Feldman on Jun 10, 2010 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Some of that is he gets penalties on pure reputation alone. He’s gotten better, but the refs don’t let him play on some nights. He’s got great speed and a ton of enthusiasm. And to be honest, he’s a great agitator.
Asham just played so well in the playoffs, but I’m not sure if he has the speed to play this style of game. And he’s older.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Jun 11, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
+1 on his enthusiasm
Carcillo may not be perfect, but the bench-side manner he has is the motivation a lot of these players just don’t have. Frankly, I always thought Cote was excellent at that as well (if nothing much else). There’s a lot of quiet leaders on this team, and while that can motivate determination it does little to get that extra spark and edge that not only makes players have an extra jump, but it helps them enjoy playing. When I coached rubgy, I had a player on my roster who wasn’t very talented (or bright) but was an incredible rah-rah sort of guy. When he stopped playing, the change in the team’s persona was enormous. You need that sort of guy on the sideline – involved and cheering, and willing to play hard all the time – to keep the game fun and lively.
by penguinsfan on Jun 12, 2010 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions
poor goaltending
sorry to say that the cup would have been in philly if the fyers had a goalie… leighten did his best but he’s just a journeyman… losing the opener 6-5 set the tone…flyers never get it… goaltending wins the cup…
by Elmo the faithful fan on Jun 10, 2010 10:00 PM EDT reply actions
"flyers never get it"
You have to give the organization a bit of a break here. Emery was the no. 1, but what happened to him could not have been predicted, Leighton was originally picked up off waivers as the no. 3. I do think they are trying to develop an all-star goaltender just by looking at the sheer number of goalies in the prospect system right now.
Carter for Vokoun at the deadline might have done it. But then who knew we were going to even make it past the first round of the playoffs, it looked like the season was a dud.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Ya sure. Check out the stellar Cup Final stats for our hero Mr. Niemi.
by TopShelfTony on Jun 10, 2010 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions
hate to say it
but carter might have to go… he’s a great player but not great enough… the x factor is jvr… if can realize his potential great but if not he can go as well!!!!!
by Elmo the faithful fan on Jun 10, 2010 10:02 PM EDT reply actions
I’d like to see an upgrade at goalie. keep leights or boosh as a backup, trade the other. I’d love to see a more establish power forward/big body in front of the net (I was thinking how much I miss Knuble and Detroit signed Holmstrom so…suggestions?) I also agree with solidifying our 3rd D-pair…
I guess really the ultimate question Homer will have to answer with this short time off is what do the Flyers REALLY need most. Work out a list of priorities and just get as much as he can done possible. I think just a few minor tweaks this could be a very tough team to compete with come next season. There is plenty of talent to choose from and a great crop of young kids coming up. I’m confident it won’t be anything too drastic but I do expect a name (being Carter, Hartnell, Coburn…to get traded)
Philadelphia Flyers/Columbus Blue Jackets...don't ask me how.
Boosh is signed for next year, but Leights is a UFA so it’ll probably be him that goes.
New Zealand's 4th best Philadelphia Flyers fan
which is fine. I think Leights made a good case for himself to maybe warrant someone to give him a shot (to back-up a team, maybe Dallas? I know they got that Climie kid but Lehtonen is signed for 3 years so he probably wouldn’t see start action til then.)
Philadelphia Flyers/Columbus Blue Jackets...don't ask me how.
by PhillyPhan85 on Jun 10, 2010 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think Leighton will have trouble getting an NHL contract this offseason. Unfortunately, it may be with Edmonton. But beggars can’t be choosers.
by Ben Feldman on Jun 10, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions
No one’s mentioned this in a while I don’t think, but isn’t JVR supposed to excel in a Knuble-type role?
The biggest priorities for Homer have to be goaltending and an improved 3rd pairing (remember, though, that Bartulis has a 3-year, one-way deal starting this season). If he actually sticks to his plans, then yeah, it’s a near certainty that a bigger name has to be traded.
by Ben Feldman on Jun 10, 2010 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions
well there you go. I don’t have a problem at all with JVR, he needs to pack on some more muscle to get himself parked in front of that net but that will come in a couple seasons.
I would want a goalie upgrade first and foremost. Wherever Homer goes from there, I’ll be supportive.
Philadelphia Flyers/Columbus Blue Jackets...don't ask me how.
by PhillyPhan85 on Jun 10, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions
JVR
I think this picture highlights the size factor that should help him as he bulks up a bit more:
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions
So, anyone else want to punch their screens looking at that photo?
New Zealand's 4th best Philadelphia Flyers fan
I’m sure a certain cab driver does
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions
lol….looks like a mix of a boy band and the kids from Stand By Me.
Philadelphia Flyers/Columbus Blue Jackets...don't ask me how.
by PhillyPhan85 on Jun 10, 2010 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions
TRRRAAAAAIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNN!!!!
