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Data Dump: NHL Goalies' Special Teams Save Percentage Since 1998

So a long time ago, while debating Brian Boucher and his talent level, HuckNZ did an amazing favor and went to NHL.com and collected every single goalie who played in the NHL since 1998's numbers. This included a breakdown of save percentages at even-strength, on the power play, on the penalty kill, and total percentage.

If you've been reading any of the goalie conversations that go on here - or, really, many other corners of the interwebs - you'll know that the method for evaluating goalies is less than perfect. The three common (and really, only) categories by which goalies are judged are 1) Wins; 2) Goals Against Average; and 3) Save Percentage.

A good analogy is to pitchers in baseball. Wins are an absolutely terrible metric by which to judge pitchers and goalies for a multitude of reasons, not least of which is: You can pitch a shutout and still not get a win. The goalie/pitcher can be perfect, and still not record a W. Or, he could give up 6 runs/goals, but get a W anyway because his team happened to bail him out. Wins are terrible. So, kudos to Sweden for no longer counting goalie wins.

Second, and sticking with baseball, goals against average is similar to ERA, and thus similarly, though even more terrible. A simple perusal through the NHL stats page for goalies will show an obvious correlation between bad teams and high GAA for their goalies. Sure, maybe the goalies aren't very good and thus the teams aren't, but there's no denying that the number of goals scored by the opposition is not indicative of the goalies' performance, but rather of the 6 guys on the ice charged with preventing goals.

Lastly, save percentage is a much better - if still flawed - metric. Different arenas are known to record a disproportionate amount of shots, save percentage also fluctuates - although moderately - due to the team in front of the goalie as well, and most importantly, special teams play has a large influence on save percentage despite fluctuating due to the team's skill and luck.

So with that, the method currently preferred (although still flawed, it's simply the least flawed) for evaluating goalies is even-strength save percentage. Jump for some numbers.

Star-divide

First, here is the spreadsheet with all of the data for those interested.

But to make it simple, here's a table of all the Flyers goalies since 1998:

Name GP ES SV% SH SV% PP SV% Total SV%
Martin Biron 459 0.920 0.872 0.911 0.911
Jeff Hackett 274 0.918 0.872 0.900 0.910
Brian Boucher 280 0.910 0.862 0.892 0.900
Antero Niittymaki 210 0.912 0.871 0.925 0.903
John Vanbiesbrouck 225 0.915 0.853 0.901 0.902
Roman Cechmanek 212 0.931 0.865 0.919 0.919
Robert Esche 186 0.915 0.841 0.938 0.899
Ray Emery 163 0.922 0.859 0.879 0.908
Michael Leighton 103 0.908 0.877 0.907 0.902
Ron Hextall 69 0.911 0.886 0.871 0.904
Maxime Ouellet 12 0.923 0.842 0.867 0.903
Jean-Marc Pelletier 7 0.858 0.838 1.000 0.857
Neil Little 2 0.893 0.667 --
0.838
Johan Backlund 1 0.900 1.000 1.000 0.917
Jeremy Duchesne 1 0.667 1.000 --
0.75
Martin Houle 1 0.667 --
--
0.667

The table is sorted by Even-Strength Saves so the larger samples are atop. Hence why Martin Houle and his 2 career saves at even-strength are last.

The headings should be fairly self explanatory, with Games Played, Even-Strength Save Percentage, and Total Save Percentage. "SH SV%" is the percentage of shots stopped while the Flyers are shorthanded. (That may be different in the Excel file, FYI).

A few things should jump out at you: One is that goalies stop fewer pucks when down a man. Obvious. Second, save percentage while on the power play varies greatly, largely due to sample size. Third, Brian Boucher is not nearly as good as I expected.

Since 1998, NHL goalies average a 0.917 ES SV%, an 0.868 SH SV%, a 0.914 PP SV%, and a 0.907 Total SV%. The bolded numbers are those above league average.

