Thursday Morning Fly By: Two Jody Shelley Mentions
by Geoff Detweiler on Jul 29, 2010 10:52 AM EDT
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Today's open discussion thread, complete with your daily dose of Philadelphia Flyers news and notes...
- An update on Ville Leino: [Flyer & Ice]
- Mika Pyorala signed a three year deal to play in Sweden: [euroflyers]
- Looking at the value of an NHL goon: [The Copper & Blue]
- A European hockey primer for dummies: [Puck Worlds]
- An interview with Michael Leighton: [Flyers]
- Observed distribution of shooting talent: [Behind the Net]
- Jakub Kovar begins his battle for playing time today: [EuroFlyers]
- The transcript from Anthony SanFilippo's chat: [DelcoTimes]
- An interesting commercial for a minor league hockey team: [Hockey or Die]
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the copper and ble article mentions Darroll Powe as a fighter/goon….not sure how they came to that conclusion. The rest of the article is good though
Fighter of the Nightman.
Champion of the Sun.
Yeah, I just said swap him out for Lappy and it’s solid.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Jul 29, 2010 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Question
Been thinking about nick names for arena (post the newest bank merger) and since the Eagles stadium is called “the Linc” and the Phil’s park is often called “the Bank”.
What do people think of “the Well”.
It actually sparked my newest porn name “Linc Bankwell”
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
The Well, the Wagon… there are a couple of decent possibilities. Just when “the Wach” was finally being settled on…
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
by Ben Feldman on Jul 29, 2010 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
I like “The Farg”.. so when you scream “You Fargin Iceholes!!!”, you know, it will make more sense…
"As long as there's sex and drugs, I can do without the Rock N Roll"
Mick Shrimpton
I really like SanFilippo, but after reading the chat transcript, I still wish sometimes that hockey beat writers and MSM would read the CBA so they can give better answers to questions. It isn’t really a criticism of him, but of everybody and it’s not just in Philly. Even if they don’t go through the craziness to explain the CBA like I always have to do on here, I’d still feel better if the answers they gave other fans were more correct. I just think that if the writers understood the CBA better, maybe the public wouldn’t be quite as confused. Wishful thinking, I know.
I’m super happy about the notion that Leino will be good to go for training camp, though.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jul 29, 2010 11:47 AM EDT reply actions
ML: "It definitely makes me feel good. I didn’t know what direction they were going in. When they were looking to sign me, I think they were still unsure what they were going to do. Maybe they still aren’t sure, I don’t know. But if I start the season as the No. 1, that’s what I want. That’s my goal. I want to be a No. 1 goalie. "
Not even Leights is sure what the Flyers are doing in net
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 12:00 PM EDT reply actions
My half a cent
If anyone understands the business of hockey it’s someone like Leights. He’s been up and down, waived, traded and probably poked and prodded.
He like many of us thinks there is still one more major move to happen and it could change the goalie situation entirely.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
Yeah, that’s a good point. He’ll probably be the Flyers’ GM or hold some relatively high ranking in the front office at some point if he wants to. He’s been an excellent organizational warrior and he’s at least smart enough to take the contract Homer offered when he offered it. So he’s perfect (seriously).
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
by Ben Feldman on Jul 29, 2010 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting points from Anthony San Filippo
1) Richards to wing
2) Flyers looking at Simmonds from LAK with Carcillo going to other way
3) Turco not very likely
4) Backlund makes the team and Boosh out
5) Bartulis can be waived
somethings I didn’t think of
2) Flyers looking at Simmonds from LAK with Carcillo going to other way
Goodbye, 2011 first round pick+ if anything like that’s going to happen.
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
by Ben Feldman on Jul 29, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
would you really care if we got Simmonds for a 2011 late 1st rounder and Carcillo straight up. I wouldn’t Simmonds young as isn’t up for contract for two years same as JVR. I would expect something more along the lines of one of our D-Man Coburn or Carle in lnstead of the 1st rounder.
THAT would be a mistake – Carcillo AND a decent 3-4 defenseman??? Simmonds is good, but not THAT good. He only scored 4 more goals last season than Carbomb! I might consider Carcillo and Walker or Bartulis a good deal, as long as Simmonds learned to grow a porn ’stache and gained a few pounds on that frame.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
Agreed, if he’s gonna take two players away it’s gotta be a 3rd-pair (or lower) defenseman.