Mancrushin' on Geoff since April 20
"Good night. Good hockey."
by KreiderDesigns on Jun 10, 2010 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions
So if I had to guess, from left to right I would say 14, 12 and 15….years of age.
by JerseyDriver on Jun 10, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions
What about Bobby Ryan -- apparently he's available.
by TopShelfTony on Jun 10, 2010 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I would trade Carter for Ryan straight up. The Ducks might want a center they have Perry as the top line RW and Lupol already as a nice 2nd line RW but their only C is Getzlaf. I guess it comes down to is Center more valued than RW.
After Getzy reinjured his ankle at the end of the season, Bobby moved up and played center on the top line. He was actually pretty good.
Ducks fans died a little when we lost Pronger, hoping Lupul and Sbisa would make up the difference. Yeah…not so much.
I’m singlehandedly trying to quash any Bobby trade rumors. I’m sure Bob Murray is reading this, haha.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions
I think Bobby's going regardless
It’s been reported pretty extensively that he can’t stand Mr. You Don’t Try Hard Enough I’m Playing You On The Third Line Carlyle.
35G 29A 64PTS +9 81PIM 11PPG 258SOG @ 22 yrs old? Ya, Randy…sure.
We’ll take him.
by TopShelfTony on Jun 11, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions
We all know he hates Carlyle. That’s why we all hoped Carlyle would get the ax at the end of the season. My guess is that if Bobby ends up re-signing with us, he’s going the milk the team for as much cash as possible because he doesn’t want to play for Randy.
We don’t get Carlyle’s methodology either.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
You won't mind, I imagine, if I hope he doesn't sign with you and ends up with us?
You probably wouldn’t mind if we got Marleau, either, especially if it was instead of LA (where it looks like he will be re-united with Dean Lombardi).
by TopShelfTony on Jun 11, 2010 8:17 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re more than welcome to hope that. Just understand that if it happens, I will be forced to curse you and your entire family for all eternity. No biggie.
I’m indifferent to Marleau. I’ve watched him choke more than I’ve watched him succeed, so he’s all yours if you want him.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Not the curse, not for all eternity! Anything but that. OK Ryan is yours.
But Marleau, finally out from under Doug Wilson, will help LA to endless victories in the Freeway Challenge and thump the Ducks at every opportunity.
Hey, that’s a pretty fair curse right there.
by TopShelfTony on Jun 11, 2010 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions
The Pronger deal
Depended heavily on what happened to those draft picks. Halfway through the season we were fearing our pick would’ve been a lottery pick. As it were, turns out it’s 29th overall…
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions
and we had one more point than you guys too. Cruel world.
The Kings are supposed to blow. Not us.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions
So would I
Carter for Ryan – straight up. I would make that deal in a heartbeat.
Ryan is 23, Carter 25. Carter scheduled to make $5 million next year, Ryan slated to make about $2 million. Both set to become restricted free agents after next season. Ryan is going to want a pay raise – and he deserves it. Carter probably would be happy with $5 million a year territory. Ryan throws his body around, Carter not so much. Really, Carter might be more suited to the less physical style played out West. And Ryan might be more suited for playing in the East. Ryan would be an absolutely perfect fit with Richards & Gagne.
less physical style played out West
… Did you watch these playoffs?
WC teams were just as (if not more) physical than the East. Especially the Canucks. Don’t even bring that ‘East is more physical’ crap, no one’s buying.
by spokeinthebandwagon on Jun 11, 2010 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions
The west plays physical in a straight hitting way, but the east is more of a grinding, cycling style. The constant grinding and cycling is what wears you down. You can’t say that the west isn’t more of a puck control offensive style. The Flyers were just beaten by that style as soon as quennville abandoned the idea of trying to win the front of the Flyers net. He divvied his speed around to get the Flyers defensemen to turn towards the outsides of the offensive zone.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 11, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
The east is more of a grinding, cycling style.
This is such a bizarre claim, I don’t even know where to start.
I don’t accept that the East is more a grinder-friendly / cycle-friendly type of hockey. I mean, the Hawks beat the Sharks by basically out-cycling them, and when the Hawks dominated the Flyers, it was on the cycle. I agree that Q did a good thing when he figured out that he needed to beat the Flyers on the speed game instead of in front of the net, but I don’t think you can generalize from that to the overall toughness of Western conference teams.
As of now, the West is the toughest conference in the NHL. The East can tout their supposed grit, but the West has proven their mettle, both on points and in championships.
by spokeinthebandwagon on Jun 11, 2010 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
You are probably not looking at this but whatever. You just proved my point in that the Hawks gave up on trying to grind and cycle against the Flyers by switching to a speed game with puck control. And also proved my point by saying the hawks grind and cycling worked against the western team until they met the Flyers. Ever team is tough it is the NHL, but night in and night out the East beats each other up and the west is more open. It is not a knock just a reality and if the west played that style with the traveling they have to do over the east they would be dead.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 12, 2010 8:42 AM EDT up reply actions
i think
a case can be made for both conferences in the grittiness department. The two grittiest teams I think the Hawks played this season where the Blues (post coaching change) and Nashville.
