Thursday Morning Fly By: Those Surgeries Happened Fast

Travis, I know you have to stay neutral when you’re writing on SBNation.com and you’ve gotta love hockey over a particular team, and I try to do that too. But saying Jagr being as good as ever and returning to Pittsburgh would be an “awesome dream” is pushing it. I don’t want to see that guy anywhere near Crosby’s wing. Now if he wanted to return to dazzling the NHL with any other team I would be OK with it.

I’m sorry, but the Flyers are back to being serious Stanley Cup contenders every season, and if the Pens manage to win another cup before we get our hands on Lord Stanley, I don’t know how I could take it.

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 6:39 AM EDT reply actions

I think his return to the NHL would be awesome, no matter what team he plays for. Honestly.

But yeah, I don’t wanna see him with Crosby either. Scary.

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by Travis Hughes on May 12, 2011 8:07 AM EDT up reply actions

No owrries all we need to do is build a time machine and bring back Bundy crica late 90’s to counter Jagr…. Problem sloved… Yeah Crosby with Jagr would be scary, but I am with Travis it would be nice to see him back in the NHL just not with the Pens

I cannot wear my Pelle Eklund jersey anymore because of hockeybuzz and its creator Eklund.....

Hey Norm, if you were a hot dog would you eat your self??

Semper Fi...

by lcd24 on May 12, 2011 8:24 AM EDT up reply actions

Should have been “No worries” coffee has not kicked in yet…

I cannot wear my Pelle Eklund jersey anymore because of hockeybuzz and its creator Eklund.....

Hey Norm, if you were a hot dog would you eat your self??

Semper Fi...

by lcd24 on May 12, 2011 8:55 AM EDT up reply actions

I’d just like to point out that the problem wouldn’t be ‘sloved’ … if anything it would be “Czeched”.

/hintzied

Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.

by MaximumTalbot on May 12, 2011 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions

Well played sir… Well played indeed…

I cannot wear my Pelle Eklund jersey anymore because of hockeybuzz and its creator Eklund.....

Hey Norm, if you were a hot dog would you eat your self??

Semper Fi...

by lcd24 on May 12, 2011 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions

How about this one? Giroux-Briere-Jagr might be interesting even if it is only a pipe dream

by musicheretic on May 12, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions

Consider how well he does all the wingers he’s been stuck with, putting him with Jagr would be… bad.

On the Mike Weber bandwagon!
Sabres took the scenic route, but they still MADE IT TO THE PLAYOFFS!!!1

by Ubiquitous on May 12, 2011 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions

Also, I can’t help but like Detroit, because I think they do everything right. But can they please not do the comeback.

On the other hand, I think if Detroit do pull it off then the Sharks can no longer ever deny the playoff chokers tag.

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 7:08 AM EDT reply actions

Please, please, please. I swear at this rate there’s going to be an attempted 3-0 comeback each round.

"We didn't do it the easy way. We took the hard way to do it. But we are part of history now."

by ww2b on May 12, 2011 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions

Also, do we know whether Pronger’s disc herniation is impinging a nerve root and what level it’s on? Because that can affect the outcome.

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 7:11 AM EDT reply actions

I’ve actually been looking for some details but haven’t come across anything yet… maybe there will be more information today.
My wife (physical therapist) tells me that after a discectomy a fusion of the lumbar vertebrae is pretty typical, which scares the crap out of me. She says he should be able to get a few more years of normal function out of his back, but then the chances of additional problems start increasing. Hopefully its just a partial discectomy.

There’s also a procedure (Ithink she called it a “laminectomy”) whereby after removing the disc they remove a bit of the bone surrounding the area to give it some space. That thought scares me even more.

I’m going to hold out hope that he’s an atypically good case and he’ll be able to perform at his usual elite level until he dicides to retire.

by A Flyers Phamily on May 12, 2011 7:35 AM EDT up reply actions

Don't be too scared of a laminectomy

The lamina is the part of the vertebra that connects the transverse process (bits that stick out to the side) to the spinous process (bit that sticks out at the back). Cutting the lamina will remove some level of protection to the spinal cord (after all, there’s a reason it’s there) but it may simply be necessary to prevent the disc from pinching the nerve root. Like anything, there are complications and risks associated with it, but Pronger’s not going to go to anyone but the best, and if any complications were to ever occur they would be more likely to occur in old age.

