Reviewing the 09-10 Flyers VUKOTA Projections
With ESPN putting up an article from Timo Seppa (unless you have Insider, you can't see it yet) teasing the upcoming VUKOTA projections yesterday, I figured I should probably publish the recap from last years. When the article goes up on Puck Prospectus, you can find the Insider article it in the Fly By.
If you recall, last year we looked at the VUKOTA projections for the 09-10 Flyers. There, we looked specifically at the GVT projections, which I thought were a bit low. Well, it turns out VUKOTA did a pretty good job.
To make things simple - and fair to the system - I only looked at players who actually played in 40 games this past year and had a projection from VUKOTA. This created a 16 player sample - 11 forwards and 5 defensemen - to look at. The total team results were:
| 40+ GP | GP | G | A | Pts | GVT |
| Projected | 1009.2 | 212.0 | 351.0 | 563.1 | 108.3 |
| Actual | 1181 | 207 | 350 | 557 | 111.4 |
Looking just at this, the system as a whole did a pretty good job at predicting the 09-10 Flyers. But what about the projection in it's entirety?
Jump to find out.
Now, if you saw the actual Puck Prospectus article in the link above, the Flyers were projected to do this:
| Team | GF | GA | Pts | GVT |
| Projected | 257 | 257 | 94 | 118.7 |
| Actual | 232 | 222 | 88 | 117.7 |
When it first came out, everyone thought the projections were too pessimistic. Turns out they weren't that far off. The problem is, when totaling all the players in the VUKOTA projections, the expected goals scored was 237.2. That's not what the Puck Prospectus article said was expected. So let's try to explain it.
Here's looking at the full chart of individual Flyers' performances and VUKOTA projections:
| Sum of Individual | GP | G | A | Pts | GVT |
| Projected | 1290.3 | 237.2 | 396.6 | 633.9 | 117.4 |
| Actual | 1476 | 234 | 393 | 627 | 117.7 |
While we see similar scores across the board, this is where we see the flaw: The VUKOTA projections didn't include enough games played. Every year, the Flyers have 82 games with 18 skaters equaling 1476 games played. VUKOTA was over 2 full seasons off (186 games divided by 82 games = 2.27 seasons) in their projections. While this isn't perfect, let's assume VUKOTA had the averages right and just extend their projections over a full NHL season:
| Rate | GP | G | A | Pts | GVT |
| Projection | 1476 | 271.3 | 350.7 | 725.1 | 134.3 |
| Actual | 1476 | 234 | 393 | 627 | 117.7 |
And there we see how VUKOTA's team projections were off. Well, that or just how badly the team underperformed this year. I mean, we can't blame VUKOTA for not predicting what none of us could predict: that the team just wouldn't score.
So how did VUKOTA do predicting each individual player? For the entire spreadsheet, click here. For the file of those players who didn't reach the 40 game threshold, or who didn't have projections, click here.
Before looking at the chart - since it's long - here's the key: PGP = Predicted games played; AGP = Actual games played; PPts/G = Predicted points per game; APts/G = Actual points per game.
| Name | PGP | AGP | PPts/G | APts/G |
| Richards | 76 | 82 | 1.04 | 0.76 |
| Carter | 78.7 | 74 | 0.96 | 0.82 |
| Gagne | 69.1 | 58 | 0.90 | 0.69 |
| Pronger | 69.8 | 82 | 0.62 | 0.67 |
| Giroux | 52.4 | 82 | 0.72 | 0.57 |
| Briere | 48.5 | 75 | 0.83 | 0.71 |
| Hartnell | 71.4 | 81 | 0.72 | 0.54 |
| Timonen | 70.6 | 82 | 0.50 | 0.48 |
| Coburn | 70.4 | 81 | 0.44 | 0.23 |
| Carle | 63.4 | 80 | 0.36 | 0.44 |
| Laperriere | 61.2 | 82 | 0.27 | 0.24 |
| Parent | 42.4 | 48 | 0.18 | 0.06 |
| Asham | 58.2 | 72 | 0.27 | 0.33 |
| Powe | 53.4 | 63 | 0.30 | 0.24 |
| Carcillo | 59.2 | 76 | 0.31 | 0.29 |
| Betts | 64.4 | 63 | 0.14 | 0.29 |
Italics indicate players who beat their projections. Bold indicates those who missed by 0.15 points per game or more.