Although speed was a main reason we took the cup, in the end, I can say it was our depth and Lavi’s inability to counter coach Q’s line changes in game 5. At that point, Pronger became less of an obstacle. Phillies top line’s fairly bad two-way performance made a huge difference as well.
But I digress. Even if Philly had the type of year that they’re capable of (105+ points), the East was a much weaker division. In many ways, I was really glad that the Flyers made it to the finals because it was one of the only teams that had a lot of depth on it.
Now I can agree with the last statement. The west is the more talented conference these days, which is a byproduct of being so horrible over the years and drafting trends, etc.
It is no secret the way to beat Pronger is with speed because if you can get him turning you can beat him outside. By splitting those lines up and adding speed to each line it left the Flyers exposed on defense and the drop off from the top 4 is immense. Also the drop off of Gagne and the non existence of Carter killed us. Bolland shut Richards down as he has done since they were in junior hockey, voiding that line. Giroux got stuck centering Asham and JVR, not a big concern for the Hawks and what ever the Briere line got was not going to be enough. Lavy really did the most he could with what he had left.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 13, 2010 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Actually, Bolland’s line got dominated in scoring chances, Richards et al just didn’t put the puck in the net.
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New Zealand's 4th best Philadelphia Flyers fan
That paragraph on Bolland is absolutely hysterical.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 13, 2010 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
They really aren’t sold on him over there eh?
This will go in the next Fly-By? It shows what a beast Timonen was at least
New Zealand's 4th best Philadelphia Flyers fan
I should have put it in Monday’s… completely spaced.
It’ll be in Tuesday’s.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 15, 2010 1:31 AM EDT up reply actions
And Ryan is a real winger, not a center being forced to play wing like two other players already on this team.
Just Call Me "M"!
by M from Pdaddy on Jun 11, 2010 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions
only two? I thought we had more than that. Powe is a natural center, as is Gagne (I know he hasn’t played center in years), and Briere/ Carter/ Giroux who have all at times played wing.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Bobby becomes an RFA on July 1st. That means I’m counting down the days until Barstool Bob does something stupid (i.e. doesn’t sign him).
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t see us trading Carter straight up for the rights of Bobby Ryan. Something else should be on the way back as a guarantee in case Bobby doesn’t sign or something weird. Not that I imagine he wouldn’t want to sign (at least sentimentally) seeing as he’s from Cherry Hill and grew up going to Flyers games.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Aside from the usual trade rumors, I heard the only places Bobby would want to play next season is Anaheim, LA, or Philly. Of course I’m pulling for us, so stop putting these silly ideas out there :)
You’re killing me Lappy. Take my Pronger but don’t take my Bobby. I think he’s going to be the subject of my column this week on AC.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 9:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m gettin tickets to game 8 on Sunday!
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions
nice, someone showing how smart THEY are.
Philadelphia Flyers/Columbus Blue Jackets...don't ask me how.
by PhillyPhan85 on Jun 10, 2010 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions
this whole Philly is dumb, classless, blah blah blah thing is old…like Canadians calling Americans fat.
Something original please!!!!!!
Philadelphia Flyers/Columbus Blue Jackets...don't ask me how.
by PhillyPhan85 on Jun 10, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
guys, I just want to say, that was one hell of a series, I loved watching your run through the playoffs and was pulling for you on April 11 when it went to OT and then the shootout and look forward to cheering you on again. (hating Chris Pronger was a challenge)
but goddamn, the plans I made back in January to get tickets to next years Flyers/Hawks game to see it with my friends from Philly just got way more expensive than it seemed at the time.
Watch it with the jinxing!
Time for some thrillin' heroics!
Could be worse...what if you had no friends in Philly? Ever thought of that?
by TopShelfTony on Jun 10, 2010 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions
life would be very sad indeed, were that the case.
Watch it with the jinxing!
Time for some thrillin' heroics!
There you go...
there’s always a silver lining.
(NO — NOT the Cup)
by TopShelfTony on Jun 11, 2010 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions
If the role was reversed and the Flyers won the Stanley Cup, I would honestly care less if Chicago fans booed or not.
Flyers, the only Philly team that matters
this chicago fan was too busy yelling at the tv to hear the philly fans.
but I noticed a lot of them stuck around, which impressed me.
Watch it with the jinxing!
Time for some thrillin' heroics!
Well it’s been awhile since we’ve seen the cup and watching another team win it on our ice makes us want it more. Fuel for the fire
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:03 AM EDT up reply actions
What are the chances that the Flyers’ drought goes to 49 years, as well?