And we would definitely need someone to work on replacing that moustache.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
Out of Carle, Coburn and Mezaros who is the 3rd pairing guy they are all pretty good in the same boat. Carle is coming off a really nice looking year playing with Pronger and might be the best trade bait. If you pair Coburn with Pronger he should be able to duplicate what Carle did and maybe more Coburn has more talent if he gets his head out of his ass. Moving Mez up with Kimmo leaving Bartulis and ODB.
That would give us maybe enough cap space to get Niemi if that what Homer was thinking not that I want Niemi.
But I would take Sharp off their hands is a second. We send Simmonds to CHI we get Sharp and LAK get Coburn and Carcillo. CHI can then resign Niemi. Crazy pipe of a dream. But there is some logic in there except LAK would probably be happier with Sharp.
I’m still not convinced Coburn AND Carcillo for Simmonds is an even trade.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
I agree 1000%. Give them Walker and Carcillo and it’s a deal. We don’t even need Walker.
"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."
Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson
And part of the desirability for Simmonds is his extra-low cap hit, while Sharp’s is significant.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
true but Sharp at 3.9 million is a very good value he is also locked up until 2012-2013 at that number. Zherdev+Sharp is only 700K greater than Gagne.
Carle and Coburn have hits of 3.4 and 3.2 so moving Carcillo and one of those two actually saves us money if we get Sharp.
Not that any of this has any real chance of happening. CHI needs Simmonds low cap number a lot more than we do.
12:13
[Comment From Dustin LeedDustin Leed: ]
Thanks for doing this by the way, Ant, much appreciated. In my opinion, I think Jeff Carter needs to stay at center – Richards is much better on the wing than Carter. Chances we see Carter centering top-line with Richards and Zherdev on the wing?
Wednesday July 28, 2010 12:13 Dustin Leed
12:14
Dustin, I think it’s a real possibility. THe Flyers learned in the playoffs that Carter needs room to operate to be succesful. Richards is far better along the boards. I was told by a amangement person that they were impressed with Richards on the wing in the Olympics. I would bet they’ll give it a shot to start the season. "
I find this one interesting. Richards on the wing instead of Carter? I don’t know how i feel about that
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Hmm, that is interesting…
I totally missed that Richie played wing in the Olympics. That could actually work out, thus allowing Briere and Carter to stay at center where they play their best.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
It’s a far better idea than moving Carter to wing. I still vote for G, but I could see Richie.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
Also far better than trading away Carter, which was my initial solution to the “too many centers” problem. He was like a very valuable puzzle piece that just didn’t fit anywhere, and it pissed me the hell off.
I love Giroux’s playmaking skills at center, so I hesitate to move him. But wasn’t he a wing in junior? I do have to admit, I am intrigued by the idea.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
Simmonds only has a year left
If we get him, it means bye bye one of Simmonds or Giroux after next season.
Briere, Betts and Pronger; Briere, Betts and Pronger; Briere, Betts and Pronger;
Our team is so much stronger
We've got Briere, Betts and Pronger...
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jul 30, 2010 7:46 AM EDT up reply actions
So most hated team in NHL? Every one hates us and have for a long time. We along with other fanbases hate the Pens. I used to hate the Wings but they are just too good and I like Swedish players.
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 12:15 PM EDT reply actions
Eklund: Rusty Fedotenko to Philly ?
Eklund please be right on this one. He is due it has been about a month since he got one right.
Fedotenko will make up for Gagne’s Clutchness and be pals with Zherdev. And score more than Carcillo + Powe combined on the 3rd line.
Ooh, I would be more than okay with that. (We’d have to cleanse him, get that Pittsburgh smell off.)
Get the louse powder and the hose, maybe some bleach
by SkookFlyerfan on Jul 29, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Thing is, at the other end of the state, he was considered a ‘grit’ player – here he’ll be considered a ‘skill’ player. Use whatever delousing you feel you need, but if he’ll agree to go by “Rusty” again (if I remember right, he HATES that) bring him in. While he’s no Gagne, he’s a decent player good for 15+ goals. ONLY PROBLEM, his cap hit will be in the $2+ million range; you gotta move some money for that beyond waiving Cote and Bartulis.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
He signed for 1.8 million last season coming off a 39 pts in 69 games and a +17 season. This year he was down to 30 pts in 82 games and a -17 I don’t see him getting a raise past 1.8 million. Then again I didn’t Armstrong would get some much 3.3 million for his 29pt season either.