Perhaps the best way to visualize it would be to look at a normal image

What you call a ‘slipped disc’ is actually part of the intervertebral disc called the nucleus pulposus bulging out. Now it can’t bulge out forwards because there’s a very strong ligament in that direction, and it can’t bulge out directly backwards because there’s the strong spinous process. So it bulges out backwards and to the side, and what’s there? A nerve and the lamina. So removing the lamina will ease the pressure on the nerve.

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 7:46 AM EDT up reply actions

Thanks for the visuals. My wife was going to bring some pictures she said were very similar to those, so you saved her and me a bit of legwork.

by A Flyers Phamily on May 12, 2011 7:58 AM EDT up reply actions

No worries. All good revision for me.

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 8:01 AM EDT up reply actions

I’m not a health science person, but do find this fascinating. Thanks for the visuals because if you had just explained that, I would be so confused. I hope that there are no complications and Pronger’s surgery goes successfully!

by JLS89 on May 12, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions

My doctor explained it to me as jelly seeping out between two pieces of bread. But I like this visual aid, it actually shows how the nerve is being pressed.

by ShannonB on May 12, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions

this is what I need. anyone wanna donate since welfare is a fraud and keeps refusing to get me medical coverage?

http://restorations.bandcamp.com/

by Val_d'Or on May 12, 2011 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions

My wife had one last summer … and she’s fine (or as fine as one can be 8 months preggo). She was on her back for a week afterwards, and couldn’t do much for two months, but then she was right as rain.

Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.

by MaximumTalbot on May 12, 2011 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions

Glad your wife is OK, and congrats on the pending addition.

I’m hopeful that modern technological advances in medicine will result in Pronger’s swift return, unlike that of Orland Kurtenbach, who returned to playing but only after a lengthy convalescence.

by mtitanic on May 12, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions

Thanks, and yes – as Eric seems determined to point out, we all need to send best luck wishes to Assistant Captain Elbows!

Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.

by MaximumTalbot on May 12, 2011 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions

That looks like a Metroid. Somebody call Samus Aran.

by Phalange on May 12, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions

Finally (coz I feel like I’m talking to myself), I admit that at the end of the season I was worried about home ice. Have these playoffs shown that home ice is overrated? Given that, if the Flyers get themselves up to a similar position midway through next season (i.e. with the Atlantic lead) would you be OK with them resting Pronger and Timonen and sacrificing that Atlantic lead to end up going into the playoffs as the 5th or 6th seed but with healthy personnel?

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 7:15 AM EDT reply actions

Yes.

by 92-74-99-96 on May 12, 2011 7:40 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions

It doesnt matter what seed you start in the playoffs, only how and when you finish.

by bfrank27 on May 12, 2011 7:48 AM EDT up reply actions

Yep but say the Flyers had rested Kimmo when we were battling the Pens for the Atlantic lead?

My question is more that if, in the heat of the next regular season, the Flyers basically said ‘we don’t care about home ice’ and rested key players to the point where they were dropping down the Eastern conference purely out of their own making, would we all accept that?

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 7:51 AM EDT up reply actions

The problem is the team wouldn’t say “we are resting them”. They’d say they were injured, since surely Pronger and Timonen wouldn’t sit out of a game in March for “rest”. Then the fans would say “no excuse” to be slipping.

Least that’s how I see it happening.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 8:02 AM EDT up reply actions

Chris Pronger is day-to-day with a sore toe? In fact I would love to see Tim Panaccio question him on that injury.

Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home, but at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.

by PursuitOfLappyness on May 12, 2011 8:05 AM EDT up reply actions

haha, just stick with the “lower-body injury”

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions

I loved Hextall. He was a lot of fun…

by 92-74-99-96 on May 12, 2011 7:40 AM EDT via mobile reply actions

That, and Chelios was an asshole who absolutely deserved it.

by 92-74-99-96 on May 12, 2011 7:41 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 6 recs

Agreed.

