A few words about that 'Kris Versteeg to the Flyers' rumor
If there's anything I've learned in the last few months or so, it's that people who start rumors are usually just grasping at straws. They want so badly to be the one who BROKE THE STORY, ultimately so that they become FAMOUS and people VISIT THEIR WEBSITE, that they'll literally just throw anything at the wall and hope it sticks. (Nevermind the fact that the easiest way to get noticed and respected in this business is to have smart opinions, smart
Whether it's analyzing a meaningless list of scouts attending a particular game -- which means nothing; you realize they get paid to watch hockey and they do this all year, not just at the deadline, right? -- or trying to work the salary cap non-stop until they find some loophole that nobody's realized yet, these people just do this stuff to look like some kind of insider.
It's actually kind of funny, when you think about -- that is, besides the fact that all they're doing is making more work for the reputable among us. Fortunately, you don't need to be an insider to see where rumors start. All you need is a few minutes and a search engine.
There's this one that's been circulating around for a few days now that the Philadelphia Flyers are interested in Kris Versteeg. The obvious part is that OF COURSE they're interested in Kris Versteeg. He's a nice player, he's young, he's cheap, he's a winger and he's apparently available (although I question that, too, because he's the exact kind of player Brian Burke would want to build around in Toronto). He'd be a great addition to any team -- not just the Flyers.
But that's the thing. I guess that's the beauty of rumors in that they usually just state the obvious. Sure, the Flyers are interested. I'm sure they were interested in Wayne Gretzky once too, but that doesn't mean they went out and got him.
So why the hell has this risen to the level that its been picked up by Yahoo! and its been mentioned in the comments on this site several times over the last few days, then? Ah, let's find the origin.
That Yahoo! link really does make it look reputable, but let's look at exactly where its housed over there. It's not on Puck Daddy or on their main NHL page. It's on a blog called Scoop Du Jour, which basically just aggregates rumor news from other sources. There's no original reporting there. It's just an aggregator.
Here's what writer Mark J. Martin said:
Versteeg helped the Chicago Blackhawks win the Stanley Cup last year and could be helping the Boston Bruins or Philadelphia Flyers soon enough. Those are two of the teams thought to be interested in Versteeg.
Yahoo! cited a story in the National Post on the Leafs potentially trading Versteeg. In that story, there's not one mention of the Flyers at all. There's a mention of the Boston Bruins but no sign of anything Philadelphia in there. Not even a sniff.
Where did Yahoo! come up with it, then? If you pull up Google and type in "flyers versteeg", you only get one real result. It's not Toronto's Globe and Mail or another National Post story or TSN or anybody else. It's Bleacher Report.
The Flyers have been in the rumor mill for a few months and they have scouted a few teams this season such as the Chicago Blackhawks, Los Angeles Kings and Edmonton Oilers.
Ahem, the Flyers scout every team in the NHL. There are 30 teams. Not three.
Philadelphia has also apparently been shopping around for a winger, most likely for Mike Richards to play with. With that said, the Toronto Maple Leafs have let it be known that they are "not done dealing yet"-even with the trades they have made so far-which only leads people to believe that Toronto is open for business.
If that is the case, the Flyers would be wise to take a hard look at Kris Versteeg. He would be a perfect fit in Philadelphia and could compliment somebody like Richards very well. Versteeg wouldn't exactly break the bank for Philadelphia either, so he is most certainly a very real option.
[...]
With only 18 days left until the trade deadline, it won't be long before we see what the Flyers have up their sleeve. They're definitely up to something, that I can say with certainty.
And there's the source of your rumor. His name is Mike Pantaleone, and he's a "Flyers Featured Columnist" at Bleacher Report. In addition to this Versteeg fabrication, he's written such stories slideshows as 'Philadelphia Flyers Trade Rumors: Five Players Most Likely on the Trade Block" (No. 5 is Ville Leino) and "NHL 2011: 50 Bold Predictions for the Second Half of the NHL Season," where Dustin Byfuglien is apparently a "lock" for the Norris.
This guy has never been in the press box at a Flyers game. If I'm wrong, he can come shake my hand on Sunday. I'm usually in Seat 35. He's not an insider (neither am I, for the record -- nor do I necessarily wish to be) and thus, he cannot say with certainty that the Flyers are up to something. Frankly, he doesn't know what he's talking about.
Here's the unfortunate truth about Bleacher Report. The writers over there are mostly young and they're mostly all looking to make a name for themselves, which is a noble cause to be sure. We all start somewhere. Most of them seemingly just don't understand the right way to do that.