You still need to move some salary to fit him even at $1.8 mil. And yeah – two-way wings have been getting decent money this year, so don’t be too shocked if he does get a raise.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
Drop Walker and Cote and you can fit him easy. How do they plan on fitting Asham I would prefer Rusty over Asham.
Absolutely. I like Asham, but not more than Rusty. Either way, I do hope Homer is looking to do something a bit more creative than simply “drop” Walker; he’s a serviceable 3rd pairing d-man for someone, and should be worth at least a pick or prospect. And I think everyone agrees that Cote is now done. Between Shelley coming and Holly going, his value is bascially nil.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
I wouldn’t read much in to it yet. There is no ranking, and Eklund has been the guy that has been trying to sell the whole Zherdev needs a buddy angle since he was signed. So right now it’s just something he heard from someone. Also he got the Gagne trade right.
Is this the right room for an argument?
For every 1 rumor Eklund gets correct, he gets approximately 30 incorrect (457 wrong, 15 right for 3.1%)
Just sayin…
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
How come the confidence in the Flyers went up? Huh? People forget way too quickly. I’m very very very disappointed. (exaggerated sigh)
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
I’m trying my best keep it down. I see it as a vote of 10 is the equivalence of a vote of no confidence in Holmgren
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
You and I both. I still wish there was a ‘zero’ option.
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
How about the algebraic “number line” so we can vote in negatives?
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
minus 12 would be good for me…
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
I’m getting over my “WHAT THE FUCK ARE WE DOING?!,” getting adjusted to the roster as it stands (though there is still room for improvement, so it’s only a slight rebound), getting past the pain of the Finals, and getting excited for next season. I haven’t forgotten, but I’m ready to look ahead and see what we can do. :-p
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
I should add, I’ll always hate losing Gagne, he ranks up there with Brind’amour, LeClair, and Hextall for me. But what’s done is done.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
It may be done, but has Homer’s approach in the off season given you confidence in the GM of the Flyers? I’m sure part of the confidence is placed in the team being better than it was last year; but given the options in FA, and Homer’s inability to exercise patience, is this team as good as it could have been? And even if you think it is, has the way Homer has dealt with this off season instill confidence in management moving forward to next off season? Do the holes in the farm system worry you? If you are only grading on the team penciled in to start the season, and their potential on ice performance I could see someone grading it well. But, if you factor in management, farm system, potential issues next off season, goalie questions still being asked, etc. along with the potential success of the roster as it stands, I would have to assume it can’t still be all to high…
Is this the right room for an argument?
You’re right, I probably am weighing my vote more on the potential on-ice performance. That said, I’m in the middle of the scale, because I do have those nagging doubts about management leading us in the right/best direction, but this week I’m just feeling very optimistic about the coming season. And that makes it higher than last week, when I was in complete “fukitol” mood. Which explains my answer to the original question about why the confidence went up. It’s not necessarily high yet, but it is still higher than last week.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
Yeah I agree about the middle of the scale…I’m right around a 50 b/c I think the roster can win, but we are still in the off season, so all those other factors are still weighing pretty heavy on me. As we move closer and closer to the season, the on ice roster will have a higher weight in the grading, but I still don’t think I can move above 80 given my other concerns (assuming they still will not be addressed).
Is this the right room for an argument?
All I can say is the Flyers Goal Scored by… post is very good, talking about how the roster really hasn’t changed since last year! Yes, we could have improved the roster and probably gotten a TON better, but you have to look at it from a distance and see that we really haven’t changed anything besides swapping out Gagne for Zherdev and having an actual third pairing on defense. Everyone needs to cool the jets, please! We did make it to the Stanley Cup Finals no less than 2 months ago!
"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."
Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson
And 3 months ago we needed a shoot out to claw our way in to the playoffs…just saying.
It’s not a matter of cooling the jets, it’s a matter of having your confidence based on just more than the roster as it stands. It’s about your confidence in the front office, your confidence in management’s ability to handle next off season. your confidence in the farm system etc.
Don’t get me wrong, come time the season starts, I’ll be weighting the majority of my confidence in the team and how the perform on the ice, but those other areas will always factor in to my thought process.
Is this the right room for an argument?
Amen to that.