#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)

by Orange and Black Forever on May 12, 2011 7:44 AM EDT up reply actions

rec’d

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by Travis Hughes on May 12, 2011 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions

rec’s n effect. Of course, I like seeing any Hab on the receiving end of a beatdown

by TomServo42 on May 12, 2011 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions

That is one of the earliest memories of the Flyers that I can recall-my mom and uncles yelling and screaming at the TV after Propp got nailed. Let’s just say the rest of that series was interesting at my grandparent’s house whenever Chelios was on the ice and Hextall going after him at the end was like the Second Coming :)

by btowl1818 on May 12, 2011 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions

I wasn’t alive when that hit happened, but that hit was just flat out dirty. It’s amazing to see how much the game has changed within my lifetime… and props to Hextall for sticking up for his teammate.

by JLS89 on May 12, 2011 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions

Now I feel old. I was in 7th grade when that hit happened.

Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?

by mikefive on May 12, 2011 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions

but look at some of the awesome Flyers teams you’ve/we’ve seen :)

by btowl1818 on May 12, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions

I’m not even sure if I could skate back then,

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions

I mean, I could probably outskate Hartnell, but I meant skate.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions

Aww… I’m sorry mikefive. If it helps at all, I was born about a month after this hit

by JLS89 on May 12, 2011 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions

Its okay, I missed all of it, haha.

Following Dan Carcillo where ever he may go
Giving up isn't an option

by Cillo stache on May 12, 2011 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions

Now I feel old. I was in 7th grade when that hit happened.

I was 20 and a sophomore at Penn State. Do you feel better now? ;)

#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)

by Orange and Black Forever on May 13, 2011 9:21 AM EDT up reply actions

Hell yes. He’s the reason why I fell in love with hockey. I loved the sport with Pelle but fell in love with Hexy. I have his autograph tattoo’d on my leg. Best guy ever.

http://restorations.bandcamp.com/

by Val_d'Or on May 12, 2011 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions

But Ed Snider wants a goalie, so you know it’ll happen. Later today, we’ll show you why Ed Snider is wrong

I wait with bated breath…

"All the experts come out, all the pundits come out with their opinions...the truth of the matter is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it" - George McPhee, General Manager, Washington Capitals.

by Nico97 on May 12, 2011 7:44 AM EDT reply actions

It’s good. And like, 2,000 words. Geoff went all out.

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by Travis Hughes on May 12, 2011 8:07 AM EDT up reply actions

Oh crap. GEOFF wrote it? Here I was hoping for some decent debate … and now allI can expect is something I’ll have to at least partially agree with in principle.

Ruined all my fun.

Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.

by MaximumTalbot on May 12, 2011 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions

Aww, yay.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions

Good luck convincing Mr. Snider he’s wrong about anything.

My father worked with him years ago… back when “Spectrum 2” (currently d/b/a The Wells Fargo Center) was in the planning stages. According to my father, it was Mr. Snider’s way or the highway. He was pretty bull-headed about a lot of things. (This, of course, comes as a surprise to no one.)

So, while most of us will agree with what you have to say – and I’m certainly looking forward to reading it – I fully expect the opposite to happen. By hook or crook, the Flyers will get a goaltender. And they’re not going to take a chance on someone like Josh Harding or Ray Emery. They will trade for a Bäckström / Kiprusoff or they will sign a Брызгалов / Vokoun and they will likely go the “Phillies route” and sacrifice offense in order to do so.

I have no basis for saying this, other than it being my gut feeling. I could be wrong and hope I am. But if I’m right, we’ll probably get to see Holmstrom and Wellwood in Flyer orange next year.

Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?

by mikefive on May 12, 2011 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions

I hope you are wrong. I really do.

In a cap world, you just can’t pay a goalie that much money to be only marginally better than the $925k guy you have.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions

And let me say that I’m not opposed to getting a Schneider/Varlamov/Bernier. I don’t see the point in getting two stud young goalies (the cost is too much) when you have Eriksson a year away from coming over, but whatever.

I’d much rather get a Theodore or Harding or Nabokov on a one-year, $1.5 million deal

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions

Top End goalie

Geoff,
What would you pay Vokoun on a 2 year deal? I think if he’s willing to sign 2 years for 6M or three years for 7.5M we have to take it.