There isn't much in terms of editorial oversight, so while it's true that B/R recently got rid of a lot of the lower quality writers there, the ones who are still there are able to basically publish whatever they want -- that is, after it's optimized for search.
With B/R's unbelievable search strategy, those rumors are fed to anybody using Google. You've seen it. If you search almost any term in sports, you'll get B/R drivel in your results. Most of it, sadly, is stuff like this -- just baseless speculation with no root in truth.
Unfortunately, a lot of people see it on Google and automatically think its for real. "I mean, Google linked to it. Google wouldn't steer me wrong!'
Thousands of people read this stuff and as a result, they spread like wildfire. I understand that we can't stop Bleacher Report from doing what they're doing -- low quality, large scale content -- but those of us who are trying to do real work here have a responsibility.
The Yahoo! writer, Mark J. Martin, didn't live up to that responsibility in this case. He didn't cite his source on this rumor and as a result, it became more than just another B/R piece of BS. We can shrug it off and ignore it when it's at Bleacher Report simply because we know better. When it hits Yahoo!, we can't do that anymore.
So here's the long and short of it, because I know that after writing 1,000 words on this, the Flyers are going to go out and trade for Kris Versteeg. It's a plausible idea. Like I said, he's cheap, he's a winger, he'd be a great addition. He's won a Cup.
But there's no reason to think, beyond the fact that it does indeed make sense, that Paul Holmgren and the Flyers are going after the guy. There's no "insider" saying that they're in on him. There's no "source" here at all. It's just a nice little possibility to think about. Nothing more, nothing less.
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I heard bleacher report, thus I know it must be wrong. I bet Eklund is all over this story to….
.
And watch us trade for him now haha.
Samesis
Bleacher Report is so bad
Not even Eklund is throwing the Flyers in the running for Versteeg.
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Yeah, I saw an article from there a couple weeks ago on why the Phills should trade Lee. I never actually did a real life facepalm until that moment.
Samesis
Ah, I see you discovered Jorge Suarez. He is either the dumbest writer in the history of Bleacher Report (which really is saying something) or he is a troll taking down B/R from the inside (i.e. a smart guy playing dumb). If the latter is the case, I have a guess as to who it is, but I am not saying who it is because I will inevitably be wrong.
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Eklunds as full of crap as bleacher report is, sorry but he doesn’t exactly get much right, in fact bleacher report is just as accurate. Bottom line there is little truth to either they are just fun to read.
by ryanitus on Feb 12, 2011 5:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree with you. My post was essentially trying to convey the message that this Bleacher Report article is so bad that Eklund is staying away from it.
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Oh I didn’t mean any offense with the comment I agree with you totally. Id like to see the flyers get Ales Hemsky or Versteeg. I like Hemsky better he’s a pure playmaker but he’s injured too often so Versteeg would be the better option.
by ryanitus on Feb 12, 2011 6:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Spoke Too Soon
This was posted after the game today.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklund/Sunday-Night-Rumortopia—Sabres-Leafs-Habs-Hawks-Caps-Flyers-SJ-LA/1/33660
For all the shit that is swimming around B/R there was one article that really made me laugh.
It was about Gary Bettman being in talks with a few anime studios about a partnership between them and the NHL..
The original article on B/R was deleted, but some other blog c/ped it, so here it is in all it’s glory.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/17EEcvyc179Hkg1t_j-4cCjIC-jlY_uGSOS0Ny-JwLkI/edit?hl=en#
If these walls could speak, I wouldn't tell them anything.
haha man, and I thought the Guardian Project was bad, the last thing we need is to have an Ouran High School Host Club featuring the NHL’s best players.
Samesis
Ouran High School Host Club featuring the NHL’s best players.
Crosby fits the lead character of that to a T. A girl who dresses like a boy.
If these walls could speak, I wouldn't tell them anything.
Haha I cant tell you anything about that show except I used it for a lot of very crude, NSFW jokes about Pat Burrell back in the day.
Samesis
There was actually a fun little manga called “Go Ahead” about a new teacher starting an ice hockey club at the school he’s teaching at. Funny bit about it though, the lead kid who’s gonna be his star grew up in Canada and his favorite player is….
Lindros!
Mourning Hartnell's hair
It was outlandish right from the start, but it at least pretended that it was trying to sound authentic in the beginning. But that last paragraph was the hardest I’d laughed all week.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 13, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
I totally understand the wish to be a famous sports journalist who “breaks” a key story, but honestly finding every player that doesn’t have a NTC and could hypothetically fit under a teams salary cap doesn’t really seem like reporting, it seems like weird obsessive number crunching. Nice piece Travis, this is why I joined BSH.