So what does this tell us? Many, many things. So many things that I don't even know where to begin. So let's just go to the bullets:

  • As said earlier, Brian Boucher is worse than I thought. But if you think about it, it's not all that surprising. If 0.917 is league average for every goalie, that includes more starters than scrubs (due to the sample size), thus driving the percentage up. In other words, the bad goalies get eliminated quickly (Jean-Marc Pelletier?) and the ones who face more shots are going to be the ones who stop more shots.
  • Still, Boucher ranks 99th out of 131 goalies who have faced at least 1,000 shots at even-strength. (FWIW, I included Tuukka Rask and his 979 ESSA, so it wasn't a hard-line.) The only goalies to face more shots than Boucher with a worse ES SV% were Marc Denis and Dan Cloutier. Not exactly good company.
  • How is Boucher still in the NHL you ask? Since bouncing around between Phoenix, Calgary, Chicago, and Columbus in a two year period, going to the Phantoms, and getting back in the NHL, Boucher has been almost exactly league average: 0.917 ES SV%, 0.872 SH SV%, 0.886 PP SV%, 0.908 Total SV%. That's a slightly better total save percentage, exactly average at even-strength, slightly better at short-handed, and much worse on the PP. He's still in the League because he has been average since returning. But enough about Boucher.
  • Roman Cechmanek was really, really good. But since he also sucked so much, there isn't much to say. Such skill in such an ass.
  • Martin Biron was (and is) severely underrated. As someone who wanted him gone after his contract was up, I now see the error of my ways. Although I did know Glen Sather got a steal with a two-year, $875,000 cap hit.
  • While I may have been wrong about wanting Biron gone, at least he was replaced with Ray Emery, who was quite good himself. Maybe the Flyers should take a chance and offer him an AHL contract if they can find a way to get out of the horrible Michael Leighton contract.
  • Speaking of Leighton, there really isn't much difference between him and Boucher. Something we've been saying here for a really, really long time. And before you say he's turned a corner, just like Boucher, for the last three years (just like Boucher), Leighton had a 0.908 ES SV% and a 0.904 Total SV%. He is who he is, which is slightly worse than Brian Boucher.
  • Antero Niittymaki came out a lot worse than expected here. He's essentially the same goalie as Boucher, which is entirely surprising. The thing about Niitty, though, is that he had a rough start to his career, starting after the lockout. Since the year that shall not be named (which is also over the last 3 years), Niitty is at a 0.921 ES SV%. Maybe it was a learning period, maybe it was the team in front of him, maybe it was something else, but it seems as though Niitty is an above-average goalie in the NHL, even if the numbers above suggest a career equal to Boucher. And even if he's at 0.916 ES SV% this year.
  • Lastly, Jeff Hackett is someone I never liked. In fact, in the conversation spurring this data set on (again, thanks HuckNZ) I trashed him. Boy was I wrong. Apologies, Mr. Vertigo. You had a good run.

That's about it. Feel free to chime in with any observations, especially from the Excel file. There's a ton of information in there that I'm simply overwhelmed.

Also, thanks to Earl Sleek of Battle of California for helping with the spreadsheet as well. He's my go to Excel guy, even if I can't understand what he's saying.

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Hockey Reference disagrees pretty strongly with your games played numbers there.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 12:31 PM EST reply actions  

They’re not “GP for the Flyers”. They’re “Games Played since 1998”.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 12:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Ah ha, got it.

Either way, I’ll never understand why Cechmanek basically got blackballed from the NHL. He was never terrible.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 1:05 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t know what happened in L.A., but he got run out of town due to his on-ice antics in Ottawa and locker room issues.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

There are two recent Flyers books that offer an explanation. One of them is ‘Orange Black and Blue by Gormley’, and ‘100 Things Flyers Fans Should Know & Do Before They Die.’
Oddly enough JR alluded to Roman today on NHL Live saying “a big goalie that played small,” when Don Maloney asked him if he’s ever played with anyone that has quit during a game.

I can look to my book shelf for the quotes if you like.

by BobRossky on Feb 2, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m assuming the “big goalie that played small” comment had nothing to do with physical size?