They better win it at least once while I’m alive. =(
Let's stay positive
We might not have the complete package right now with our team, but we have some of the key pieces we need. I think only the Penguins can boast more depth up the middle than us. We’ve also got one of the best defences in the league, and if we add a solid no. 5 to carry the 3rd pairing our defence may be the best in the league. It’s a solid foundation to build up for another run next season and the season after before Kimmo and Pronger get too old.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Here’s the way I see it. I think you keep Leights and Boosh concentrate on improving their games and spend the money elsewhere. Goalies start to come into their primes around 30 and to be honest with you if Leights manages to tweak his game just slightly over the off season and through the year then I’ve no doubt in my mind that he’ll be one of the better goalies out there. After all, he and Boosh both showed what they’re capable of and with a little support and stability I think they’d make a fairly attractive pair on the cheap for a couple of years. Leights wasn’t the reason we didn’t bring home the cup.
huh? he may not be the reason we didn’t bring home the cup. We do get off to terrible starts in the 1st period and were out skated by the hawks but at some point you have to look at the goals that Leights gave up and say to yourself, we need to be better in net. That last goal was terrible
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Great series guys. I was pulling for you. I blame it on my undying love for Prongs. Treat him well.
One positive for you – WE took Lupul off your hands (sigh)
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 10, 2010 11:42 PM EDT reply actions
Question
On one of the other threads a user suggested Carter to the Ducks for Bobby Ryan and Sbisa. How’s that sound? And Carter and Lupul are good friends and linemates from their days back in Philly too! That makes for some good chemistry.
Oh and sorry for letting you down on the conditional 3rd rounder. We really really wanted it to give it to you. We tried our best.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 10, 2010 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I want NO ONE here that is friends with Lupul. He already can’t stay away from the Newport Beach bars on his own. See one of my first posts on AC for why I can’t condone making Lupul happy :)
I will die if we lose Bobby. Literally, combust on the spot. I’ve heard Bobby to Penguins for Malkin, straight up, and Bobby to Toronto for a various group of players. I’ll add Carter to the list.
Haha, and thanks for the effort on the pick. It’s the thought that counts, right?
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 10, 2010 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I love Bobby too.
Mostly because he’s the only hockey talent to ever come out of my home town (Cherry Hill).
This is the new/current account of RyanGiggs11
"College is only 4 years, but the Eagles are for life." - Ironhank
Carter to Ducks for Hiller and a prospect. How much does Hiller make?
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Hiller was signed to an extension midseason, I think it’s $18 million over 4 years. Once he signed that extension, we traded Jiggy.
I wouldn’t put it past Barstool Bob, but I think it would be a very stupid move for him to make. Our backup is Curtis McElhenny (who?).
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions
4.5 million a season, which is more than the Flyers should spend on a goalie. Yeah so Hiller is out of the question but Carter for Bernier + Brown (LA), Umberger+ Mason (CLB), and Carter for Price+d-men (Montreal) all seem like decent options
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I went and asked on the LA blog
And they said Bernier isn’t going anywhere this season, but maybe the next if Quick manages to win the starting spot again. And Dustin Brown is near untouchable in LA.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Nothing wrong with Lupul
Hopefully he’s healthy next year for you guys and has a nice bounceback season. I watched close to every single Flyers game played season before last, and the reports of his laziness are exaggerated in the extreme. He knows how to hit, has good wheels and can put the puck in the net on a regular basis. Stats wise, he was doing pretty well for you guys until he got hurt, and then that spinal infection was just bad luck.
Thanks Gizmo :) I hope he is healthy and strong next year, too. He was off to a great start this past season.
I loved him when he was with us the first time around. Frankly, I was a little bummed when we lost him in the initial trade for Pronger. Yet, since then, I haven’t seen him evolve enough as a player to be of a value even close to Pronger (even with Sbisa and the pick added). Hoping for better results next year, as long as he focuses on his rehab.
Btw, he tweeted that he hoped you guys won The Cup next year…yeah…I think he plays for the Ducks…
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Haha I’m sure it just crossed his mind.
I do like (I can imagine you not liking it though) that a lot of players coming out of Philly show loyalty to the team even when playing for other teams. To me it speaks world about how tight knit the organization is. Scottie Upshall and RJ Umberger are the other guys coming straight to mind from recent years.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Haha. You Philly kids are alright. I was afraid I was gonna get slammed on this board.
Hey I’m all for loyalty…except when it impacts me negatively :) I’m sure you can understand. Speaking of loyalty rumors, I’ve been hearing that Paul Kariya wants to finish his career in Anaheim. I think he should end it in Philly and I’ll keep Bobby. You’re welcome.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions
-Is scottie Upshall a FA???
-GOALIE ……yeah i cant figure it out but hey i hear niittymaki is a FA LOL jk loved him but we need someone we can steal games
-3rd D pairing Bring back Syret….maybe K Marshal can win a spot in the summer if not hopefully 2011-12
-I’ll scout some chinese goalies while i’m over here in china
I would rather have Umberger
personally. The guy’s got a Flyers tattoo.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 5:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Agreed.