Unlike most of the Flyers fans I won’t be able to look at it from the distance and just wave it off, thinking ahhh, it’s all good after all. No, I’m sorry. I won’t ever be able to bring myself to think like that. And… I was half joking in my initial post.
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
Im not giving them a 100, but Id think myself a a fool to say I have 0% confidence
Confidence in the team, has nothing to do with my sadness that Gagne is gone.
The symbolic gesture was made. The anger that Gane is gone and we got squat in return affected my previous vote.
But to purposely lowballing the vote and not look at what we have would be a waste for me
YES we still have issues and we still have cap trouble!
But I am still confident we are better off than most teams.
I confident we have a ton of potential
I confident players like Carter and Hartnell (who had off years) will have great seasons ahead.
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on Jul 29, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re right. If I was more pragmatic I’d say that I agree with you 100%. But… I am not. Seeing Simon go, witnessing the way he’s been treated… that all went pretty deep and it will affect my view on this team for a very, very long time. I’m not saying my attitude is right. Probably isn’t. But that’s just…. me.
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
Agree
The team as is will win a lot of games. But how much longer can Homer cobble the team together from free agency and trades rather than developing players? With the salary cap, you need to have young players on entry level contracts performing well in order to best work with the free agents you overpaid for
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
well it would help if we had draft picks before round 3 but we haven’t had one of those in awhile.
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions
You had one for a while. Before you sent it to Tampa for Mr. Giveaway… oh boy (sigh)
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
I’m afraid he is. BUT… that was the whole Lightning D. He might excel in Philly.
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
He was a Monster in Ottawa and Im hoping it was that Tampa wasn’t right for him.
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on Jul 29, 2010 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Playing in Tampa leaves traces on you… Oh well, let’s keep the hope.
I love the Lightning AND the Flyers... go ahead, preach me!
Dare to follow my childish, biased, petty and cheesy alter ego.
American Cheese, B!tch! ... #1 mission? Kill Holmgren.
Just look at how Matt Carle ‘improved’ once he came here from TB. He recovered (if not exceeded) his SJ form once he left Florida. I have hopes that Meszaros can do the same – and at $4 mil per, he’d better!
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
You can’t say we haven’t been developing some players: JVR, Giroux, Bartulis, Laliberte, Nodl, Kalinski, Maroon…they have all been in the process of developing and all could some day be capable NHL players.
I won’t disagree that Homer is an idiot for giving away so many first and second rounders, but he has done so with success so far. We aren’t going to be a team like Pitt and Chi that built from a pile of shit because they tanked so many seasons. You don’t always get an Allstar player with a later pick.
"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."
Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson
JVR played 0 games in the organisation before playing for the Flyers and Giroux played ~30. The others have only been in the system for 1-2 seasons. I’m not saying I’d like to see the Flyers tank to get draft picks, but rather put more importance on picks and prospects instead of overpaying for free agents.
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
You don’t always get an Allstar player with a later pick.
Strictly speaking about late first rounders though, we’ve got some guys that prove those picks can still be pretty valuable. Some of our later picks are more valuable than guys drafted ahead of them. Just comparing draft position, whether or not we were the team that drafted them:
Early first rounders (Picks 1-10):
Scott Hartnell (6th overall, 2000)
Braydon Coburn (8th overall, 2003)
James Van Riemsdyk (2nd overall, 2007)
Chris Pronger (2nd overall, 1993)
Nikolai Zherdev (4th overall, 2003)
Late first rounders (Picks 20-30):
Simon Gagne (22nd overall, 1999)
Claude Giroux (22nd overall, 2006)
Mike Richards (24th overall, 2003)
Danny Briere (24th overall, 1996)
Brian Boucher (22nd overall, 1995)
Andrej Meszaros (23rd overall, 2003)
Whether some of those guys work out here is still unknown, but there are some pretty darn good names in that second group. I’d still rather Homer was keeping some of those late first round picks, because it’s definitely possible to get a gem there sometimes; but if you give the pick away every year, you don’t even have a chance to try.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jul 29, 2010 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions
do we finally have a 1st round pick again next year?
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes!!!!!! But whether Homer manages to not trade it for an entire year is another issue…
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
We should have a BSH pool.
When does Homer trade it?
Where does Homer trade it?
Who does Homer trade it for?
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
Great idea. Here’s my entry:
When does Homer trade it?
Trade deadline or just prior to it.
Where does Homer trade it?
Tampa Bay.