Just because a team asks about a player doesn’t mean the team is serious about acquiring said player. Even if you plan to stay pat at the trade deadline, any GM worth his money should be calling all other GMs, inquiring about the value of key players in the NHL. It’s all about buying low and selling high — as we’ve learned especially from the Leino and Coburn trades, you can find some real gems on the open market if you keep your eyes open for them.
Lifelong Tennessean, Flyers' fan for life
by TNBrando on Feb 12, 2011 4:34 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The thing about the Versteeg “rumor” is that it doesn’t pass the smell test. Guy is a good player, but do the Flyers want to acquire someone who has a $3 million cap hit for next year when they still have to sign Leino? Seems like Holmgren should be more in favor of dealing for an expiring contract, but we’ll see, I guess.
As for the Bleacher Report bashing, it’s understandable but not sure if it’s warranted in this case. The guy basically just says “I think it would be a good idea if the Flyers look into acquiring Versteeg.” Fair point – I’ve read tons of pieces on SBNation sites making similar arguments. The real culprit here is Martin, who read an opinion article and presented it as fact. If Pantaleone implied that he had a source, that’s another story entirely.
I tend to just think of Bleacher Report as a gigantic opinion blog, with writers who range from good to absolutely atrocious. The problem is that some people (like Martin here) view them as a legitimate news source. B/R is partially to blame there, because they flood the net with so much content and sort of position themselves as more reputable than they actually are. When in reality (for the most part), they should be viewed no differently than the thousands of independent blogs out there.
Full disclosure: I wrote for B/R a bit last summer, mainly because I was bored and because it’s alot easier to work with their existing interface (which is very good) than start my own blog. Stopped because I didn’t like being associated with the reputation of the site. But I never viewed myself as a journalist – just as someone writing opinion pieces. That’s the way it should be viewed, in my opinion. The problem is when people start viewing it as something more.
As for the Bleacher Report bashing, it’s understandable but not sure if it’s warranted in this case. The guy basically just says "I think it would be a good idea if the Flyers look into acquiring Versteeg." Fair point – I’ve read tons of pieces on SBNation sites making similar arguments.
The difference is in the branding. The headline of that story calls it a “Rumor”, which implies that there’s a source involved. It’s not “NHL Trade Speculation.” It’s “Rumor.” He claims inside information with that sentence at the end. But yes, you make great points all around. It really is on the Yahoo! writer here, when push comes to shove. I tried to illustrate that in what I wrote.
(I think the Flyers could acquire Versteeg if they traded Zherdev. It’s unlikely — but plausible, at least.)
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Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. 2010 Eastern Conference Champions.
by Travis Hughes on Feb 12, 2011 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
I hope Eklund is not reading that last sentence. You are a credentialed member of the media. Hello, e3! ;-)
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Actually, I didn’t click the link until you just brought that up, and you’re right – the title is misleading and doesn’t match the content.
Knowing how their editors work, however, I wouldn’t be shocked if the original title as written by the author was different, and it was changed by editors later for search engine optimization. But you’re right, using that title is a legitimate reason for criticism.
The branding is a good point. I wonder if he had any editorial control over the headline. I don’t how it works but maybe you have an idea how it is at the BR? I think if don’t read carefully, the article could leave you with the impression that the author had some sort of inside scoop onthe deal. This reminds me of the recent rumor about Reid getting replaced by John Gruden. Kyle Eckle posts it on Facebook (how common is it to post nonsense on Facebook? It’s what Facebook is all about), and media outlets pick it up. I blame them, not Eckle.
"All the experts come out, all the pundits come out with their opinions...the truth of the matter is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it" - George McPhee, General Manager, Washington Capitals.
And just like that
Panotch make a story:
http://www.csnphilly.com/02/12/11/bNHL-Notebookb-Torontos-Versteeg-in-Flye/landing_insider_panaccio.html?blockID=409259&feedID=704
“facepalm”
Samesis
headdesk
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Though in defense of Panotch, this does read more like speculation, not citing a report that the Flyers are actually pursuing Versteeg. But geez, I wonder where he got the idea from…………..
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
At least Panotch’s story insinuates that they tried to talk to Burke.
That darn B/R feed being imbedded in their articles probably makes it more likely that they’re actually reading B/R’s drivel, though.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 13, 2011 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
What did Toronto trade to get him ?
Viktor Stalberg, Chris DiDomenico, and Philippe Paradis
Stalberg 20pt AHL player (this season 40 games) signed from the Swedish Elite League
Chris DiDomenico 7.0D rated prospect former 6th round draft pick
Philippe Paradis AHL Amateur Pro Tryout Signee of the Marlies undrafted
Toronto also got
Bill Sweatt a former 2st round pick from the Blackhawks 38th overall. He didn’t sign with the Maple Leafs this summer and went free agent was picked up by Vancouver.