I know you hate this idea, but whether or not a team trusts its goalie will affect play. I know when my teams had a goalie we couldn’t trust as our #1 we were way less effective on offense. (aka “we couldn’t score goals for him” or “we didn’t play well in front of him”). I know teams often play better in front of their backup than in front of their starter because they know they have to, but when you don’t trust your starter it takes a mental toll. Yea, no stats there, just experience and…

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions

I don’t want it. Why would you sign a starting goalie for two years, burn Bob’s ELC, then have to commit to having a starting goalie cost $3 million for the next 4 years?

Was he not good enough this year? He was. And this whole “team not confident” crap is infuriating. Look at Game 3 against Boston. The team played like shit from the faceoff, leaving Boucher not confident in the team. And if the team isn’t confident playing in front of a guy who just stopped 38 of 41 shots in Game 2, and had nearly a 95% save percentage in round one, that isn’t on the goalie. That’s on the team.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions

Just because he had a good game or four in the playoffs isn’t going to lead the team to trust him if after two years with him they lost some trust. I agree with your point 100% from a stats point of view, but if the team isn’t confident in front of the goalie after this much time it doesn’t matter how well he plays in short stretches.

Now, if the coach/GM feel like the team is confident in them this is a moot point, but I can’t see how it’s not in their heads at this time. If nothing else, it’s a real shakeup. If we trade someone and bring in a goalie with an elite reputation then maybe that’s enough to give the team a jolt for next year.

And I would love Nabakov as long as his total compensation is no more than $1.5M per.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions

I don’t care about “if a team isn’t confident in front of a goalie” if that goalie plays well. Those goalies took them to the #2 seed in the conference. Those goalies outplayed Ryan Miller.

If the team isn’t confident in front of the goalie after this year, that’s not the goalies’ fault. All this “the team wasn’t confident” crap pisses me off. If that’s true, why do you change the goalie? Change the damn team because there’s a problem there.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions

If the skaters aren’t confident in the goalie it’s a much easier fix. Think of Cechmanek. It’s the same reason you change a coach and not a whole team.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions

But what tells you the skaters aren’t confident in the goalie? A four game series where they got thoroughly dominated.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions

ELC?

I don’t want Vokoun or any other goalie for 4 years. That’s why I said 2 years at $3M or 3 years for $7.5M. There’s no way I want Kipper at $5.833M. That’s just dumb.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions

Entry Level Contract. Meaning his current contract will present Bob at a very good value versus the cap. If you bring in a stud, you waste the value of Bob’s ELC…assuming you have no interest in having him start for the Phantoms next season.

Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!

by DLJr on May 12, 2011 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions

Oh. Duh. I was like “Early Learning Curve?” “Expedited Learning Curve”…

I’m dumb.

I would actually be fine with giving Bob a year in the AHL next year if we brought in a guy for a few years. If we signed Nabakov for 1 year and kept Bob up in the NHL that would also be a very good option. I wouldn’t mind giving bob 55-60 AHL stats to “stretch him out” so to speak in order to prepare him for a full NHL workload.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions

So you are fine with ruining Bob’s career. Cool.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions

I don’t think giving Bob a year in the AHL to get more starts is “ruining his career”.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions

Right, a guy everyone thinks is too mentally unstable to sit on the bench in Game 3 is suddenly mentally stable to handle going from Game 1 playoff starter to AHL starter and not bolt back to Russia and/or fall apart.

Either he is mentally weak or he isn’t.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions

But if he isn’t…that doesn’t mean putting him in the AHL for a year is a terrible idea. Just saying. And I don’t think Pardini ever claimed he was mentally weak.

Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!

by DLJr on May 12, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions

I think putting him in the AHL for a year is a terrible idea. If we’re talking about his mental state, and we’re talking about a team’s mental confidence, what does that say?

Opening night starter, playoff starter, to AHL starter in one year. And not because of injury. You’re essentially saying “Kid, you were good enough last year, but, well, you aren’t good enough any more.”

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions

As example, Brian Boucher went from Playoff starter to high-priced goalie to backup goalie in less than a year. And he didn’t recover until he came back in the AHL 8 years later.