Who does Homer trade it for?
Matt Smaby. Team not big enough.
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
When does Homer trade it?
About 30 games into the season when he realises Leighton won’t cut it.
Where does Homer trade it?
Minnesota.
Who does Homer trade it for?
Part of a package including Matt Walker, David Laliberte and Boucher for Josh Harding and a lower level prospect
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
Don’t forget Leino he wasn’t on the team last year playing just 13 regular season games for the Flyers. He could be a really difference maker over an entire 82 game season. Factor in JVR development and Giroux development and a full season and training camp with Lavy. We can be a lot better. Without doing much to the roster.
Especially as everyone else loses some guys too I think Pittsburgh losing Gonchar and potentially Guerin would be huge for us. I know they got Martin and Mahelek but Gonchar was a stone cold Flyer kill from way back on the Caps teams. Caps didn’t do anything either to fix their lack of a blue-line. We own the Devils for whatever reason. Who really scares you as unbeatable. Halak is out of MTL. CHI was a stacked super team LAK has the potential to do that again this year with their cap situation but they don’t have the balls to go all in and frankly I don’t blame them.
Again, this doesn’t address anything but the on ice roster. My point is that I am ranking my confidence based more than the potential on ice performance for 2010/2011. I’m not forgetting anyone on the team, I’m not forgetting what else is happening around the league (whether I agree or disagree with you), rather I am trying to address the fact that the people with low confidence probably are grading the Flyers on more than just their on ice roster.
Is this the right room for an argument?
I guess you can do it that but to me nothing matter but the on ice roster. The goal of the ORGANIZATION is to win a Stanley Cup, not a Hockey Futures Best Farm System or a Calder Cup. Too much can happen from year to year with the CBA, cap, injuries, rules changes. It is hard continually build to the future.
You get a young core and try to surround them with best talent possible when the enter their prime years and give it your best shot over that time period. It is too hard to keep a team together for a long period of time and become a dynasty. Eventually you run of a gas and have to rebuild.
Eagles are rebuilding now and didn’t go all in enough when they had their best roster in their primes with the exception of 2004 basically they blew it by being too conservative.
Phillies have there core and are dumping most prospects draft picks and young talent to win now. Everyone agrees they should have kept Lee and now they have Oswalt. The only difference is that don’t have a real cap to restrict them like the Flyers do. Even though Werth will probably walk at the end of this year.
The Flyers have their core and are trying their best keeping their important key young players like JVR and GIroux and dumping everyone else to win in the next 3 years hopefully. Of course their farm system and number picks looks bad but that is where they are. Unfortunately we never have been bad enough to really stockpile superstars like CHI, WASH and PITTSBURGH so we are fitting a bit of a up hill battle.
I’m glad we were never that bad. Those teams had to tank it for many years consecutively to build teams and the pens had to deal with the possibility of moving to KC. Snider cares too much to ever let something like that happen to this team
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions
And that is the goal of the organization every year. And to have that potential every year, an organization must get the most value they can out of their players versus their cap hits, have young talent in the organizational depth charts with cap friendly hits, use FA wisely, and manage their cap effectively.
I like how you take my entire argument and ignore everything but one facet (the farm system). I think that’s why I tend to get so frustrated with you, you ignore most everything and focus your snarky counter point on one single issue.
So my confidence in the Flyers success today and in the future is also based on how the front office operates. And given this off season, I don’t have the confidence in them moving forward I would like to have. This impacts my view on how they can operate in mid season trades as well, which will also effect the immediate on ice roster. I realize you can’t win every year, but that is still my goal for this team (so I look at this year and beyond when I vote). And unfortunately these are still the facts: Homer didn’t maximize value with the additions he made this year given what the FA market revealed; B/c he could not maximize value, he kept himself from potentially dressing a better on ice roster; The organizational depth continues to be thin, so if their are significant injuries, the Phantoms will not be able to provide the stop gaps, causing Homer to either give up on the season or trade more assets. As I said before, I also don’t trust Homer moving forward at the trade deadline anymore given what has happened this off season (his lack of patience now scares me, as opposed to me liking his aggressiveness in previous years). I’d keep going but I think you get the point that my worries aren’t wrapped about a Hockey Futures ranking…
You don’t have to agree with me, but I’d appreciate it if you are going to use a counter argument, you’d actually address all of my points, instead of just one and then adding in a last sentence full of snark.