So they basically gave up nothing to get Versteeg who knows what they will want in return.
Do we have a 1st round pick and would you trade that for a 24 year potential 25 goal scoring RW. I would I don’t think you are going to be able to draft a better player at 29 or 30th overall. Just a matter of making the salary work for next season. But we can worry about that next season or in the summer post parade.
I am fine with trading picks for young players no more 1st rounders for 37 year olds but for a 24 year old that fills the weakest position in the organization. I certainly would test the waters.
Definitely worth a 1st round pick and maybe a prospect in the ahl. Drafting in the first round is not a guarantee but Versteeg is a proven young talented player with playoff experience, I like Ales Hemsky better but he’s injury prone so I think Versteeg is a player they should look into acquiring.
by ryanitus on Feb 12, 2011 6:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
So they basically gave up nothing to get Versteeg
Kind of like Matt Walker and a 4th? It was a salary dump.
But no, I wouldn’t trade a first round pick for Versteeg. It’s not about “draft a better player at 29”, it’s about getting up to three years of production out of an $850k cap hit.
As far as worry about next season’s cap next season, how does it impact Ville Leino this season? He now knows the Flyers won’t re-sign him until the summer, if at all. Is the desire to earn a contract outweighed by the stress and discomfort? Because you essentially just spent Leino’s money on Versteeg.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 6:23 PM EST up reply actions
FWIW
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Ville Leino ($3.000m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.580m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jeff Carter ($5.272m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Mike Richards ($5.750m) / Kris Versteeg ($3.083m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Darroll Powe ($0.925m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)
DEFENSEMEN
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m)
Matt Walker ($1.700m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
GOALTENDERS
Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m) /Johan Backlund ($0.800m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $61,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,264,432; BONUSES: $1,700,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $135,568
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
To give people a look at what it would take.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
Oh Matt Calvert was on top goals of the week on HNIC….
I like Kyle Busch because it pisses everyone off, and I love it...
by Len_DiJoseph on Feb 12, 2011 7:28 PM EST up reply actions
The goal against Turco?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 7:30 PM EST up reply actions
Yes it was, and it was a sweet goal…
I like Kyle Busch because it pisses everyone off, and I love it...
by Len_DiJoseph on Feb 12, 2011 7:32 PM EST up reply actions
Im perfectly fine with trading Carle in the offseason for more offensive depth. But I would put Gus with Prongs over Meszaros. And I’d be fine with a Walker and Mez/Coburn 3rd pairing. But again, my only complaint is with Backlund as our backup. I think they would rather sign Boosh for his spot.
Samesis
I don’t get the “trade Carle/Coburn for offense” kick at all. I just don’t.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 7:48 PM EST up reply actions
Because we have a good defense already, and Bobs will only get better. It offsets, but we can use that $3.5M to help keep 3 scoring lines.
Samesis
We don’t have three scoring lines to “keep”.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 8:03 PM EST up reply actions
But with two average goalies, why would you sacrifice defense? And why would you do it in order to have 7 forwards making $3 million or more?
After next season, if you do what you want to do, you’re then going to have to sacrifice offense for defense. Why keep flipping?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
Average goalies? Sir, I respectfully disagree about that. And I think our D is still great without Carle on it next year.
Samesis
You’re expecting Bobrovsky to continue being a 0.930 ESS% next year? Good for you. I’m betting he’s not. Why, you ask? Because Boucher is at 0.924. And since he’s a career 0.910, and a 0.917 for the past three years, I’m thinking the “our D is still great” has a lot to do with their numbers.
Knock Bobrovsky down to as good as Ilya Bryzgalov (0.922) and you have another 6 goals against. Knock Boucher down to his three-year average, and you have another 4 goals given up. Knock Boucher’s unsustainably high 0.904 PK S% down to Bob’s 0.860, and you have another 5 goals against.
Suddenly, your goalies have given up 15 more goals, and that’s still getting you to “above-average” goaltending. Make your defense worse – even if Walker is as good as O`D, Gustafsson is not as good as Carle – and you’ll be lucky if Bob is even a 0.922 ESS%.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 10:44 PM EST up reply actions
If Bobs is as good as Briggy next year, I’d fucking do backflips off the WFC. Your talking about a top 5 goalie dude haha.