And that wasn’t even “drop him to the AHL”. That was “you got outplayed, now you’re a backup”.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions

I not saying it’s a good or bad idea. I’m saying if the guy can handle it, then that isn’t a reason for it being a terrible idea.

And that’s not what youa re saying, you are saying, hey we signed a proven stud, and you are too important to our future to waste on the bench in a back up role, so we are going to give you a ton of starts in the AHL.

Again, I’m not saying it’s a good idea or not. I’m say there is another line of thinking than what you are throwing out there. I can see Pardini’s POV, I can see yours too. Both are valid opinions.

Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!

by DLJr on May 12, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions

Damn rationality.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions

Answer your email.

Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!

by DLJr on May 12, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions

I agree with both sides. This is why I’m not the GM of a Pro hockey club.

http://restorations.bandcamp.com/

by Val_d'Or on May 12, 2011 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions

Honestly though, how would you value someone like Vokoun? a bit of that was to antagonize you.

Let’s say we get an ESS% of .930 from Vokoun/Bob, and we can reasonably expect a .915 from Bob/Bouch. If we face 2K shots, that’s approximately 30 goals a season, which is an expensive forward.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions

FYI, this is exactly what my story is.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions

Oh, I haven’t refreshed the page…my page said “later we will have a story up.” Let me refresh and you know, read it.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions

No, it goes up at noon.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions

Geoff I am totally onboard with you. Giguere or Nabokov should be the guy at 2 million max, 2 year max contract length. In the second year you can always just bury the guy in the minors (Leighton him) if Bob clearly takes over and cap is an issue.

I also don’t think players look at stats to build confidence after the fact regardless of numbers the constant pulling of guys, the constant media questions and the inability for the goalie to get through the 1st 10 minutes without giving up 2 or more goals hurt this team.

We seen many games this year where the team got off to “slow” starts. This was nothing new. The difference is after the 1st 5 – 10 minutes in those games the Flyers weren’t down 2 or 3 goals.

Even Lavy didn’t have confidence in Boosh in round 1 being that he went to Leighton. Confidence was an issue. Should it have been I don’t think it so but not going to back to Bob in Game 3 and then going to Leighton in Game 5 caused it to be so. It has nothing to do with the stats. Confidence stems from the coach I blame this mostly on him 65% the rest on the goalie core because one of those guys had to be able to solidify the starting role.

by chrislanci on May 12, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions

I don’t want anything more than a one-year deal. Signing a guy to two years to be your starter kills the value you get out of Bob’s ELC.

Second, I’m right there with you on Lavy. When the coach over-reacts and pulls Bob, then when he over-reacts and starts his third goalie in six games, that lack of confidence trickles down. But that’s not an excuse for the team playing like shit against Boston. Or for over-reacting and trading for a washed up/overpriced goalie.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor

by Geoff Detweiler on May 12, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions

"So either one of the goalies we have has to step up in training camp, or we have to make improvements to make sure it happens. But we are NEVER going to go through the goalie issues we’ve gone through in the last couple of years again."

That to me makes it pretty clear that Snider wants a number 1 goalie but he isn’t ignoring the possibility that Bob is that guy. I also don’t think it’s wrong to want to go out and get a number 1 goalie but I do think it is wrong to think that that move alone will solve all the issues.

"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard

by EREX21 on May 12, 2011 8:02 AM EDT reply actions

That’s the way I read Snider’s comments too. I’m glad that he thinks that Bob may be the answer – I wasn’t sure he felt that way.

#1 Flyers fan in England (originally from Southeastern PA)

by Orange and Black Forever on May 12, 2011 8:07 AM EDT up reply actions

Also I hope Mr. Snider realizes by now that wanting a thing (llike a bright, shiny new number 1 goalie) doesn’t necessarily mean that its possible to have a thing.

by A Flyers Phamily on May 12, 2011 8:09 AM EDT up reply actions

well it is possible when you’re one of the richer men in the world……
class struggles ftw! but really it is possible for the rich cause they can afford it.

http://restorations.bandcamp.com/

by Val_d'Or on May 12, 2011 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions

OT

I would like to thank everyone on BSH for aiding in my continuing education of the game. This includes the very knowledgeable writers (Travis, Geoff et al.) and the informed fanbase who post also.
I’ve been following hockey faithfully since 2004, but I’ve learned more about the inner workings of the game in the last year (with BSH’s help) than in all the previous years.

