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Line Combinations to start with

 

Line combinations

Here are the lines that I like and why for the start of the season.  Now they will change during the year with injuries and hot/cold streaks.

JVR – Richards – Carter

Hartnell – Briere – Leino

Carcillo – Giroux – Zherdev

Shelley/Powe – Betts/Powe – Lappierre

 

Here is my rationale.  First Briere proved that he is a big producer in the center and that entire line was incredible during the playoffs.  Start them and ride them as long as possible.  Second, let’s put JVR under some pressure to become a big time scoring winger.  With Richards and Carter on the line his defensive issues will be much less evident.  Third, put Zherdev with the best passer on the team and give them both a guy that can stir the drink in Carcillo on the wing.  This move also matches Claude against the 3rd defense pair usually.   Fourth, remember that Carter gives the team the ability to play with wall better than all the other centers due to his size.  He is also the only one of the group that can flat out shoot from all over the zone and score – another sign of a scoring winger. 

 

Defense

Here are my suggested defense pairs.

Pronger – Carle

Timonen – Mezzaros

Coburn – O’Donnell/Walker

 

This create 3 pairs that all have the ability to skate the puck out of danger, pass the puck up ice quickly, and play extremely physically on defense. 

 

Goalies

I would tell Boucher and Leighton that just like last year we are looking for them to make the saves they are supposed to make.  They will not be facing 45 shots a game with the defense in front of them.  They will win lots of games and put up great numbers if they stay square, challenge, and do not overplay the position.  Stay in the net, don’t go running around to shoot the puck.  I would also tell them both that they will each play around 30 games and the other 20 will be decided by who is hot at the time during key stretches. 

 

Good Night and Good Hockey! 

 

Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/BobHaynesJr

 

This item was written by a member of this community and is not necessarily endorsed by Broad Street Hockey.

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I agree with a lot. I was one of the first ones to suggest JVR on the top line and think it would be the best for the team. The only thing I’d change is the third and fourth line. I would rather see Powe on the third line with Giroux and Zherdev because he is good defensively and that line will lack some good back-checking. Carcillo play very well with Lappy and Betts on the fourth line last year and is better with hitters like himself. If Shelley is put into the line-up (for games against teams like the Leafs and the Rangers) Powe could come out and then Carcillo would be bumped up to the third. Besides that completely agree with you.

by Flyersfan94 on Aug 11, 2010 5:00 PM EDT reply actions  

Giroux is a better back checker than people give him credit for, but I’d rather not see him with Carcillo. I’d prefer Giroux to have to finishers.

by tmurder on Aug 11, 2010 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s what I get for not proof-reading.

by tmurder on Aug 11, 2010 7:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think you may see these lines to start with in the pre-season, but unless there is some instant chemistry, there will be juggling…

JVR/Carcillo (Lavvy throws Carbomb out there occasionally regardless) – Ritchie – Carter

Hartnell – Briere – Leino (MAN, I hope they can pick up where they left off)

Carcillo/Powe/JVR – Giroux – Zherdev (gonna depend on how JVR plays on the 1st line)

Carcillo/Powe/Shelley – Betts/Powe – Lappy

As for the Defense, pairings look good though we may see Coby & Mezzo switch around from 2nd to 3rd pairing…

Cheers,

Fezzy
http://fezzysworld.blogspot.com
Jesus Saves...He Passes, He Shoots...HE SCORES!

by Fezzlekway on Aug 11, 2010 5:28 PM EDT reply actions  

Might also see Ritchie & Carter switch back and forth between wing and center. I think Carter tends to be better on the draw and Ritchie is definitely more suited to play the winger’s role and muck it up a little in the corners…

Cheers,

Fezzy
http://fezzysworld.blogspot.com
Jesus Saves...He Passes, He Shoots...HE SCORES!

by Fezzlekway on Aug 11, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

nahh

carter is a sniper and Richie is a playmaker, regardless of how well Carter takes faceoffs, you hurt both players by switching their roles. and besides, Centers are usually the guys going into the corners anyway, leaving the side winger to go behind the net/up the boards and the opposite winger to swing to the center of the ice. Moving your defensemen to the end board and center means that the opposing team cant make a push the other way

example:
                 net

         LW C RW
D D

now convert that to this

C net
                   C
LW
                   D D

So if Richie is better in the corners, you want him at C

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 11, 2010 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

OK, scratch that x&o example because sbn doesnt use spaces

                Net
         LW….C….RW
D……………………………..D

converted to:

C…………net
                RW
LW
                 D……………….D

if it looks confusing because of the dots im sorry, but I cant think of another solution

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 11, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I really see this as a team that has to leave one or two guys out to dry. We are a forward short of being an offensive juggernaut. One line is going to play great but just be a guy short of being a bonafide scoring line. 4th line should be fun to watch.

Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"

by Ed Van Chimp on Aug 11, 2010 5:38 PM EDT reply actions  

To bad because if Homer had gotten a cheaper defenseman than Mez the team would have Gagne to fill out to complete the offensive juggernaut. Oh well.

by tmurder on Aug 11, 2010 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

True

You’re absolutely right, I thought the same thing. If a guy like Foster or even just aquiring Walker (maybe a 3rd for Walker rather then the 2nd for Meszaros) would have been good. Another good pick-up would’ve been Andy Sutton for under 2 million and plus not signing Shelley, there were so many ways we could have had Zherdev and Gagne.

by Flyersfan94 on Aug 11, 2010 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

but

Meszaros is the leighton equalizer. without Mez, we need a better goalie. And I think Carcillo will score 15 goals on that top line with Richards and Carter.

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 11, 2010 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fine, spend an extra 0.5 million and get a Turco/Ellis type

Briere, Betts and Pronger; Briere, Betts and Pronger; Briere, Betts and Pronger;
Our team is so much stronger
We've got Briere, Betts and Pronger...

by PursuitOfLappyness on Aug 12, 2010 4:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

I am still not sold that Turco/Ellis+Walker/Foster is any better than Leighton/Mez. But the Gagne thing is a good point I rather Have Leighton/Foster/Walker/Gagne than Leighton/Mez/Carcillo. A lot is riding on Mez if you can man the 2nd PP unit and pop in a few goals on top of returning to his OTTAWA form than if is totally worth it. But that is a big if.

by chrislanci on Aug 12, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'd bet the house on these lines

Carcillo – Richie – Carter
Hartnell – Brier – Lenio
JVR – Giroux – Zherdev
Powe – Betts – Lappy
Shelly

Pronger – Carel
Kimmo – Meszaros
Coburn – O’Donell
Walker

Leighton
Backlund

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 11, 2010 10:20 PM EDT reply actions  

For one, walker will probably be ahead of o’donnell. He’s younger, bigger and is a right handed shot. Secondly Coburn will start with Timonen. They work well together and Coburn was excelling at the end of the season.

by Flyersfan94 on Aug 12, 2010 3:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

O'donell

is a better fit though. he’ll start over Walker 100%

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 12, 2010 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree with you, except perhaps on the D pairings.

I just think it’s pretty awesome that for the first time in years, if a team pisses Lappy off enough, on the next meeting he’s got the personnel to beat the fuck out of the other team now.

Drop any D-man but Donny, bring up Walker, and now you’ve got a heavy, fighting 3rd line D to back up the XVZ line, and now any single unit the flyers put on the ice has a guy who the other team is going to be afraid of.

by BroadStreetBully on Aug 13, 2010 2:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you really suggesting scratching a superior defenseman in order to have O’Donnell and Walker as your 3rd pairing? If they ever do that, and sit a player making $3mil + (with the exception that they have somehow complete sit the bed or are injured), I would flip out. Why would you ever replace a guy that gives a team a better chance to win, with a guy that can kind of fight???

Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Aug 13, 2010 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

complete sit the bed completely shit the bed

Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Aug 13, 2010 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

agreed. Coburn or Mez are way better on the third line then walker. and whats was the point of trading for/signing if they were gonna be waived for nothing.

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 13, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

finally somebody agrees with what i’ve been saying

by phinally on Aug 12, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree except for JVR being on the top line. I think Carbomb will be on the top line, well to start the season at least. Carbomb is good protection for Richards (yes i know richie can protect himself, but he shouldn’t have to unless absolutely necessary). JVR is still developing and will hopefully prove himself to be top line worthy.

by SkookFlyerfan on Aug 11, 2010 11:01 PM EDT reply actions  

I think Lavvy will flip/flop between JVR and Carcillo on that top line depending on the situation.