Samesis
You’d be that excited, and that’s still 15 goals worse than this year. Which means you understand the goalies aren’t as good as they’re playing this year, so you want to make the defense worse on top of a 15 goal decline?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 8:55 AM EST up reply actions
How do you come up with 15 goals? This is one of the advanced stats that I hate being used, because a lot of times, goalies make unbelievable saves that would usually be goals. Or a lot falls onto goalies luck, like goals that sneak between a tiny gap somewhere. Your basing numbers on things that are 100% unpredictable. You might as well divide by 0 at this point.
Goals/60, corsi, yeah those are good stats. But I’m not gonna worry about those numbers because its too much based off luck.
Samesis
What? If Bobrovsky has a 0.922 even-strength save percentage (same as Bryzgalov) instead of his 0.930 (7th best in the league), based on how many shots he’s faced this year, that’s 6 more goals that have gone in. And that isn’t even a full season.
If you knock Boucher from his 0.924 down to a league-average (and Boucher’s three-year average) 0.917, he gives up 4 additional goals based on how many shots he’s faced. And again, that’s not even a full season.
Finally, take Boucher from a 0.904 PK S% (8th best in the league) down to Bob’s 0.860, and he gives up 5 more goals. Again, not even a full season.
Just saying the goalies stop a percentage of shots that is a lot more likely based on their true-talent levels shows the Flyers give up 15 additional goals. And that’s only through 54 games (23 goals over the course of a season), and that still puts you as an above-average goaltending tandem. What if Boucher (or Backlund, or whoever is the backup) reverts to his career numbers of 0.910 next year? What if Bobrovsky isn’t as good as Bryzgalov next year? Suddenly, your team gives up 30 goals more than they give up this year. That’s 5 wins.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
Again, how is 25 more goals against 5 less wins? What if we score a lot of goals the games we give up a lot more? I understand the natural assumptions to these things, but at the same time, your trying to put your guess into a real fact that is impossible to calculate.
For example, I COULD say that Gus will be the best defensive rookie ever, and will win the Calder, Norris, and Hart trophy next year, and will have a +200 and have 56 goals and 133 assist. Now Thats not 100% fact of what he will do next year, but its basically the same what your saying what Bobs will do next year.
Samesis
Wow, that’s not even close to what I’m saying.
If the Flyers goalies stop a percentage of shots that is a lot closer to their natural ability, they will stop 23 fewer goals. This isn’t even touching the ridiculous goal-scoring rate the Flyers are on this year (unlikely to be sustained next year).
But if the Flyers get Ilya Bryzgalov goaltending next year, and have a a goalie as good as Brian Boucher has been for the last three years, they will give up 15 more goals than they have given up so far this year. Over the course of a season, that’s 23 more goals against.
If you still don’t get it, I did a short version of this: http://www.behindthenethockey.com/2011/1/29/1962422/bruins-ready-for-a-fall
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t understand the trading of anything right now. Is the best record in the NHL not enough for people at this point in the season?
This is the offseason.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2011 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
That’s with the cap already going up $2 million
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 14, 2011 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
And that 3 years of a 850K cap hit will happen if drafted in 2011 probably in 2014 at which point the teams Cap situation will be totally different than it is today. No Danny or Kimmo or Hartnell eating up the gap. This year 1st round pick isn’t going to help until so much further down the road much even if you land a total steal at 29 it is still at least 2 years in juniors and another in AHL.
Does it matter when it is? No. You’re getting value in ELCs that you don’t get in $3 million players.
You can argue over just how valuable a 25-30th overall pick is, but since we love touting how good the Flyers are at drafting there, I think that has quite a bit of value. Claude Giroux, Mike Richards, Steve Downie…
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 14, 2011 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
Didn’t really read the column or the comments yet. Is the versteeg talk true? Awesome pick up.
Just Call Me "M"!
No
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Anyone out there watching NHL network? They are live from Whitehorse for hockey day in Canada. They did an aerial view and like swimming pools in backyards you see from an airplane there are homemade ice rinks scattered behind houses. Awesome
Just Call Me "M"!
Yeah it was awesome…
I like Kyle Busch because it pisses everyone off, and I love it...
by Len_DiJoseph on Feb 12, 2011 7:16 PM EST up reply actions
Announcers are saying Lupul was careless with the stick? Where. Clean hit, didn’t see any stick involvement at all.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
by JerseyDriver on Feb 12, 2011 7:52 PM EST up reply actions
I can barely make out what they’re saying. It sounds like somebody calling a horse race. Like every single millisecond has to be filled with voice.
Also used the phrase “word on the street”. Can’t imagine how white that guy is.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
by JerseyDriver on Feb 12, 2011 7:54 PM EST up reply actions
In other news.
Penguins bus gets into a minor accident
When it rains, it pours.