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 2:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah.. JR wouldn’t name anyone, but it was pretty obvious that he was talking about Roman.

by BobRossky on Feb 2, 2011 2:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, I was just getting at whether he was insulting his personality or his playing style.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Considering I’m probably not going to buy a couple books to look for quotes pertaining to Roman Cechmanek…yeah. :) Please, if you would.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions  

I can’t say Roman was blackballed, but he was really weird. Like made out of cotton weird. Between the cranium caroms, sleeping on the hotel floor, and picking his glove off the ice as the puck blows past you probably has something to do with it.. Not many NHL teams will put up with an eccentric unless that player has a ton of talent or skill.
The general consensus (by amalgamating everything I’ve read over the years) is that he didn’t care about winning nor was he ever really part of the team, and many think he didn’t care about winning the Stanely Cup.

Roman had a conniption during game 4 in 2002 and asked Barber to pull him, Billy wouldn’t have it. Next day in practice it was speculated that players were head hunting.
E.J. McGwuire: “I did notice there was an inordinate amount of pucks that went off the glass that day.”

Adam Kimelman: “Primeau believes Cechmanek was one of the last players who could be lumped into the old stereotype of European player that didn’t place the same amount of value on the Stanley Cup as North Americans did.”

Bob Clarke: “He came over late in his career, I think it was just to see if he could play in the NHL. I don’t think he ever had a goal of winning the Stanley Cup. He just wanted to see what the NHL was like. He’d play great during the season, but when the season ended, that’s when he ended. Playoffs didn’t seem to mean anything to him.”

by BobRossky on Feb 2, 2011 3:27 PM EST up reply actions  

This is all fantastic. But I think it’s true that he did have a ton of talent or skill.

If ever there was a player where “intangibles” matter, this is probably it.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 3:35 PM EST up reply actions  

I’d put him top 5 far as talent goes in the history of the franchise (where exactly I’m unsure), in addition to edging Giordano as mostly likely to be Mr. Beans stunt double.

by BobRossky on Feb 2, 2011 4:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Very interesting. And odd. I guess it’s hard to understand where he’s coming from being from North America where the NHL is really the only professional league that matters.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 3:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Roman just retired last year from the Czech league. Now he has more time at home to be a very weird person.

"All the experts come out, all the pundits come out with their opinions...the truth of the matter is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it" - George McPhee, General Manager, Washington Capitals.

by Nico97 on Feb 2, 2011 8:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m just curious, but why wasn’t Bob included in this? Is it just up to the end of last year?

"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."

Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson

by Psy09 on Feb 2, 2011 12:36 PM EST reply actions  

I was going to ask the same thing

by ThePowertool on Feb 2, 2011 12:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, through last year.

And it’s pretty easy to find Bob’s numbers on NHL.com

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 12:47 PM EST up reply actions  

He would be listed above Ouellet and below Hextall (read: really small sample), with a 0.929 ES SV%.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks. And I do understand the really small sample size, but I still think he should have been included considering the fact there are guys with one or two games played on the list. And the .929 ES SV% is pretty impressive, as in second best on the list.

"Chris Pronger sneaked in the back door...banged it home."

Flyers Television Play-by-Play Man: Jim Jackson

by Psy09 on Feb 2, 2011 1:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, I didn’t include the current season when I made the sheet because I knew I wouldn’t be updating it with any regularity.

I figured “through the end of last season” was a more sensible cutoff than “through whatever day in November I happened to put this together.”

by Eric T. on Feb 2, 2011 1:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh, thanks for pulling the data, I know Geoff thanked you, but you should be getting more praise for doing the digging,as that is often the hardest part.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:13 PM EST up reply actions  

No problem.

Grabbing the data was actually straightforward enough, just a bunch of clicks. Setting up the spreadsheet to sum the career totals took a little more time, but I like doing that kind of thing.

by Eric T. on Feb 2, 2011 2:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah using Excel has become fun for me, which is sad. Did you run a script to pull the data off of NHL.com? I’ve never actually pulled data from the site in to Excel.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:25 PM EST up reply actions  

Oooh, I love this conversation.