I really liked him.
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jun 11, 2010 8:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Umberger would work on first line wing. He was versatile and could play wing, if I remember correctly.He provides a big strong body that would fit well in the Knuble role. Let
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Umberger would be a nice return. How about Carter for Umberger and Steve Mason hoping the kid bounces back to form.
not a bad idea at all. That might be a better trade then the proposed Brown and Bernier for Carter trade b/c Mason has more nhl experience
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
so I’ve looked it up. Mason will make a little less than $1million next year and Umberger will make 3.75 million so it just about equals out in terms of cap space for both teams. Whether Columbus is willing to part with those 2 guys is the question
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
3 team trade Flyers give up carter and briere and get umberger and upshall …….. Now all i need is GM status arggg pplan foiled
haha
That would get you fired if you were the GM ;)
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 6:04 AM EDT up reply actions
you would trade away both briere and carter???? the idea would be to trade away one and it’s harder to trade briere and after the playoffs, I’m pretty sure Danny should stay
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Carter
Carter has to be the odd man out. Leino needs to be kept. Hopefully Coburn asks for a reasonable amount. We need someone to play with Richards and Gagne. And we need another decent defenseman.
Carter for Bobby Ryan and a ducks defenseman?
by bleedorangewhiteblack on Jun 11, 2010 9:15 AM EDT reply actions
We have a craptastic defense. If you’d like Steve Eminger or Brett Festerling, they’re all yours. I hear rumblings of us shopping Wiznewski who will be up for arbitration this summer. He thinks he’s worth #2 defenseman pay – he’s dreaming.
Just please, for the love of all things holy, don’t take my Bobby Ryan. You’ve already taken Pronger for Lupul (injured) and Sbisa (juniors). I’m a shell of my former self ;(
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Writer for http://www.anaheimcalling.com
by Sticks.Gloves.Shirt on Jun 11, 2010 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Eh Eminger. No thanks we tried that once, we added him with Downie and got ourselves Carle.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
That was a nice trade too
I really enjoy it when Holmgren gets trading :)
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions
If there’s one thing Homer can do it’s trade. I know ppl still don’t like the Upshall trade but Carbomb has improved his game, and it gives us cap space for Giroux etc in the future
by historywillbemade on Jun 12, 2010 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Vokoun?
I dont know about Vokoun. You trade Carter for him, and if he isnt every bit as good as his hype (which I dont believe) then the trade is worthless – I’d rather get picks or players (non-goalies) – something where the return isn’t all or nothing.
by bleedorangewhiteblack on Jun 11, 2010 9:18 AM EDT reply actions
Agreed, I’d rather we trade for a younger nhl-ready goalie AND a RW or 5th d-men. I’d think i’d rather trade for multiple pieces one of which is a goalie.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions
agreed
We need 3 pieces a top 6 right winger, a solid 5th D-Man that can play the PK, and a goalie. If trading Carter nets 2 of those 3 pieces I would make that move but a straight up deal for anything but a top 3 winger leaves us exactly were we are now with zero chips get the other missing pieces.
Hi folks, congrats from Pittsburgh. Hell of a run with the rallying and grit and whatnot. Turns out that Pronger guy who appeared slow and overpaid in many games this season isn’t so bad of a signing either. Richards is one hell of a gritty SOB too. See you next season at the CEC. It’s my turn to buy the tickets for my buddy from Philly. Had fun in your barn in January, you fellers aren’t so scary.
Again, nice run. The disappointment is temporary, lots to be happy with. I see lots of you are over it already and optimistic about the future.
Great Article/Hats off to Blackhawks
Best Article I have ready in a long time. Congratulations to the Blackhawks…
We get solid at goaltending and the Flyers are back next year!!
by typicalsailor1 on Jun 11, 2010 11:38 AM EDT reply actions
the missing pieces
it seems that most of us are in agreement as to the team’s needs… a rugged and skilled right wing…(i would have given my life savings to have seen rick tochett in his prime on the line with giroux and jvr or on the right of richards)… i like asham and carcillo but they aren’t worth roster spots… the next real need is the 3rd defensive pairing… it would really help to have a hitter that can also skate a little and another d man who can shoot the puck… the question people keep asking is what to do woth carter??? i for one would hate to see him go…
by Elmo the faithful fan on Jun 11, 2010 1:21 PM EDT reply actions
I’d hate to see him go bc he has great skills, but the reality is he is our most tradeable asset and we have holes to fill. I’d love to keep him but with the cap, Carter makes keeping guys like Leino, JVR, and Giroux harder in the future. The flyers didn’t want to get rid of Umberger or Upshall but they had to. If they want to win, they might have to sacrifice Carter to do it
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions
@Elmo
the problem is my man. If you want those missing pieces filled, Carter is the most likely way to make that happen.