If these walls could speak, I wouldn't tell them anything.
Can i get a “open in new window” next time please?
G, the second coming of Foppa.
by JerseyDriver on Feb 12, 2011 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
Or since I’m on a Mac, I could just two finger click and get the same result, but why is it so hard to just click the box when you are adding a link? I always do.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
by JerseyDriver on Feb 13, 2011 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Because I am old fashioned and use HTML tags.
If these walls could speak, I wouldn't tell them anything.
So =new isn’t acceptable?
G, the second coming of Foppa.
by JerseyDriver on Feb 14, 2011 12:26 AM EST up reply actions
The driver will be receiving a call from Colin Campbell in the morning and may face disciplinary action by the league….
I like Kyle Busch because it pisses everyone off, and I love it...
by Len_DiJoseph on Feb 12, 2011 8:04 PM EST up reply actions
Nice
Travis, this was so well-written I registered just to say that. Nice job.
by Brownie21 on Feb 12, 2011 8:09 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Welcome. Glad to have ya.
Formerly known as "flyrsfrk05"
@Mitchman88 on Twitter
by Mitchell Green on Feb 13, 2011 4:08 AM EST up reply actions
I look at sites like Bleacher Report
and it makes me want to stop trying. Because if these two-bit beacons of idiocy can last, how can legitimate people with a point of view and a sense of accuracy and vigor to match get anywhere?
Sports fan, but not consumed by it. Write about sports at The Whole Take(thewholetake.tumblr.com). Get at me.
the rumor mill
Thanks for the hard work quashing this annoying trade rumor. Now can you see what you can stamp out on Huffington Post and the other blogs that start rumors to destroy honorable public officials for political gain.
Looks like your work has only just begin Travis.
"In fact, it is probably safe to say, the statement "I am a hockey fan" is the same as "I hate gary bettman."- bfrank27
by Mike B on D on Feb 12, 2011 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
Mark J. Martin
I am no fan of the plagiarizing Bleacher Report.
However, in this case, I actually think the culprit is Mark J. Martin of Yahoo, who is truly terrible. So many rumors in that slot are completely messed up, or essentially unvetted links. In multiple sports (not just hockey). Worse, he had a habit for months of not informing the webmaster when rumors from one sport are inadvertently slipped into another (usually leading to entertaining posts from fans speculating how Jonathan Quick would look making 3-point shots for Sacramento, or how Michael Young should be kept on the Rangers – fourth line? Powerplay Etc. )
Set your JVR in 2011.
OMG
Are you telling me that Gretzky is going to un retire and play for the Flyers at the age of 50!!!!
I’ll take your Foppa and raise you a Great One
G, the second coming of Foppa.
by JerseyDriver on Feb 13, 2011 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
I had a really really bad dream that Carcillo got hurt
Laperriere is my hero
Carcillo's my lover
Bobrovsky's my savior
Hockeys my life
Hey Travis
Next time I’d appreciate it if you didn’t try making me look like an idiot on your fancy site.
First off the article was BOLD predictions. I know you can read. BOLD predictions.
Secondly, I never claimed to be an insider, either. So don’t try to make me look like I am.
Third, thanks for all the hits dude. You’re making me famous. I was wondering why I have almost 10,000 reads on this article!
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 11:34 AM EST reply actions
Glad to know you completely missed the point.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
NHL Trade Rumors: Philadelphia Flyers Interested in Acquiring Kris Versteeg?
That’s the headline of your article. If you don’t understand what that implies …
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Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. 2010 Eastern Conference Champions.
by Travis Hughes on Feb 13, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, did you happen to see the question mark at the end of the headline?
Here it is:
?
It’s a question.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:09 PM EST up reply actions
NHL Trade Rumors: Philadelphia Flyers Interested in Acquiring MIlan Michalek?
Philadelphia has also apparently been shopping around for a winger, most likely for Mike Richards to play with. With that said, theToronto Maple LeafsOttawa Senators have let it be known that they are “not done dealing yet”-even with the trades they have made so far-which only leads people to believe thatTorontoOttawa is open for business.
If that is the case, the Flyers would be wise to take a hard look atKris VersteegMilan Michalek. He would be a perfect fit in Philadelphia and could compliment somebody like Richards very well.VersteegMichalek wouldn’t exactly break the bank for Philadelphia either, so he is most certainly a very real option.
[…]
With only 18 days left until the trade deadline, it won’t be long before we see what the Flyers have up their sleeve. They’re definitely up to something, that I can say with certainty.
Bam. I just did what you did. And it’s irresponsible.