Please, give me tips.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 2:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Well you can copy and paste, then take that and copy and paste special values so you get rid of the hyperlinks. But I don’t think you can write anything to automate it because the stats go across several pages. Which is why I’m curious. Like I’d love to figure out how to just auto pull stuffoff of sites, I just have no clue how to go about it. In particular, I’d love to do it for Gabe’s site because that doesn’t copy and paste well.

Nothing I do involves me having to pull from sites for work. It’s all from data bases that interact with Excel. I can do a lot of stuff on Excel, pulling data from websites is not one of them.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:32 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m sure it could be automated, since the URLs are systematically named, but it took me much less effort to click a bunch of times than it would have to write a script.

by Eric T. on Feb 2, 2011 2:43 PM EST up reply actions  

I guess. I’ve done Macros, written VB, etc…I just never applied it to websites. If I can get some free time, I think I’d like to try it. From what I’ve looked up, it doesn’t seem horrible to do.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:45 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t know how Gabe does it, but I know Macros is one way (I forget if they ditched Macros for something more complex but better, or if it was the other way around).

And he pulls the data off the NHL’s official stat pages. Like these: http://www.nhl.com/scores/htmlreports/20102011/PL020758.HTM

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 3:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, those pages scare me, that adds another complexity to it, or I would imagine.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Once upon a time, I had a PERL script that pulled the data for every play from the NFL gamebook after each game.

But the computer I used to do that got hosed and it’s been years since I’ve done something like that, so I’m not in the mood to try to remember how.

by Eric T. on Feb 2, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, that’s kind of what happens. I’m disappointed in myself for not wanting to attempt these types of things any more.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 3:20 PM EST up reply actions  

In 2007 and 2010, go to the Data tab and click the From Web button over on the left side of the ribbon. You can then put in an URL and click Go. Excel will sense where there are tables of data and give you a little yellow arrow in the upper left hand corner of each table. Click the arrow pertaining to the table you want and it’ll ask you where on your current sheet you want the data to start in (usually A1 is the cell you want). It’ll then pull the data in for you.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 2:46 PM EST up reply actions  

It’s basically the same thing in 2003 I believe (I hate 2007 because of my work, though it’s conditional formatting is an amazing improvement, plus the increased data capability).

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Shit, I have 2008 :( So I don’t have a “From Web” button.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Ohhh. Yeah. No live data feeds in 2008. Your best option is to use OpenOffice Calc. You can link to external data with that.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 4:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I have a Mac. This could be a problem, couldn’t it?

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 4:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Huh, I thought they already had a port done for that. Shows what I know.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Does it work for sites like NHL.com, where the stats will be across several pages?

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeaaaaaaah, there’s the thing. If you want to do that, you can, but your best bet is to sort by player name alphabetically. You’ll have to pull each page individually, but it’ll then update automatically every time you want it to.

You can probably write a VBA script for that, too, but I haven’t done any Excel programming.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah haha, I think it’s possible, it’s just beyond my pay grade. Thanks for the responses though. I’m glad to know to just pull from one page is as easy as it read online, I may actually try it now.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 3:13 PM EST up reply actions  

This makes me happy.

Mourning Gagne forever.

by ToddtheFox on Feb 2, 2011 9:22 PM EST up reply actions  

First, what Huck said.

Second, while 0.929 ES SV% is pretty impressive, Boucher is at 0.920 this year and Leighton was at 0.929 in his game this year. Small sample is screaming at you.

Third, it’s one thing to post a 2 save sample for Martin Houle, whom nobody cares about. It’s another to disingenuously post numbers suggesting Bobrovsky is the best goalie to play for the Flyers in at least 13 years. Some (perhaps even most) people would know not to read too much into it. Most (perhaps only some) would run with it and go use that information to tell WIP that Bob is the next Bernie Parent.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Hmmm...