Its one or the other. This team doesnt have cap room to do both. And Carter doesnt fit anywhere if you keep Richards, Briere, Giroux, and Betts as centers.
You could move Briere and Giroux off the center position, but:
A) that breaks up the Hartnell-Briere-Leino line
B) both Briere and Giroux seemed to play their best hockey as centers
you could move Giroux out as a wing on the 1st line for Richie and Gags or for JVR-Carter (if you move Carter as the 3rd line center).
However that still leaves you without a winger on either the 1st or 3rd line AND more importantly no defenseman to add to the weak 3rd pairing.
Unless this team finds a way to move Hartnell or Briere’s contracts (and im not sure in the wake of how well the Hartnell-Briere-Leino played together you want to trade them), then it has to Jeff Carter.
by bleedorangewhiteblack on Jun 11, 2010 1:59 PM EDT reply actions
has to *be
has to *be Jeff Carter
by bleedorangewhiteblack on Jun 11, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, I don’t think you can limit your decision on postseason performance alone, but Briere was playing out of position all year, so it’s not a stretch to think he’d be better all year if he was playing at the C.
What Carter lacks is a NTC and that’s why he is the more valuable asset for trade. Briere’s contract is prohibitive and has a NTC, which means he isn’t moving regardless. Hartnell has one as well, although he contract is less prohibitive. Panatch FWIW thinks he’s still the one who will be shopped and that the FO doesn’t just judge the player by the postseason. They want regular season results, too. Gettting in on the last day of the season by the skin of their teeth doesn’t work for them, for some reason. LOL.
"Tortorella’s got it all wrong ... Gaborik shouldn’t be messing with our skilled player." -Peter Luukko
Hartnell had a rough down year but who didn’t? find me one Flyer who had more production than their expected production this season vs last season. Hartnell,when he is on, adds physicality and a net presence, which is something you need on top lines and something I am not sure anyone else on the roster provides.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed. I am just reporting what Tim Panaccio said on DNL yesterday—so take it with a large grain of salt. That’s pretty much verbatim what he said. He thinks Hartnell will be traded and that the FO wasn’t happy with his regular season play and that they don’t only look at postseason results. He did, however, say that no one outside of Pronger, Richards and possibly Giroux would be considered “untouchable”.
"Tortorella’s got it all wrong ... Gaborik shouldn’t be messing with our skilled player." -Peter Luukko
I wish we could just have a guarantee that JVR is staying till next season. I’m worried we’ll get rid of a future John Leclair because we’re rushing to fill in the gaps and have another run at the cup.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I think we’ll keep JVR. Kid has lots of potential but he needs to improve his conditioning, defense, bulk up, and most importantly of all he needs time. He was great early in the season and then hit a wall. Last season he was just trying to make the team so this season he should concentrate on his defense and conditioning. He probably hit the wall in terms of production b/c 1. he isn’t used to 82 game season, 2. under went coaching change, 3. lavvy kept him on a short leash and didn’t give him a lot of minutes
by historywillbemade on Jun 12, 2010 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
If the Front Office thinks that way - then they're way wrong
Regular seasons in the NHL and NBA are almost meaningless. And the playoff run you just saw, plus the playoff run 2 years ago, demonstrates that perfectly. Flyers were good goal tending away from winning a cup to the blackhawks (who had the 3rd most regular season points). And the Blackhawks went all in and were way over the salary cap – would they have won without Hossa, Sharp or Seabrook – I don’t think so. The Blackhawks were about one very good player better than the Flyers and the that’s how much they were over the cap.
Anyway, it would be stupid to break up the potency of the Briere/Hartnell/Lieno line without giving them a regular season to see if they can build on the playoff performance. Having that line go against other teams second lines next year is how the Flyers are going to win games. They are going to feast on other teams second line forwards and second defensive pairings. And getting Lieno for what they got him for and having him turn out to be the player he is, is the kind of good fortune that wins you Championships. It would be the worst move in the history of the Flyers if they broke up that line. The only thing I really worry about is injury’s with those guys, because of the way Hartnell plays and the way other teams are going to try to get physical with Briere and Lieno.
Someone needs to tell Ed Snider that we don’t need to see the Flyers on top of the Atlantic Division every year. Sure it would be nice, but what we need is for the Flyers to play well in the playoffs. They just did that after making the playoffs after a shootout in the last regular season game. The regular season and even home ice don’t matter at all in the NHL. At least in the NBA home court advantage is probably good for getting the benefit of a good ref’s whistle. That can’t be said for the NHL.
Yeah, but to win in the playoffs you have to get to the playoffs (and be lucky enough to get the three lowest scoring teams you could possibly face in the first three rounds). Let’s not forget how much of a disaster the regular season was. While you’re right that the Flyers don’t need to win the division to have a “successful” regular season anymore, fucking up enough that it takes game 82 to make or break your playoff hopes is, for a team like this, unacceptable.
indeed they need to be somewhere in the top 5 in the conference in regular season.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
hopefully a full year of Lavvy and Leino and hopefully a goalie who can you know do his job and not let in softies.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
the problem with looking at the regular season...
all these players, especially Hartnell, were like night and day once they bought into Laviolette’s system versus under John Stevens.
so it’s just not about their play in the playoffs versus regular season. It’s about what they will continue to do under Laviolette. So they have to ask themselves ask the players themselves, and ask Laviolette, is what they saw in the playoffs under Laviolette from guys like Hartnell going to become the normal or not.
again decisions im glad i dont have to make. i cant answer them, im just proposing them.
by bleedorangewhiteblack on Jun 11, 2010 2:35 PM EDT reply actions
You should really use the “reply” button. It’s a lot easier to follow conversations that way.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 11, 2010 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
A thought just occurred to me: The injury to Carter in 1st round was the best thing to happen to the flyers in the postseason. I know that Carter has lots of talent but look at what changes had to be made b/c that injury.
1. Briere moves back to center and then proceeds to set franchise record for pts in playoffs and they were all important.
2. Lavvy dresses Leino, who then proceeds to set rookie record for pts in playoffs. Leino gets to play more than one game. We know have a future stud.
3. Hartnell plays with these two and rediscovers what he was missing all year long.
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 3:42 PM EDT reply actions
Chicago’s cap situation is worse than we first thought. Oy. What a mess that’s about to be.
now I don’t feel so bad about Toews getting Conn Smythe over Briere b/c it added more to their cap next year. haha. Toews should have declined the trophy so that the hawks can actually dress a team next year, lol
by historywillbemade on Jun 11, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Everybody grab a chair around the fire and watch the sucker burn! /warms hands
"Tortorella’s got it all wrong ... Gaborik shouldn’t be messing with our skilled player." -Peter Luukko
Huet is going to the minors, no doubt about it. I would think Campbell is going to also be actively shopped. I’m sure it’s going to be hard, but I figure there will be some team hungry for an offensive-d-man and Bowman will be able to move him. If not, he’s probably gone to the minors as well. Dip-sh8t, Sharp or Versteeg will also be available for cheap players and picks and they shouldn’t be too hard to move. That will give them about $15MM in cap space.
That’s not too big a deal.
Managing Editor - HockeyOutsiders.com
by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 11, 2010 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Campbell
That would be funniest waiver pickup ever. I imagine 15 teams putting in a claim. I guess Edmonton would be the one to get him.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Well actually, that contract’s pretty bad, so maybe not 15 teams….
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
someone here said we should pitch an offer for Niemi, I don’t know if we have the requisite picks to do it, but I’d tender him something in the 2.5MM range knowing Chicago will definitely match just to add to the crunch.
Managing Editor - HockeyOutsiders.com
by HockeyOutsiders on Jun 11, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
$2.5 mil would require the Flyers to have a 2011 2nd round pick, which they do not. The Flyers would have to offer either <$1,559,770 or between $3,119,540 and $4,679,310
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 11, 2010 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
How will they even ice a team? That is horrendous management.
New Zealand's 4th best Philadelphia Flyers fan
And that’d why Tallon was fired.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 11, 2010 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Nonetheless they won the cup with the team he put together. Will be interesting to see what he does in Florida.
New Zealand's 4th best Philadelphia Flyers fan
Well, yeah, but it required putting himself in cap hell.
Again, was it worth it? Fans and players probably say “hell yeah”, but I wonder what the new GM and owner think. They’d probably say yeah too, but will have a miserable few months/years ahead of them.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 11, 2010 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not necessarily horrendous management
It’s having too many great prospects maturing at the same time. Kane, Keith and Toews are superstars. But their salary is going to rip the Blackhawks apart.
And so this will our first Stanley Cup Final loss to a team that is not a dynasty.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 11, 2010 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Next year they have seven $3 million+ forwards, three $3.5 million+ defensemen, and a $5.6 million backup goalie.
Keith, Hossa, Kane, and Toews are relatively decent cap hits. Yeah, Hossa’s contract is incredibly long, but his hit is slightly more than Gagne’s.
The problem is paying Bolland and Versteeg over $6.4 mill combined. It’s not having a single one of your 14 players signed for less than a $1.025 mill cap hit. If you sign Campbell, Toews, Kane, Keith, and Huet to $5.5 mil+ contracts, you need more guys making $800k.
When you are already over the Cap with have 8 guys still to sign, someone (management) didn’t have a plan.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 12, 2010 2:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Just for reference:
The Flyers have five $3 million+ forwards (all $4.2 mil+), three $3.4 million+ defensemen, but no Huet.
The problem isn’t the ‘Hawks highly paid guys. It’s the Bolland, Versteeg, Byfuglien, contracts that will hurt them. Individually, those guys might be worth their $3-3.375 million cap hits, but your 5, 6, and 7th most expensive forwards equaling $9.458 million is a lot. The Flyers are paying their 5, 6, and 7 a total of $7.021 million, or a full Claude Giroux, Ville Leino, and Blair Betts less.