By this metric, you can see that many regulars produced far less than expected. Mike Richards, Simon Gagne, Claude Giroux, Scott Hartnell, and Braydon Coburn all missed their marks by 0.15 or more. Jeff Carter missed by 0.14 per game. Danny Briere missed by 0.12 per game. The only person predicted to score half a point per game or more who didn't miss by 0.12 points per game or more was Chris Pronger. And yet, this group as a whole only produced 9 points fewer than projected. How is this possible, you ask? They played an additional 171 games. Had the group produced as projected - in the same amount of games - they would have scored an additional 102 points.
Again, whether you want to say VUKOTA is inaccurate or the Flyers had a miserable season is up to you. Really, it's probably a combination of the two. The only player to far exceed expectations was Blair Betts, and then you have to wonder why he was projected to score fewer points per game than Ryan Parent to begin with.
While we're not going to go over the second spreadsheet - those players under 40 games and rookies - know that James van Riemsdyk made up for a lot of the poor results. In the file, you may notice outlines around the cells. That was done to group players by games played to see if there were any correlations. There really weren't. To see VUKOTA fail, this is the chart to look at. But before criticizing it, know that Timo didn't want the Lukas Kaspar, Krystofer Kolanos, Jason Ward, OK Tollefsen, and Danny Syvret projections published because of small sample sizes. In other words, VUKOTA doesn't claim to project this chart. It's just too difficult to predict what the Jon Kalinskis and David Lalibertes of the world will do.
Conclusion
At first glance, VUKOTA seemed to predict the 09-10 Flyers performance fairly well. But when you look deeper and see that the team achieved the same amount of success in a far greater amount of games, it becomes apparent that VUKOTA missed the mark. Even then, look at this:
| Name | 2007-08 | 2008-09 | VUKOTA | 2009-10 |
| Richards | 1.03 | 1.01 | 1.04 | 0.76 |
| Carter | 0.65 | 1.02 | 0.96 | 0.82 |
| Gagne | 0.72 | 0.94 | 0.90 | 0.69 |
| Pronger | 0.60 | 0.59 | 0.62 | 0.67 |
| Giroux | --- | 0.64 | 0.72 | 0.57 |
| Briere | 0.91 | 0.86 | 0.83 | 0.71 |
| Hartnell | 0.54 | 0.73 | 0.72 | 0.54 |
| Timonen | 0.55 | 0.56 | 0.50 | 0.48 |
| Coburn | 0.46 | 0.35 | 0.44 | 0.23 |
| Carle | 0.24 | 0.34 | 0.36 | 0.44 |
| Laperriere | 0.27 | 0.26 | 0.27 | 0.24 |
| Parent | 0.00 | 0.13 | 0.18 | 0.06 |
| Asham | 0.13 | 0.26 | 0.27 | 0.33 |
| Powe | --- | 0.18 | 0.30 | 0.24 |
| Carcillo | 0.42 | 0.19 | 0.31 | 0.29 |
| Betts | 0.09 | 0.12 | 0.14 | 0.29 |
There are quite a few huge outliers there. Richards, Gagne, Giroux, Briere, Hartnell, and Coburn, all had their worst years in the past two years. Were the VUKOTA projections that far off their previous two years' production? Not at all. The projections seem accurate. The results seem to be outliers.
Just something to keep in mind when checking out the 10-11 VUKOTA projections, which will be coming shortly.
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It wasn’t that the Flyers didn’t score all year, it’s that they went through periods were “didn’t score” was absolutely literal. I wonder if during those periods when the Flyers were averaging 3-4+ gpg, were players matching or exceeding their projections?
Well, how long were those periods? The team averaged 2.83 goals per game (higher than I thought), good for 8th in the league. And yet only Asham, Powe, Carcillo, and Betts scored more points per game this year than last year. Only Asham and Betts had a higher points per game than expected.
That’s what I was getting at.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 17, 2010 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I had to dig it up, but my comment was mainly in reference to this article.
I’m really just trying to figure out whether the Flyers, playing well, were at the correct clip or exceeding expectations. Because I know what the Flyers looked like at the beginning of the year, during Leights’ first stint, and before the Olympic break, and that would give me a real life equivalent for these projections.
Well that’d be difficult to do, and I honestly wouldn’t even care what the results were. Every team goes through funks, but the Flyers were hot 50% of the season, cold the other 50%. Taking into account only the periods where they were playing well isn’t an accurate depiction of them meeting or exceeding expectations.