I remember having a pretty strong argument with my Pens fan friend who said the Flyers couldn’t win that year in the ECF because Biron was a shitty goalie. I pointed out that he had similar basic numbers to MAF and was playing really well that season. I felt the defense was more at fault and the style of play Stevens ran.

It’s nice to see some advanced metrics to back that up. He was a lot better than most people gave him credit for and I was angry when we let him go. Emery was a surprise, I admit.

Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.

by doubleh on Feb 2, 2011 12:53 PM EST reply actions  

I feel like the “Biron was a shitty goalie” sentiment was common.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions  

It was and it is as erroneous as the “Joe Blanton is a crappy pitcher” sentiment now.

Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.

by doubleh on Feb 2, 2011 1:00 PM EST up reply actions  

While true, I think the Biron sentiment was selective perception, while the Blanton sentiment is the result of being spoiled. And having ignorant/new/bandwagon fans.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the Biron sentiment was based on the old go-to adage from Flyers beat writers and WIP guys that for the Flyers “goaltending is always the #1 problem”.

Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.

by doubleh on Feb 2, 2011 1:07 PM EST up reply actions  

I feel so much better for being a Biron appologist now.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 1:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Me, too.

Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.

by doubleh on Feb 2, 2011 1:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Me 3 but I still think he was bat shit crazy for expecting 4 million per or whatever in his UFA contract negotiations.

by chrislanci on Feb 2, 2011 2:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Completely agree.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 2, 2011 2:14 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m going to type, and it could come off as asshole, but I honestly don’t know where this is leading. So I may in fact agree with you.

2009 NHL Goalie Free agents:

Tim Thomas – $5m (0.927)
Nik Khabibulin – $3.75m (0.919)
Dwayne Roloson – $2.5m (0.918)
Craig Anderson – $1.8m (0.923)
Martin Biron – $1.4m (0.920)
Ty Conklin – $1.3m (0.923)
Peter Budaj – $1.25m (0.915)
Mathieu Garon – $1.2m (0.917)
Scott Clemmenson – $1.2m (0.918)
Josh Harding – $1.1m (0.927)
Brent Johnson – $1m (0.916)
Jason LaBarbera – $1m (0.915)
Brian Boucher – $925k (0.910)

First, there’s no way Biron deserved $4 million in that market, nor on this team. But to say he was the second best starting goalie in the market – behind Thomas? I think you could easily make that argument.

Now, obviously, Craig Anderson proved a shrewd investment, but as a player/agent approaching that market, to say you deserve the second most money is probably an accurate assessment. Pegging that at $4 million, however, seems like a severe miscalculation.

Lastly: Peter Budaj is overpaid and Josh Harding is underpaid. But I’ve been a Harding fan for a long time.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Most well-paid goalies are overpaid relative to their contribution to their teams. But, that’s kind of the nature of the beast I think.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh, I definitely agree. The market is slowly correcting that though. It’s just a shame people think Leighton at $1.55 was fair value based on ~1200 shots, and less than 900 shots at even strength.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 2:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Considering you need several years’ worth of play to accurately gauge a goalie, yeah, 1200 shots isn’t even close to enough.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 2:47 PM EST up reply actions  

“Biron for $4M? Screw that, we can get Leighton for barely 1/3 that price.”

by Eric T. on Feb 2, 2011 3:20 PM EST up reply actions  

I was willing to keep him for 2.5 million but knowing our cap situation he was going to have to bit the bullet and be a little more reasonable.

by chrislanci on Feb 2, 2011 5:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Dude had the longest fingers of any human I’ve ever seen. I can’t believe they fit into a glove.

I'm kind of a dick.

by Vansteel on Feb 2, 2011 1:14 PM EST up reply actions  

From the blog 43Things
Jimi Hendrix’ hands probably WERE closer to 11 inches than 9. He could fret all six strings on the strat with his thumb while using the rest of his fingers as well. Comparing his fingers to the neck of a strat, I’d estimate his middle finger to be about 5.5 inches long. The average human palm is slightly longer than the middle finger. Looking at photos and video, Jimi’s palm looks proportionate. I’d have to say a 10" MINIMUM hand length

by j reed on Feb 4, 2011 2:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Biron disappointed me – Period ! Here is a guy who is a Career back up, HANDED the keys to the starting role and just piddled it away without a care.