My confidence in the roster ~80% (it could have been better in my mind), My confidence in the front office/organizational depth ~20%. I’m weighting them 50/50 right now…hence I get to a 50%
Is this the right room for an argument?
This is not to say that this is the only way to vote for fan confidence, but rather a way to explain why people aren’t really getting carried away with negativity; that they may be considering more in their rating, or different things in their vote. That was why I responded in the first place. I don’t really care how people vote here, they can vote anyway they’d like, I just wanted to defend the potential reasons the people voting low confidence had, and try to do it without being rude towards anyone or how they choose to vote.
Then of course there was your awesome last sentence that sent me off the cliff again. Cause you reduced a list of criteria I presented that could explain the low confidence to
Unfortunately we never have been bad enough to really stockpile superstars like CHI, WASH and PITTSBURGH so we are fitting a bit of a up hill battle.
Is this the right room for an argument?
I actually agree with your other points so I didn’t bring them up.
I can understand why some people will vote that way. I just present my argument that all I care about with our current tim make up is the on ice roster. The Pronger trade set all this in motion. That move said, agree with it our not we going all in. And if you go all in you better go all the way in and not half ass it.
I might come off snarky at a shot of being somewhat humorous in a Lewis Black Dennis Leary over the top angry guy kind of way. Works sometimes other times it doesn’t.
I don’t think you can have it both ways an elite roster and a elite farm system. You can be good to very good in both departments but at some point you will have sacrifice one for the other. The hardest part of being a GM is knowing when it is time to give up and start moving things in the other direction.
Well then I guess I feel the stack Homer built is not sufficient for an all in move. Some of his moves in the off season suggest he is planning for the future as well, some appear like an all or nothing. If this is his all or nothing, he really screwed the pooch and I would still vote it low if I looked at this as grading an all or nothing move for this year. But in all honesty, I don’t think I could ever look at the confidence as just one year for the cup anyway b/c then I would have to vote 0% or a 100% in my mind b/c it be all or nothing…
Meh
Is this the right room for an argument?
and one of the major reasons we lost in those finals hasn’t been addressed.
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Well Chicago used to have depth and now they have 3rd and 4th line full of scrubs but i’d take niemi over leights
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
and in good news. The phillies fleeced the astros in the trade for Oswalt.
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 4:08 PM EDT reply actions
That is good news. :)
#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)
by Orange and Black Forever on Jul 29, 2010 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions
http://starsblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2010/07/agent-turco-will-end-up-with-competitive.html
Not to beat the rumor dead horse again but it seems like Turco will sign soon and that the Flyers’ goalie situation might depend on what happens with the Niemi arbitration
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 4:38 PM EDT reply actions
Bowman is apparently holding a press conference in a few minutes, probably about Niemi. The tension is killing me.
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
Me too!
I have also been waiting to find out about Boston’s Walker ruling. Its been more than 48 hours!
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on Jul 29, 2010 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
yet another post fail
Weeler not walker
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on Jul 29, 2010 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions
You mean Wheeler? The number floating out there is an award of $2.4 million, but his agent says he hasn’t heard anything yet.
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
Looks like the Bruins got a little lucky
GlobeBruins
Bruins blog: Wheeler nets $2.2 million arbitration award http://dlvr.it/39wCf #bruins
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on Jul 29, 2010 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions
does that mean the Hawks will get lucky with Niemi? I’m really interested in this Niemi arbitration b/c it could hold the keys to determining if and what move the Flyers make in the goalie department. Think about it; if Chicago walks away from Niemi no other team in the NHL has a spot or in our case cap space for him. Where would he go? Europe?
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Its the same arbiter in both cases but each decision is based on the personal arguments.
bread. butter. cheese. VICTORY!
by Prometheus74 on Jul 29, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Niemi ruling will be coming in on Saturday and then the Blackhawks will have 48 hours to decide what to do.
They had to call a whole press conference to say that? Couldn’t they just send out a press release or put out something on their site, Twitter, Facebook, etc. saying that?
Contributor at The Brotherly Game, SBN's Philadelphia Union blog
so I’m guessing that come the end of next week we shall see if the flyers finally decide to do something about the goalie question. My guess is that if Niemi stays w/ Hawks then turco signs with Flyers but if Niemi walks then it gets interesting
by historywillbemade on Jul 29, 2010 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions
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