But there’s a question mark! So, clearly, I’m just making a BOLD prediction. And I could rightfully be called out for making something up.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
First of all, that wasn’t even the same article as my “Bold Predictons” article.
Secondly, no you didn’t do anything I just did because already there are flaws in what you wrote, such as “they are not done dealing yet”. Only Burke said that.
Third, it wasn’t made up. There has been talk. All I did was write an article about it. I never said it would happen. What is irresponsible about writing an article on a possible trade?
You continue to make no sense.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
First of all, that wasn’t even the same article as my "Bold Predictons" article.
You mean your 50-slide slideshow? The one that wasn’t even mentioned here? Right. So not what we’re talking about? Cool.
Secondly, no you didn’t do anything I just did because already there are flaws in what you wrote, such as "they are not done dealing yet". Only Burke said that.
Sorry, Bryan Murray said: “there will be more deals.” But if you want to nit-pick, cool. Bryan Murray said he’s not done dealing yet. Next time, I’m mock you with more precision.
Third, it wasn’t made up. There has been talk.
No “talk” linked Versteeg to the Flyers until you made it up.
You continue to make no sense.
You continue to throw a hissy fit on a public forum about someone criticizing your irresponsible article. Maybe, I don’t know, you should take your complaints to the author in private.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
I have and have yet to get an e-mail back from him. And I’m pretty sure I wasn’t making things up when Timmy P just wrote practically the same article not even 24 hours after me.
I will not sit here and people get the wrong idea of me because of what 1 or 2 people have to say about it.
I’m not going to let people bash my name when there is no reason for it. All I did was write an article about a possible trade. There was nothing wrong with it. People do it every day.
It was never a claim of something actually happening. It was just a suggestion.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
And speaking of nit picking, that is exactly what was just done to me.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
I’d be willing to bet money that “Timmy P” wrote his article after (and because of) reading yours. You’re more than welcome to speculate, but you’re presenting it as something you’ve actually heard talk about, not something that you dreamed up inside your own head. That is what’s irresponsible.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
All I did was write an article on how it could be possible for the Flyers to acquire him. I never said any of it would happen and I never claimed to have knowledge of the situation. I didn’t know it was a crime to write about possible scenarios.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:21 PM EST up reply actions
Then perhaps you need a dictionary so that you can learn the difference between “rumor” and “speculation”. The question mark at the end of your headline doesn’t offset the improper wording.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 13, 2011 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
I still don’t see anywhere in any of my articles that I “made something up”. I never have and never would.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
By the by..
I guess Tim Panaccio has no idea what he;s talking about either right? Because he just wrote the same article I did..
Come on man.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 11:35 AM EST reply actions
So, have the Flyers asked about him?
"Who hasn’t?" Burke told us on Friday.
If you quoted the GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs in your story, this would be completely different.
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Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. 2010 Eastern Conference Champions.
by Travis Hughes on Feb 13, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
No need to try and make me look like something I’m not on here man. Never claimed to have insider knowledge. No need for bashing for your own amusement. I never said I knew something nobody else knew. I’d appreciate it if you would re-word some things in your article. I am being unfairly criticized.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
I’ll wait to hear from you via e-mail.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
I’ve been a little busy today, what with the game and everything, but yes, you’ve got mail.
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Broad Street Hockey - SBN's Philadelphia Flyers blog. 2010 Eastern Conference Champions.
by Travis Hughes on Feb 13, 2011 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
You used a few words that are just wrong. All I did was write an article about how the Flyers may be interested in his services. I would like you to fix a few things. I am trying to be a better writer, you are picking out certain things in order to make me look bad. The article I wrote on predictions was BOLD predictions.. they’re supposed to be crazy. Please fix this.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:02 PM EST reply actions
And Tim’s article came out after mine did if I’m not mistaken so how could I have quoted that?
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:08 PM EST reply actions
All I’m asking is that you re-word some of the things you wrote about me. I would never bash other writers on my articles, I would expect the same.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 13, 2011 12:12 PM EST reply actions
I was browsing the HF boards, looking for some comedy, and came across a thread suggesting JVR and Versteeg as the structure for a deal. While that trade is particularly unbalanced, it caused me to wonder about JVR. Has he stagnated? How is he playing? What does he project to be at this point?
by scrambles the death dealer on Feb 13, 2011 5:01 PM EST reply actions
JVR rumors have being around for awhile. He was shopped in November, then he started playing. Now, people are making him Kaberle – constantly in rumors despite not going to be traded.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 6:05 PM EST up reply actions
I’ve seen the rumors, but I don’t care for them. I was more curious about his actual play, considering his stats just tell me that he is struggling – but I never see him play.
by scrambles the death dealer on Feb 13, 2011 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
I believe that JVR should continue to be shopped, people said ‘well wait for him to mature physically’.. he has. He has proven that he can skate the NHL game, he shows speed down the wing now and again. He just doesn’t think the game well enough to be a top 6 guy (like he was projected to be). He’s comparable to Zherdev in terms of hockey sense, they’re dumb. Amazing skill sets.. dumb hockey players.