Then again, I’m sure losing Huet’s deal alone helps them out dramatically.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 12, 2010 2:17 AM EDT up reply actions
Good points
But after next season, assuming Leino and Giroux get re-signed, the Flyers could end up having seven 3m+ forwards too along with the three 3.4 million+ defenseman and no Huet. If we don’t lose a big contract or get an entry-level star or a steal, we end up just like the Blackhawks.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 12, 2010 2:43 AM EDT up reply actions
Thus why we need to trade Carter and his $5 cap hit, especially if we are due an upgrade in goal
by historywillbemade on Jun 12, 2010 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. Which is why Homer is already talking about changes to the roster. Whether that’s Carter, Hartnell, Leino, Briere, Gagne, Carle, whoever, it isn’t a formula for success.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 12, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions
I would remove Leino from that list
I actually contemplated whether Homer would even possible flip Leino for a high 1st rounder leading to us having more room to keep Carter, which from a purely profit perspective means we turned OKT + a 5th into a 1st rounder. However, Leino has just way too much upside to do anything other than watch him for the next season. If he’s still going strong, as I imagine he will be (21 points in 19 games!!), then he has to get re-signed.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 12, 2010 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions
But in reality who is it going to be? It has to be Carter? He is the only one that is movable of the Carter, Hartnell, Briere group…and he will fetch a better than just about anyone else named.
I certainly don’t want to get caught up in thinking that Leino is a stud simply because of what he did in the playoffs but I am certainly curious as to what he can do in a full season playing the wing with Hartnell and Briere at center.
We have already said at great length that Carter is the odd man out. If he wanted to be a wing and actually tried it he might be successful but he doesn’t seem to want to do that. Honestly, I would rather have Knuble on the wing with Richie and Gag’s than Carter. So I have no problem seeing Carter traded for a goalie or a young winger and a draft pick.
Go Go Gadget Gagne
What if Broad Street Didn't Fight Back? History HAS been made. 5-7-10
5-8-10...the day the Purdue Boilermakers basketball team won the 2011 NCAA Championship!!
I certainly don’t want to get caught up in thinking that Leino is a stud simply because of what he did in the playoffs but I am certainly curious as to what he can do in a full season playing the wing with Hartnell and Briere at center.
This is something I worry about too.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 13, 2010 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I think with the conditioning he will have keeping up with Lavy’s system should help, and that kind of play making ability both with and without the puck can’t be taught. If the Flyers drop Carter and pick up a scoring winger, they should have three good lines, so who he is playing against is anybody’s guess, but probably 2nd pairing of opposing team. I can’t see him being a bust especially if he continues with that line.
by JerseyDriver on Jun 14, 2010 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, I hope you’re right. I just worry that the hype machine is/will get out of control.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 15, 2010 1:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Great run
You guys can call me a Bandwagoner if you want. I started following the Flyers in the 03-04 run and was heart broken when they lost. Of course the lock out happened, and I lost track of them (though I was shocked when they fired Hitchcock). I picked up again in the 07-08 season during the playoff run, and again was heart broken when the lost to Pittsburgh. The same thing happened next year. But I started to watch regular season games here and there (including of course the winter classic). And of course I found this site and watched this run.
But now I’m fully sold on the Flyers. This run really solidified that I really love hockey, something I didn’t think I did. I bought a Briere jersey. I’m already looking at next seasons schedule to see which games I can go into.
So I hope I’ll be a diehard in another year.
I'm now Kolb's biggest fan
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Atlantic Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
New Jersey
|
82 | 48 | 27 | 7 | 103 |
|
Pittsburgh
|
82 | 47 | 28 | 7 | 101 |
|
Philadelphia
|
82 | 41 | 35 | 6 | 88 |
|
New York Rangers
|
82 | 38 | 33 | 11 | 87 |
|
New York Islanders
|
82 | 34 | 37 | 11 | 79 |
(updated 4.12.2010 at 9:21 AM EDT)
Flyers Schedule
Next 5 Games
|
New Jersey
|
Tue 09/21 | 7:00 PM EDT |
|
@
Toronto
|
Thu 09/23 | 7:00 PM EDT |
|
@
Toronto
|
Fri 09/24 | 7:00 PM EDT |
|
@
Minnesota
|
Sat 09/25 | 8:00 PM EDT |
|
@
New Jersey
|
Tue 09/28 | 7:00 PM EDT |
Last 5 Games
|
Chicago
|
Wed 06/09 | OT - L 3 - 4 |
|
@
Chicago
|
Sun 06/06 | L 4 - 7 |
|
Chicago
|
Fri 06/04 | W 5 - 3 |
|
Chicago
|
Wed 06/02 | OT - W 4 - 3 |
|
@
Chicago
|
Mon 05/31 | L 1 - 2 |
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