Cheers,

Fezzy
http://fezzysworld.blogspot.com
Jesus Saves...He Passes, He Shoots...HE SCORES!

by Fezzlekway on Aug 12, 2010 9:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think you’re right. remember that Richards stated he liked having a power forward type on th eline wiht him so he doesn’t have to focus fully on the physical game.

"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27

by Mike B on D on Aug 12, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

JVR= Power forward but not physical
Carbomb= Not a power forward (by definition) but physical

So in your example Richie wants what? The power forward (JVR) or the physicality (Carbomb)

by OrangeNblacK on Aug 16, 2010 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

My ideal lines

Carcillo-Richards-Zherdev

Hartnell-Briere-Leino

JVR-Carter-Giroux

Powe-Betts-Lappy

Shelly

Pronger Carle
Kimmo Coburn
Mez O’Donnell

I don’t believe in Coburn can carry a pairing he couldn’t last year I don’t think he can now I don’t want to ruin his fragile confidence every fall.

Having one of Carter, Zherdev and Briere on the ice for pretty much the entire game equals scoring threat out there at all times, regardless of who they are playing with. Good luck try to match your D-pairings against that lineup.

Giroux to RW with Carter and JVR that line make up reminds most of the Hartnell Carter Lupul make up and could work out.

Giroux playing with better players to to me is more important to me that Giroux playing at Center.

by chrislanci on Aug 12, 2010 12:26 PM EDT reply actions  

what’s wrong with switching giroux and carter and then you can have both him at center & with better players?

by phinally on Aug 12, 2010 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

not in my lineup Giroux is playing with Carter both can’t be center

by chrislanci on Aug 16, 2010 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

what do you guys think of:

Carter-Richards-Zherdev
Carcillo-Briere-Leino
JVR-Giroux-Hartnell
Powe-Betts-Lappy

by phinally on Aug 12, 2010 2:10 PM EDT reply actions  

No

First, you have to keep the hartnell, briere leino line together to at least start off. Their chemistry was unbelievable. Secondly, Giroux needs finishers. JVR is young and isn’t a finisher and nor is Hartnell, they’re both big guys. Lastly, carter richards and zherdev won’t happen because you don’t want all ypur talent on one line. Carter, Zherdev and Briere are our best pure goal scorers, and as chrislanci pointed out you need to spread them out.

by Flyersfan94 on Aug 12, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

2nd overall pick? JVR better become a finisher.

Cheers,

Fezzy
http://fezzysworld.blogspot.com
Jesus Saves...He Passes, He Shoots...HE SCORES!

by Fezzlekway on Aug 12, 2010 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah i know the hbl line should stay together. i was just throwing out another random setup that didn’t look like anyones else. and yeah, jvr better become a scorer. if you read my other posts, its clear what lines i really want. and it was actually me who pointed out they need to be split up, ironically in a discussion with chrislanci

by phinally on Aug 12, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

to quote myself:

i do not think carcillo is a great player or anything and i def don’t want him to be on the first line. BUT he does not fit in anywhere else. throughout the year, carcillo looked at his best with richards. of course this doesn’t mean richards did as well. he can keep up with the first line. richards and carter are both great players and they will prob produce no matter what. sure they could use another winger if they are on the same line, but i don’t think that is the best allocation of resources. with giroux, to maximize his potential he needs two scorers. i believe that zherdev and jvr would compliment his play immensely and end up being the best combination one could put together with the players we have. they have to hold the HBL line as a constant(which i think they at least deserve in the beginning of the year) and none of our fourth liners can be moved bc their talent is specialized to that line only(in a sense). so carcillo is forced onto the first line.

by phinally on Aug 9, 2010 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions
 
i’m also saying that just as we split up pronger and timonen to spread out talent, we need to split up our best scorers. having carter-richards-zherdev as a superline sounds great but it seems that wouldn’t benefit the other players as much as other scenarios.

by phinally on Aug 9, 2010 12:35 AM EDT up reply actions

by phinally on Aug 12, 2010 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Carter – Richards – Zherdev = 1st PowerPlay Unit
Hartnell/JVR – Briere – Leino/Giroux = 2nd Power play Unit

Other than the Powerplay, I agree 100%, they must spread out the talent. They have enough talent for 3 very good and balanced scoring lines…

Cheers,

Fezzy
http://fezzysworld.blogspot.com
Jesus Saves...He Passes, He Shoots...HE SCORES!

by Fezzlekway on Aug 12, 2010 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

If Giroux isn’t on the PP I’m going to throw my TV out the window.

Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"

by Ed Van Chimp on Aug 13, 2010 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

With JVR and Hartnell on the same line you have two of the same wingers – big but not especially skillful – around one of the most dynamic centers the Flyers have seen. A complete waste of Giroux. Also, pairing Carter and Zherdev together does a similar thing; we assume Carter will continue his sniper ways and not revert (progress?) to his two-way form of a few seasons ago, Zherdev is a complete sniper, and honestly Richie isn’t a bad set-up man but needs some more support than those two wingers. The Powe/Betts/Lappy line is pretty damn well set in stone, unless something really goofy happens and Powe gets bumped up. Carcillo, Briere, and Leino could work, but unless that combination shows real chemistry in camp I wouldn’t expect to see it.

My personal selections to start training camp would be:

Hartnell – Briere – Leino (give ‘em another shot, but JVR could get a chance here)
JVR – Carter – Giroux (only lacking factor is a mucker, but between JVR and G should be OK.)
Carcillo – Richards – Zherdev (I’m reluctant to put Zherdev with any other center than Richie)
Shelley – Powe/Betts – Lappy (and shunt Shelley to press box when Betts is healthy)

These aren’t original (chrislanci and I seem to agree entirely, for example) but they make three very potent and balanced scoring lines, and one nasty energy line. I like it.

Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.

by penguinsfan on Aug 13, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

JVR is more skillful then Hartnell, mainly because he can pass and skate. Most of Hartnell’s goals are tip ins. Not saying that Hartnell’s a bad player, just that JVR is(will defiantly be in the future) more skilled then Hartnell will ever be.

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 14, 2010 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

I still don’t see JVR, as much as I love him, as has having a great shot he might have moves and size and soft hands but I don’t think he can overpower you with his wrister like Danny, Zherdev and Carter can.

by chrislanci on Aug 16, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

thats what I mean

Carter>JVR>Hartnell

saying "F**k Homer" since 7-19-10

by JpH89 on Aug 18, 2010 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

Is it a nice one? I am looking for a new TV, let me know the address so I can be there to catch it lol!

Cheers,

Fezzy
http://fezzysworld.blogspot.com
Jesus Saves...He Passes, He Shoots...HE SCORES!

by Fezzlekway on Aug 13, 2010 9:48 AM EDT reply actions  

It is pretty old and heavy, might want to set up a net or something? Won’t matter, I can’t see any way you keep your best playmaker off of the PP.

Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"

by Ed Van Chimp on Aug 15, 2010 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Giroux is not the best play maker on the team. Danny B is. I love Giroux and he has the world of talent but and can dazzle but he hasn’t put up the numbers to justify

“Giroux must play center”
“must be on the top PP unit”

partially because he hasn’t reached his prime yet and he hasn’t played with top notch players yet but his time will come for now he is the 4th best center but could easily be the second best RW

by chrislanci on Aug 16, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

i know this is what we were basically discussing before but this is what i disagree with you on. richards and briere are better centers than giroux. they are established playmakers and stars. but carter. he is a great player and a great scorer but he is not as good of a playmaker as giroux. he is a better forward, but does this make him a better center? i don’t think so. i think giroux is clearly a better passer and setup guy which is why i stress he should be at center. it sucks for carter that he would be the odd man out, but he just happens to be a better scorer than playmaker. carter had more goals last year playing with better players, while giroux had more assists playing with inferior talent.

so im saying that giroux is the third best center on the team and should play there. carter can’t play fourth line center, so he’s thrown to wing

by phinally on Aug 17, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think you have your passer at center. You have your best players at center not your best playmaker because you want the puck on the stick of your best players more often.

Center is a position, passing is a skill. You can have passers on the wing and shooters at center who really cares as long as you have passers with finishers.

by chrislanci on Aug 18, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

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