FLYERROB ! YOU STAY AWESOME FLYERS FANS ! www.naawayland.com Robert Wilson

by FLYERROB on Feb 2, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Care to support that statement with evidence?

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 3, 2011 9:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Here is a career backup who started 69, 53, 49, 31, and 34 games in the five years before he was handed the opportunity to start 59 and 53 games with the Flyers. And he just piddled it away with just a .927 and .918 even strength save percentage in those two years, without a care.

by Eric T. on Feb 3, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions  

Exactly.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 3, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions  

Biron wasn’t a shitty goalie. Anyone who said otherwise didn’t really know what they were talking about.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 1:04 PM EST up reply actions  

He was a Pens homer (and still is). Unfortunately, we all have those kinds of fans. Fortunately, I don’t live next door to him anymore. We almost came to blows once over his homer idiocy.

Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.

by doubleh on Feb 2, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I mean, yeah, we all called him French Toast whenever he played against the Pens, but that was just the sort of “poke you with a stick” banter you get between fan bases. I would never have argued that he was actually no good, though.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 1:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Well, you’re not stupid. He is. But he’s the worst kind of stupid that acts like he knows every goddamned thing about hockey (because he plays the game!) and I know nothing because 1) I’m a girl, 2) I’m a Philly fan.

Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.

by doubleh on Feb 2, 2011 1:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, that’s just dumb.

/nothingreallytoadd

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

OT: Just saw your GVT/60 article. I commented. Hope it doesn’t come off as bitchy. haha

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Ah, I’ll look. That one almost fell off the front page, so I kind of stopped paying attention to the comments.

by JustinM on Feb 2, 2011 1:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks for writing this up, Geoff. You did a much better job pulling information out of the data than I would have — I was drowning in numbers when I tried to look through it.

by Eric T. on Feb 2, 2011 1:13 PM EST reply actions  

haha, thanks for the data. And to be honest, I was drowning in them too. Until I concentrated on the “Flyers Goalies” tab.

I feel like there is so much more in there, maybe somebody can pull the smart stuff out.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Looking at the data anyone think we would have won the cup last year if Emery’s hip didn’t die on him?

Also the only area where Leighton has an edge on Boosh is his special teams SV PCT.

by chrislanci on Feb 2, 2011 2:06 PM EST reply actions  

Did you make the excel file yourself, or did somebody else make it? Either way, I know you like to use excel to accumulate data and just a recommendation, you should start putting all your data into tables. It’ll let you sort all your material and get a better look at everything that is going on.

by SwimminDave on Feb 2, 2011 10:31 PM EST reply actions  

Huck created the excel file. I don’t know how. haha.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 2, 2011 10:56 PM EST up reply actions  

You can still do it now actually. Just select all the day, click on the ‘Insert’ tab, then on the top left is the table button. Click it and voila! Then everything is easily sortable by column.

by SwimminDave on Feb 2, 2011 11:01 PM EST reply actions  

I don’t have “Insert > Table” menu option.

Excel for Mac 2008.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 3, 2011 9:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Real quick – I didnt have the time to read every post – but did anyone mention how Boucher has the longest in Minutes Shutout streak in the history of NHL ? Remember when he was with Phoenix ? He went i think 4 games + without giving up a goal or something like that.

FLYERROB ! YOU STAY AWESOME FLYERS FANS ! www.naawayland.com Robert Wilson

by FLYERROB on Feb 2, 2011 11:01 PM EST reply actions  

Nobody mentioned that here, but this is true. It doesn’t change his NHL career numbers, but it is a nice little accomplishment.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 3, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions  

We only care about small sample sizes, and stretches of a few games here and there to judge true talent.

Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Is this the right room for an argument?

by DLJr on Feb 3, 2011 10:50 AM EST up reply actions  

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