My guess is that they were performing at a clip well above expectations during the hot streaks, and a clip well below expectations during the cold streaks, rounding out to where they finished.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 17, 2010 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, I wasn’t suggesting you run the numbers. It was merely a thought experiment for me, as a way to interpret the numbers. I can’t look at VUKOTA numbers and feel anything strongly, but I can remember how I felt beating up the Canadiens in February.
haha, well, you and me both. I just like to see how they did. It’s kind of a “VUKOTA said this would happen. Did it?” type of experiment for me.
I honestly had no bias entering it. Either they were right or they weren’t, and I came up with "They were wrong just like everybody else, with something (point totals) to hang their hat on.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 17, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions
How much of the difference was the SHG production from the prior season? With the additions of both Betts and Lappy, Richards,Carter and Gagne played less on the PK and, would ergo have had less scoring chances.
ps – I didn’t look anything up there, just was looking for a way to use ‘ergo" this morning. It’s not quantified in anyway, just pure gut hunch. And I’ve got the gut to make it.
Difference between last season and this season was 10 SHG, albeit in an additional 58 times short-handed, which needs to be accounted for. Percentage-wise, the Flyers scored short-handed 1.79% of the time in 2009-10. In 2008-09, it was 4.07% of the time. If we go by percentages, to adjust for the fewer TSH, the Flyers should have had 13.64 SHG. Rounding to 14, that would mean they “should” have scored 8 more if they kept up last year’s ridiculous pace. That would have moved the team to 240 GF, still short of the VUKOTA projection.
Honor is no substitute for victory.
The last four years, the Flyers have scored 15, 13, 16, and 6 shorthanded goals. They definitely lost scoring on the penalty kill, mostly due to Carter and Richards losing over a minute per game each. Combined, the two went from 13 points on the PK to 4.
Is that something worth noting? Definitely. Does that bring them up to the predicted level or last year’s level? No.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 19, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
I mean, we can’t blame VUKOTA for not predicting what none of us could predict: that the team just wouldn’t score.
I like how you said wouldn’t, not couldn’t hah!
I had a bit of a look around, but couldn’t find a good explanation as to why Vukota would predict so many games lost for the Flyers? Is it purely based on last season. I wonder how PDO and Vukota would match up for the past two seasons….might be something worth a look?
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
They base it on individuals health. Games played over the past few years. Plus, the Flyers had a lot of players play 78+ games. That’s pretty unusual.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 19, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Geoff Detweiler of Broad Street Hockey looked at some VUKOTA projections for the Flyers last season and found that many players fell well short.
Mike Richards, Simon Gagne, Claude Giroux, Scott Hartnell, Braydon Coburn, Jeff Carter and Danny Briere all missed their points-per-game projections by various margins, with playoff hero Richards falling short by .28 in the regular season.
"We can’t blame VUKOTA for not predicting what none of us could predict: that the team just wouldn’t score," writes Detweiler, who fails to note that the Flyers finished third in the Eastern Conference in goals per game with 2.83 during the regular season.
Bit of a shot at you in that last sentence there, Geoff, from CSN.
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“The dig was completely necessary and in step with the site’s journalistic integrity,” writes the anonymous writer for CSNPhilly.com, who fails to note the Flyers regular season goal total was down 28 goals from last year, and who clearly didn’t read comments where Detweiler noted the Flyers goal total was 8th in the league.
Thanks for that.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 19, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
No mention of them scoring 0.34 goals less per game than last year, or 0.17 less than they did two years ago.
But no, lets just look at how bad the East was and criticize me.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 19, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I get the feeling someone looked at the post, decided not to think about the numbers but rather find something to pick at.
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
Probably true. I don’t read those “rumblings” or whatever they call that post anyway. If I cared what other sites wrote, I’d read them myself. Probably just some intern’s job to browse blogs and compile what we write.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 19, 2010 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Looking at goals per month

Goals scored for and against monthly perhaps isn’t the best way to look at it, but it’s a start. Oct and Jan are really propping up the rest of the months. Feb was a very good defensive month, and then March was awful. And in the run to the playoffs, the goals for and goals against was identical at 2.5.
Backing Backlund for 2010-2011
Mourning Gagne forever.
Good work. Thems some big spikes you got there.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 19, 2010 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s exactly what it is, actually. Just some intern… I presume that’s why those posts have no by-line, too.
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by Travis Hughes on Aug 19, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions

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