In saying that however, Versteeg’s cap hit is ridiculous when you compare it to the entry level that JVR is on. No need to clog up another $2 million. Definitely keep JVR until his contract is up, he’ll be an RFA, and if he continues to play below his potential he’ll sign a chump change renewal. I’d give him a couple more years to see what he can really do, he’s only 21 (22 in May) after all. Of course his value might be depleted by then..
by keenan.sutherland on Feb 13, 2011 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
I think you’re being overly harsh on JVR. The difference between him this year and him last year is huge. He’s still only 21 years old. He’s still growing into his body. He’s still improving. Why anybody would think he’s unable to learn the game or get any better is beyond me.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2011 8:08 PM EST up reply actions
Looks like B/R got this one right
Cory Geiger asks Paterno if talk about his future bothers him. "You bother me," Joe tells Geiger.
I hope that’s sarcasm.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 14, 2011 8:55 PM EST up reply actions
Kinda
After reading Mike’s article, there’s nothing wrong with it.
Travis took a harmless article, that sounds like something many people would have written as a blog post, and used it to attack the guy and the website. It reeks of the same arrogance and rhetoric that traditional media members have used to discredit bloggers. Yahoo! didn’t even directly cite Mike’s post, Travis made the leap in logic after that’s what came up in a Google search. It’s entirely possible that the guy writing the article for Yahoo! had another source, or like Mike, thought that the Flyers could use a winger like Versteeg.
B/R isn’t the most credible site for sure, but I think this post was overboard in attacking someone for writing a blog post, and now that the trade happened, this whole thing just looks really silly.
Cory Geiger asks Paterno if talk about his future bothers him. "You bother me," Joe tells Geiger.
It’s one thing to “speculate” that the Flyers could be interested in a player. It’s quite another to say “Rumors: Flyers interested in Versteeg” when it’s not a rumor.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 16, 2011 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
I kinda view that as semantics
But that wasn’t very obvious in the article written by Travis that that is what the issue was…
whatever it’s not a big deal.
Cory Geiger asks Paterno if talk about his future bothers him. "You bother me," Joe tells Geiger.
Versteeg a Flyer
How much time did you spend writing this? You obviously have no idea what’s going on in hockey.
Haha
So I guess I was irresponsible in writing about something that actually happened. I’ll be on the podcast tomorrow fellas.
by Mike Pantaleone on Feb 14, 2011 10:56 PM EST reply actions
I knew you’d be back. Way to be classy. You obviously still don’t get the point.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
Don’t worry, we got it handled.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 15, 2011 9:06 AM EST up reply actions
Speculating a trade that makes sense (and yeah, Versteeg to the Flyers made sense), disguising it as a rumor with a poorly worded headline, and then that speculation comes true, does not make you right. It still means you are an idiot and your headline writing is irresponsible. And it still means that your shit gets clogged up in Google and people think there is this rumor going around when there is nothing being reported.
Speculating carelessly about something and disguising it as a rumor, then being right about it 3 days later, does not validate careless speculation.
And a question mark does nothing to differentiate an actual rumor report with inside information versus careless speculation to fill a column. Saying “NHL Trade Rumors: Philadelphia Flyers Interested in Acquiring Kris Versteeg?” is not different than “NHL Trade Rumors: Philadelphia Flyers Interested in Acquiring Kris Versteeg”. The question mark can read as “there have been some talks about the Flyers acquiring Kris Versteeg, but it is unknown if they are going to acquire them. And Mike as already stated on here that ”http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2011/2/12/1990310/a-few-words-about-that-kris-versteeg-to-the-flyers-rumor#59107330" target="new">he had no insider information. Yes people speculate everyday, but they write more mature headlines than “NHL Trade Rumors.” If you want to write a speculative article fine, but write something like “SPECULATION: Would The Flyers Get Kris Versteeg” or “Should the Flyers be interested in Kris Versteeg?” Something like that.
I mean it is Bleacher Report, so the only hits it gets are from the idiots who click on the Google News headline not realizing it is B/R because no intelligent sports fan takes B/R seriously. But this is a start.
Is Paul Holmgren really bad at managing the salary cap? Does Matt Stairs enjoy getting his ass hammered by guys?
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