/Gratitude’d

by A Flyers Phamily on May 12, 2011 8:16 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs

8:40 and I’m already behind in the thread. Yikes. So what’s new everyone?

Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.

by KreiderDesigns on May 12, 2011 8:41 AM EDT reply actions

Goalie talk/controversy. Surprise!

by A Flyers Phamily on May 12, 2011 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions

Just trolling anew member on here for some fun because, you know, I’m a jerk.

Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!

by DLJr on May 12, 2011 9:21 AM EDT up reply actions

Why do I have this sinking feeling that Ed wanting a goalie means we will not have a first round pick in the next say decade?? Sure UFA’s are out there, but it still makes me nervous because hey I would like a 1st round pick at some point. I think the revolving door is more of a coach/management issue than the actual play of the goalies.

I cannot wear my Pelle Eklund jersey anymore because of hockeybuzz and its creator Eklund.....

Hey Norm, if you were a hot dog would you eat your self??

Semper Fi...

by lcd24 on May 12, 2011 9:04 AM EDT reply actions

To be fair, we’re basically trading second round picks anyway. Not that it helps, but the Oilers’ second round picks are generally almost as valuable as our firsts. It’s not like we’re Toronto for Kimmo’s sake.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions

I agree, just being sarcastic about the picks I would take a high second round pick i mean its better than what we have now.

I cannot wear my Pelle Eklund jersey anymore because of hockeybuzz and its creator Eklund.....

Hey Norm, if you were a hot dog would you eat your self??

Semper Fi...

by lcd24 on May 12, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions

Oh, i totally want us to use our picks…I just feel like when we joke about trading away first round picks we don’t always mention that we’re not trading away gold, more like silver.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions

Since Howard Eskin is somehow always right concerning Flyers injuries, I wonder if he can confirm the rumor that the disc in Pronger’s back will be replaced with another elbow?

by Phalange on May 12, 2011 9:38 AM EDT reply actions

I know he ‘cheated’ a bit but Shea Weber’s playoff beard was amazing. Total mountain man look. Shame the Preds are out so we can’t see how badass it would’ve looked after another round (or two).

by cova24 on May 12, 2011 10:06 AM EDT reply actions

Niittymaki

I would love if we brought him back as a backup.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:19 AM EDT reply actions

Post fail.

Does anyone have his stats from last year? Or his career? If you don’t have them handy, don’t waste your time getting them, I’m just wondering what his EES% is and comparing it to niemi’s…whom I also don’t know.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions

This spreadsheet has the career totals. It also has the individual years on hidden sheets, or you can get them on nhl.com.

by Eric T. on May 12, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions

thanks

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions

Niemi: 1310 of 1407 for a .931 ESS% this year.
Nitty: 468 of 512 for a .914 ESS% this year.

Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!

by DLJr on May 12, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions

Thanks again

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions

So, 363 days after the completed their 3-0 comeback against the Bruins, the Detroit Red Wings have a chance to do the same. Am I the only one with a gut feeling that the Red Wings win tonight?

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on May 12, 2011 10:41 AM EDT reply actions

I hope they don’t, because all we’re going to hear about if they do is:

“Aren’t the Red Wings awesome? Hey, this is even more impressive than when the Flyers did it last year because of [bullshit reasons which boil down to discrediting everything the Flyers do today because of the years 1972-77]!!!!

Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?

by mikefive on May 12, 2011 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions

AWESOME.

Defending Carter until 2021...

by Pardini36 on May 12, 2011 10:48 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs

Beards

If they were going to include cheaters, they should have included Big Ville Style.

I mean, come on!

He’s gotta displace one of those bums on the lower end, for sure!

by iJewJitsu on May 12, 2011 12:45 PM EDT reply actions

Shameless self-promotion

Our good friends John Gonzalez and John Smallwood decided to write about soccer. I took them to task for their unintelligent ramblings. [The Brotherly Game]

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on May 12, 2011 3:44 PM EDT reply actions

Yeah, I don’t even read them any more.

Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor