Tuesday Morning Fly By: Our Fearless Leader Returns to Assess the Rubble
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 6:00 AM EDT
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Today's open discussion thread, complete with your daily dose of Philadelphia Flyers news and notes...
- The Flyers traded Darroll Powe to Minnesota for a 2013 (not a typo) third round pick: [SB Nation Philly] [Philly Sports Daily] [Flyers Goal Scored By...] [Inquirer] [Flyer Files] [delcotimes.com]
- Andreas Nodl and Tom Sestito were re-signed: [Philly Sports Daily] [Frequent Flyers] [Flyers Faithful] [CSNPhilly] [NHL Hot Stove]
- A profile on Sean Couturier: [Flyers Faithful]
- A radio interview with Mike Richards where he expressed his "extreme shock" at being traded: [Sports Radio Interviews]
- Jeff Carter was the talk of the intertubes yesterday, but he finally spoke after meeting with Columbus for over an hour: [Frequent Flyers] [Puck Daddy] [Daily News]
- Frank Seravalli continues to push the Steven Stamkos rumors, closing with "Call me crazy. But my sources aren't.": [Daily News]
- Anthony SanFilippo looks at what some of us have been fearing for awhile, and that's the damage done to the Flyers reputation in the free agent market: [delcotimes.com]
- Another open letter to Paul Holmgren, this time worrying about the eroding "loyal family" reputation of the organization: [Flyers Faithful]
- Scouting reports on the newest Flyers: [The Hockey Guys]
- Someone has had enough of everyone complaining and grousing about Richards and Carter being traded. A good read even though I disagree: [Philly Reign]
- An optimistic look at the 11-12 Flyers as the start of a new era: [SB Nation Philly]
- Capgeek says Stefan Legein still has one more year left on his deal. Sweet. (s/t Tim McManus) [CapGeek]
- In the weekly "What We Learned" post, Ryan Lambert takes his turn with why the salary cap floor is hurting the NHL: [Puck Daddy]
- Wondering just how different Ryan Smyth and Chris Pronger are, even though Edmonton loves Smyth and hates Pronger: [The Copper & Blue]
- Winners and losers of the 2011 NHL Draft, where the Flyers are also in the image for the post: [Down Goes Brown]
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The sad thing is that I’m actually up, and you just scheduled this to go up now. Enjoy your sleep Detweiler.
Also, if you care, with only irons and a putter, he shot an 82 yesterday. As I said, he is ridiculously good at everything.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
That is insane. He had about one bad shot all day.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 8:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Yep. welcome to the world of Travis (not BSH Travis). He’ll be you at anything from Basketball, to foosball, to beirut. It just isn’t fair.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I’m deadly with a pong ball. Don’t test me in Beirut
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 8:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I’m not so bad either, this guy just never misses, unless he feels like f’ing with you.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I still insist that the game isn’t hard. horizontal accuracy isn’t an issue, but depth is, for me anyways
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t find it difficult…it’s a ping pong ball and a cup…but that guy isn’t really human. I was listing it more so as a range of things he’s good at. He’s good at real sports, table games, and drinking games. It’s rage inducing not to be able to beat a person at anything.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
what about quarters?
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Only played that once in a bar with him for about 45 seconds before we got in trouble…and yes, he was dominant.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
interesting
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Question
Do we think James van Riemsdyk could be a better goal scorer down the track than Jeff Carter? Obviously you won’t compare them on two-way play, but if we focus on just offensive production for a second…
Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 28, 2011 6:23 AM EDT reply actions
No.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 8:07 AM EDT up reply actions
My feelings toward JVR is that he still hasn’t tapped his full potential. carter, I fell, was at the best he could be. I still think Carter is 40 goal scorer too, and fully belive he will do it again in his career.
Samesis
Well, good for you. But JVR isn’t a shooter. He takes about half as many shots as Carter, allowing him to have a slightly higher shooting percentage. Add in that JVR cleans up garbage while Carter creates his own goals, and you see that JVR is not going to be a better goal scorer than Carter.
JVR might hit 30 in a good year, but he’ll be a 25 goal scorer in the NHL.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions
I dunno – using just my Mark 1 eyeball, it seemed that as last season progressed JVR was carrying the puck to the net (driving the lane if it was basketball) more often and getting more quality scoring chances from it. Is there some metric that compares a player’s shot total to scoring chances created? Because if JVR continues to bulk up, and adds his own power moves to the slot to his game, he could surpass 30 goals. Hell, Hartnell scores 20+ in a season, with comparatively little skill – it’s only reasonable that JVR can do better.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Is there some metric that compares a player’s shot total to scoring chances created?
If there is a scoring chances total, there could easily be that. But until we have scoring chances, we don’t have that.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions
I noticed the same thing, especially with that strong drive to the net off the left wing.
I also noticed that after they did the team skills competition and he found out he could shoot over 100mph, he started firing that sucker in games. I don’t think I saw him shoot a single slap shot prior to that.
I think if he can be consistent through the season, he could definitely eclipse 30 goals because he’s gotten to 20 being very sporadic.
You know who else wasn’t a shooter? LeClair. And he had what, four 50 goal seasons. Especially if JVR plays a good portion of his career with Giroux, I can see him getting to 40 goals. This year, no. But in his career I see it happening.
Samesis
During the one year Carter scored 40+ he had 324 shots.
During the 3 years LeClair scored 50+ he had 270, 324 and 303 shots. If that’s not a shooter I don’t know what is.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
But in Montreal he only took 139 and 153 his first two full seasons. I’m not sure we can rule out that JVR doesn’t start taking more at some point. He’d have to embrace the role and start taking more before such a thing became hypothetically possible
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not saying JVR might not develop into a shooter, I was just commenting on the notion that LeClair wasn’t a shooter when in fact he was.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
If JVR and Giroux can create LeClair/Lindros type magic, I’ll agree that 40 goals is possible but it’s not a guarantee. But Carter managed to score 40 goals under less ideal conditions. So JVR may be able to match the feat, but I don’t know if that’ll make him a ‘better goal scorer’ than Carter, because Carter may still have more natural affinity.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
In terms of being a better goal scorer, I agree that Carter is always gonna be better. But, my argument is that JVR can hit the 40 goal mark for a season in his career, which I don’t think is really that absurd of a statement.
Samesis
I was using PursuitofLappyness’ original wording, though.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Do we think James van Riemsdyk could be a better goal scorer down the track than Jeff Carter?
In terms of being a better goal scorer, I agree that Carter is always gonna be better.
But, my argument is that JVR can hit the 40 goal mark for a season in his career, which I don’t think is really that absurd of a statement.
What are you saying?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Okay, but only 5 people scored 40 goals this year. Only 7 did last year. Only 8 the year before.
JVR may be one of the best 10 players in the league any given year – i.e. potential – but I don’t see it happening.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree 40 is pushing it, but your estimate of 20 seems low. Can we agree that in the range of 30 goals per regular season is reasonable to expect?
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions
What are you basing this on?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions
I think you’re being a complete fanboy. Give me comparables. Don’t just throw a random number out there.
Mike Richards didn’t average 32 goals a year for 3 years, in fact he never hit 32 goals. Danny Briere hasn’t averaged 32 goals a year for 3 years EVER in his CAREER.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
JVR was a number 2 overall pick, Richie and Briere were drafted 23 and 24, respectively. The Flyers drafted him on raw talent and the hope that he “grows into his body” and becomes a dominant player. He hasn’t done it yet, but it looks like he might be on his way. It’s all eye-test at this point.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Sure. But if you’re going to throw out 32 goal average over 3 years, you better be able to say “These guys who got $5.75 mil+ per year also did it”.
Otherwise, you’re just being a fanboy and saying “Dude, he’s so awesome. He can totally be the best player to play for the Flyers in 15 years.”
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s all eye-test at this point.
And hence Geoff’s problem. I swear he’s blind. (JK) But it is true that there are no statistics to support any of this – it is all conjecture. Doesn’t make it WRONG, just unsupported.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Doesn’t make it WRONG, just unsupported.
If anybody noticed, I’ve never said it’s wrong. I’ve asked for comparables.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
C’mon. You know JVR is one of a kind.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
So is Darroll Powe.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions
OK. Patrick Marleau. Second full season, scored 21 goals ,24 assists. Took only 134 shots for a 16% average. Last season, scored 37 goals on 279 shots.
Want more?
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Second full season in 1998-99?
What was the biggest reason for his jump: shooting more, or the post-lockout era of play?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Gee Geoff, I dunno. What stats do you have to prove YOUR point??
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
That nobody comparable scored 32 goals over a three year period from 22-24?
It’s the absence of evidence :) I don’t have to prove my claim since my proof is that JpH can’t prove his.
I’m the defense and the plaintiff hasn’t met their burden.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
I didn’t know my opinion was being put on trial here. If I had, I would have brought my briefcase to make me look smarter.
Samesis
Psh, you must be new to BSH
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Patrick Sharp.
Second full season, scored 20 goals. Shot total = 160; percentage 12.5%.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
His next three year goal average: 29.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
You’re quibbling over ONE GOAL per season? Really?
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
No, I’m quibbling over JpH’s 32 goal average for the next three years.
Plus, Sharp was 26 when he did that, not 22 like JVR.
But you’re forgetting that I’m disputing JpH’s claims, not yours. As I said below, your prediction was reasonable.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
haha, that’s even worse!
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Brenden Morrow. Second season, scored 20 goals on 121 shots. Another 30+ goal scorer last season.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Has only scored 32 goals in his career twice, three years apart, and has never averaged 32 over a three year period, let alone his 3-5 seasons.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Alright. Nikolai Kulemin. Just completed his third season. Scored under 20 in the first two, took under 150 shots in each. This past season, increased his shots to over 170, and scored 30 goals. (Sure, not showing a pattern of 30-goal seasons, but the closest comparison to JVR I can find in current players.)
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Only seven players have averaged 32 goals over the last 5 years. They all took 2.86 shots per game or more, and six of them took 3.31 or more. van Riemsdyk is at 2.31 shots per game.
Basically, JpH is saying van Riemsdyk is Ovechkin, Kovalchuk, Nash, Staal, Heatley, Semin, or Vanek.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Is he saying that JVR is those guys, or that JVR has the potential to be those guys?
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
I say over the next 5 years he has a 32 goal average.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Right but he isn’t wrong. 6 years from now he might be wrong but today, he isn’t.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
I never said he is wrong. I’m saying he’s being unrealistic.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
I for one, hope the lil guy is right.
Positive Vibration!!!
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
I hope he’s right too. But I’d put money on him being wrong.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
BTW, this is so fitting as my 24,000th comment on BSH
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Geoff isn’t happy unless he’s making sure everyone else issadwrong.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
Geoff isn’t happy unless he’s making sure everyone else issad wrongunsupported by statistics.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Or another objective measurement to prove their opinion is realistic.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Past performance is no guarantee of future results.
Stock Market Yo!
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
Right. How is this a retort?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Have you ever heard the phrase used in reference to mutual funds, etc.?
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
Don’t read much about mutual funds.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s the caveat at the end of all radio, tv ads.
JPH just happens to be bullish on JVR based on his performance.
You are bearish on JVR based on his performance.
You’re both analysts.
Just with different viewpoints. And I’m not sure I’d invest my money with either of you but that has nothing to do with JVR (cool stock symbol).
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
You are bearish on JVR based on his performance.
That’s not true. I’m simply showing how “bullish” JpH is on JVR. He’s so “bullish” that he expects JVR to be one of the best 7 goal scorers in the NHL over the next half-decade.
I don’t have to be “bearish” on JVR to say I don’t think he’s going to be one of the best goal scorers in the NHL, replicating a feat accomplished by less than 10 players.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Just one of those sayings any time I see “Past performance is no guarantee of future results”, “Regression to the Mean” I have to throw in Sample Size to complete the circle of cynical realism.
Ah. Okay.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
You are under selling Carter that is the problem. Carter is a top 10 forward in the league.
To be a dick…
I think JVR will be a better playoff goal scorer than Carter. In fact he is only 2 goals behind Carter for their playoff career.
Carter was just a wittle guy in ‘08, was admittedly terrible in ’09, and was injured the last two years. He’s been pretty unfortunate, having one legitimately crappy performance against Crosby, Malkin and Staal. I feel like he’s also been incredibly snakebitten a la “how did that stay out?!”
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions
I was being a dick…or aka typical blind to the facts WIP listening Eagles fans 1st ESPN watching Philly sports fan.
Ah. “I think it’s a great book, Jason. Now, having said that, it is a little thin.”
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
I didn’t say 20, I said 25 goal scorer with potential for 30.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Alright – but I still think you’re low. 25 goals on average is pretty good, but not upper-echelon. JVR has potential to be upper-echelon, and that (to me) is over 25 a season. I mean, 50 players scored 25+ goals last season. You don’t think he’ll be above that 50th person mark?
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions
30+ goals = top 30 scorers. There’s 30 teams.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
When Briere scored 34, is he upper-echelon? Giroux scored 24 last year, is he not upper echelon?
How many guys are going to score 30 goals on the Flyers?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions
I say Briere score 30+, G scores 30+, and JVR comes close 30, and Versteeg and Harts score low 20’s. Wild card is Voracek, who I think will get 20+
Samesis
G is not a upper-echelon GOAL SCORER, but he is surely an upper-echelon offensive player.
My prediction is that with Richie and Carter gone Briere will not be as sheltered, so will have more trouble reaching that 30-goal plateau. I see JVR as the leading goal scorer next season, with G highest point-getter. Briere struggles to hit 30, Hartnell gets his usual 22, Versteeg underperforms at just under 20, Voracek pots around 20 also, Simmonds gets just under 20, and Sestito nabs 12. Oh, and the yet-to-be-named FA center gets another 15.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
This is a lot more reasonable. At least until you get to Sestito.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
G is not a upper-echelon GOAL SCORER, but he is surely an upper-echelon offensive player.
Geoff touched on that:
But JVR isn’t a shooter.This got lost a long the way. I don’t think Geoff is saying he can’t be upper echelon offensive talent, but it might not be in goal scoring. Thus far in his career, he isn’t taking a ton of shots.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I’m not disagreeing with that. I am saying that JVR continues to develop (perhaps someone with lots of free time can see if he shot more after the all-star break, ‘cause it sure seemed he did) and even without his ’unsustainable shooting percentage’ (one of Geoff’s faves) if he snagged 21 goals at age 22, achieving more in the next couple years doesn’t really seem too silly.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
And Geoff said potential 30 goal guy. Being a perennial 30 (even 25) goal guy is damn good.
This went off the rails on semantics and with absolutely no evidence (which you can still get some supporting evidence here for this stuff).
Frankly I’m hoping it stops because who gives an F.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Fair enough. Sorry to bore you.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Plus, what is “upper echelon”?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
A completely subjective qualification designed entirely to suit my opinions when, and if, needed. :)
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
hahaha, that works for me.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions
He came under fire at the start of the season when his agent, Gilles Lupien, and the Drummondville Voltiguers decided to restrict his media availability until after the New Year.
In the post on Couturier’s drafting I posted up some comments about him being a quiet guy who is a bit uncomfortable with the media. Just likes to do his talking on the ice. He’s got an ‘A’ with Drumondville but his coach acknowledges that he’s not the type to speak much in the locker room. I hope the Flyers understand this and don’t allow Couturier to replace Richards on Carchidi’s hate list by putting him in media opportunities at the wrong times.
Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 28, 2011 6:25 AM EDT reply actions
On another Couturier note
Here’s me again just going on about how amazing this pick is:
"Mononucleosis is one of those things that the expert medical scouts say it takes a full year to get back from that. Well, if he falls all the way to No. 6, and somebody grabs him and he does recover more fully from his draft year mononucleosis — I mean, they may have the best player in the draft at No. 6."
Skating problems was one of those flaws they found. In fact I went over to Japers and they didn’t mind us picking up Couturier because of the skating issues.
"We see it practically every year. The kid who has been around the longest gets picked apart. Everybody knows what he can do and then starts looking for holes in his game….There were guys who’d tell you that Rick Nash couldn’t play because he wasn’t much of a skater.
See I actually believe we picked a #1 calibre player. In the last 10 years of the NHL, only 1 player picked #1 overall hasn’t turned into an absolute superstar and he was a defenseman in Erik Johnson. Couturier may well be the best player in his draft class. I’m thinking I need a Drumondville jersey.
Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 28, 2011 6:30 AM EDT reply actions
I have high hopes. I was surprised, as were the Flyers I’m sure, to see him there at 8. Good for us!
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 28, 2011 7:23 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
So what do you think his chances are when it comes to making the starting roster?
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 7:57 AM EDT up reply actions
0.000001%
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
This year.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Yes, I meant this year.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 8:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Realistically, as close to 0 as it gets. You have Giroux, Briere, and Schenn in front of him. Unless you plan on moving one of them or Couturier to wing, it just doesn’t make sense. Giroux is your 2 way guy, Schenn isn’t quite ready for the leagues top two lines yet, and Briere is a defensive liability. So you can’ shelter him. Plus you wouldn’t have the minutes for him at center to even play him in that scenario. He would have to be unbelievable to justify moving someone to the wing.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Thanks, for that explanation. I was curious what his role would be along with the new players coming in. Since he can’t play in the AHL for two years I assume he will be playing in Juniors for a couple of seasons?
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 8:45 AM EDT up reply actions
So, like Schenn this year, Couturier is going to be that small sampling of players in juniors that are too good to be playing juniors? Did Schenn progress much last year?
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
not that i don’t doubt the guy, but giroux has some heavy shoes to fill in the two way department… it’s gonna be a work in progress unfortunately for next year
I hope he’s not on the starting roster to be honest. Take it slow. If he’s on the starting roster he would have to be playing wing or playing tough center minutes and neither of those situations are ideal.
Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 28, 2011 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions
tons of love for powe. trying not to think about it, honestly.
Mike Richards was the first hockey player I knew of. After Gretzky. :(
I will miss Powe. A hard worker who seemed to relish his role on the team.
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 28, 2011 7:19 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
We were supposed to be purging the guys who weren’t motivated and didn’t always seem to give 100%; but Powe did that. At least I think he did.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Great minds think alike don’t they?
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 28, 2011 9:48 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
That’s just rumor blowing in the wind. People who look at other people, and believe they understand the effort involved are on a slippery slope. Did Mike Richards get traded because he didn’t try hard enough, or did he get traded because he made it clear that he didn’t see anything good coming out of trading his best friend (and the team’s 3 year leading goal scorer), to the degree that he purportedly lost his shit for 30 minutes when he heard the news? Maybe what happened is that they made the decision to part with Carter to accommodate the Bryz deal and realized that Richards was too much of a gamble to stick with, knowing his feelings on moving Carter. Powe could easily be seen as collateral damage.
I never heard of Powe being part of that cabal. Jeffie and Richie, yeah – and you coudl argue it included CArbomb. But I never once saw Powe at McGillans.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I would’ve much preferred to send Shelley and a 3rd round pick to Minn and keep Powe. Does this mean we’re resigning Carcillo…?
I think this means we’re clearing roster spots and money for UFA season.
by Georgia_Flyer on Jun 28, 2011 7:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Say hello to Ville Leino at 4.5 million per.
by chrislanci on Jun 28, 2011 8:14 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
NOoooooooooooooo
You might surmise, here, that I’d not prefer that option.
by Georgia_Flyer on Jun 28, 2011 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Not really. Powe is redundant with Nodl, Carcillo has been on his way out since last off season. I think, luckily for every Flyers fan, that Ville has priced himself out of the Flyers range.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I think, luckily for every Flyers fan, that Ville has priced himself out of the Flyers range.
I really hope this is true. I would gladly take Z back at half the hit, but he won’t come back here, ever.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
There are some other interesting players out there, especially if the Flyers want to move Simmonds or Versteeg to a “top 6” role.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
There are indeed, anyone that you have your eye on?
I think Steeg could be a top 6 forward on a line with JVR and Giroux. Would be good to see him add some defensive responsibility to Briere and Hartnell’s line but since he is the only one who would be playing defense then it’s not worth it.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Also, you can’t have both Versteeg and Hartnell falling all over the place at the same time.
by hebrew hammer on Jun 28, 2011 8:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Carolina has two UFA’s coming up I’d be interested in personally. I don’t see Ward getting away from Nashville unless you over pay, which I’d like to not do for once.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
JUSSI JUSSI
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Yessi, Yessi! (Unless we have to pverpay)
by Georgia_Flyer on Jun 28, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Are you leaving out Cole, Larose, or Jokinen? Also, you’re ready to see Schenn at center, I assume?
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
I have zero interest in Larose personally. And not necessarily, but I’m not against it either.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I guess my assumption is that if you sign a winger, Schenn has to play third line center.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Not necessarily, plus I know Jussi can handle himself in the dot…not that that makes him an ideal fit for 3rd line center.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Even with my pro-Ville screen name, I’d still be pissed if they paid him that much. I do think he’s a damn talented stickhandler that can make some unbelievable plays, he just takes far, far too many risks with the puck. During the first half of the year last year, he was great. I’d love to keep him, but not at that price.
Dustin Leed tweeted yesterday that they have, or will, let Carcillo walk. But, that is the only place I’ve read that.
I should be more precise. Dustin said Carcillo did not get qualified. “Flyers … let Carcillo walk” was the exact tweet.
Kinda the same difference here. That’s how you let an RFA walk, is by not qualifying him. Not surprised, or disappointed.
by Georgia_Flyer on Jun 28, 2011 8:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Carcillo was not given a qualifying offer.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Can someone also remind Homer of the horrendous Lupul contract so we can avoid doing the exact same thing with Leino. 3.5 should be the max I much rather pay Cole, Jokienen, Gagne, Laich that money then another sheltered forward. If Zherdev taught us anything last season there is no room for 4 sheltered forwards on this team and we already have Hartnell, Briere, and Vorachek.
by chrislanci on Jun 28, 2011 8:19 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
He won't let this die
Meh… what’s four 1st round picks. Can someone sick Anonymous on him?
Two different team sources reiterated last night that the Flyers would be very interested in Tampa Bay’s Steven Stamkos if he remains on the market on Friday morning….Call me crazy. But my sources aren’t.
I was just going to post about this. Lol
So I guess no chance of bringing him here, even though they are clearing out some cap space?
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 8:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Don’t get me wrong, I would love Stammer being on this team, even if it costs 7-8 mil per, I know, I know, crazy but the guy is incredible.
That said, you can’t bring him on board without further gutting the team, which I am not in favor of.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Now that I think about it, it doesn’t seem that far fetched that the Flyers would make a play for him. Trading Carter and Richards for much younger players who could potentially be stars fits in with a plan to lose your next 4 first round draft picks to add a current superstar. And he’s only 21.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 8:32 AM EDT up reply actions
The problem, the biggest one to me anyway, is that the cost of Stammer, in dollars is equal to that of 3, possibly all 4 of those first round picks, at least, in their first contract.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Probably more than all of them, actually, especially because they would likely be late first-rounders. It’s a question of whether you value 4 possibly decent future players and the first few years of cap savings they bring, or one of the best players in the league right now who is only 21 years old. It’s difficult to gauge the financial implications of a deal like this with the ever-changing cap, the CBA expiring, and, honestly, how shitty the economic outlook is in this country. I’m not sure the growth the league has seen in recent years is sustainable.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 8:48 AM EDT up reply actions
I would be okay taking the chance on giving up Draft picks if it brings the cup home to Philly.
I know it’s not a certainty but with Stamkos on the team it definitely helps more than hurts.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I would make the move to bring him in right now, and here is why…trading Richie and Carter put this team a step back, and yet, we have a defense built to win now. Adding Stammer, in my mind, get’s us back to where we need to be. But that does not include what other moves would need to be made to fill out the roster.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Didn’t somebody debunk this already? It would have to be a gargantuan front-loaded contract for Tampa not to match. With all team’s own RFA’s to sign and fill out the roster, where would this $$ even come from?
by Boundforbeach on Jun 28, 2011 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Other players could still be moved (Hartnell, Timonen). I’m not endorsing this but I’m also not putting it past the Flyers FO.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions
They won’t do it with an offer sheet if they do go after him, which i still see as unlikely. I’d say that’s 99.99% not going to happen. So the 4 1st rounders, or whatever the compensation would end up being for an offer sheet, is inconsequential.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
So what type of cap space are we looking at if we don’t resign Ville or Carbomb?
Someone capgeek it, I am horrible when it comes to numbers. Lol
Would that be enough to bring Stamkos here?
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 8:48 AM EDT up reply actions
All you have to do is bookmark this link.
Then just scroll down and see that right now, the Flyers have 19 players and $6.7 million in cap space.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Geoff, does that 6.7 include Schenn’s cap hit?
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Did you follow the link? haha
it does.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I followed the link, and saw the number at the bottom but with it being orange I wasn’t sure if that indicated anything other than it being an ELC.
I spend too much time with excel spreadsheets and just because a number is on there, doesn’t mean it’s factored into anything, thus why I asked.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
Orange means 2 way, plus sign means bonuses. Its the people down below, the non-roster players, that arent included
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Ah. Yeah, anything above that $6.7 mil is included. Anything below isn’t.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 9:29 AM EDT up reply actions
More importantly, only 10 forwards, at least one of which would have to be moved to find cap space for Stamkos. To fill out the roster with Stamkos, add at least 1.5 to his cap hit for two crappy players to play on your third line and no 13th; more if you want anything better.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
I’m not doing a potential gapgeek roster until I see the numbers for Simmonds and Voracek, which will hopefully come out today.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 8:55 AM EDT up reply actions
No. Not even close. Assuming we sign Simmonds/Voracek to a combined $4.5m hit, you’re looking at:
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
Kris Versteeg ($3.083m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Andreas Nodl ($0.845m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jake Voracek ($2.250m)
Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Wayne Simmonds ($2.250m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
/ Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,001,428; BONUSES: $3,940,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $3,298,572
Even if Schenn plays for the Phantoms, we remove Shelley, and replace those two spots with a combined cap hit of, say, $2m, we’re still well short of $6m of cap space. The only possibility is to lock him up to a long deal to dilute the cap hit, but then we’re back in the same position. Next year, we need to resign defenseman and JvR, and bring up Schenn. This wouldn’t be possible (at least I can’t see how).
So if we could move Shelly and Hartnell we would be able to sign Stamkos. ;)
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 9:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Few things: I realize the positions are all out of whack. Anyway, the numbers are still there.
The roster above has one gap at forward. if you remove Hartnell in addition to Shelley and add Stamkos, then there is still a gap. We’d need to fill Hartnell’s spot with something, and they’d probably have to make about as much as I make (hint: <<<6 figures)
My head hurts. :( Lol
What about bringing up a forward or center from the Phantoms? Less of a Cap Hit?
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 9:10 AM EDT up reply actions
As long as they can stay on their skates more than Hartnell I would be okay with that. :)
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions
If they go after Stamkos, I think it becomes official that we’re just throwing money at people and hoping somehow it works out in the end. If they go that route, I don’t see any proper plan for 18 guys who actually know their roles and play them well. If we give everything we have to Stammer, what do we do if Schenn isn’t ready to handle being the third line center? Who plays on the Penalty Kill? Honestly, that offer sheet, if it happens might be my true breaking point.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Agreed 100%. I’m still sad about Richards and Carter being gone, but the youth movement, and the fact that this team has the potential to be competitive (and deep – Giroux, JvR, Schenn, Voracek, Simmonds, Couturier) for years to come is exciting. Signing a big deal with someone like Stamkos, although he’s young, would really threaten that depth. I truly believe this team can be competitive as is.
I wish I had you confidence. I guess I am just bitter over the Richards trade.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions
You could just send Schenn to the minors and sign Stamkos without worrying too much. Also BroadStBull Sam “I am so Happy Richards is Gone” Carchidi thinks Vorachek and Simmonds combined cap hit will be only 3.2 million. So that is another 1 million right there.
Why is no one floating the idea of getting rid of/trading/waiving Briere? He’s less of a staple than Richards/Carter, and Stamkos makes up for his production loss. Then you have Stammer/Roux/Schenn 1/2/3 Centers with our #8 in the wings. That turns into a competitive youth movement.
(And does not make next season easy at all for resigning, but does anyone think we are not spending right up to the cap this year?)
personally
I think the Devils and Kovalchuk should now sue the NHL for age discrimination. They’re essentially saying he CAN’T play until he’s 44.
Go Devils
by FrankG929 on Aug 9, 2010 5:15 PM PDT
This era of hockey
will now be known as the post riot era
by Carcillo's Mustache on Jun 28, 2011 8:27 AM EDT reply actions
It’s funny how excited everyone is about all of our cap space yet we still have more of it committed to 2011-2012 contracts than any other team, haha.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 8:50 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
+1
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, they really didn’t gain any cap space given that they had to sign two RFA’s from the trade.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
eh, you technically did, in the form of gaining a player.
The Flyers have one less player to add to their team, but the same amount of cap space that they had with Richie and Carts. That’s technically gaining space
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m well aware of the addition, but people talk about cap space like they don’t still have 2 RFA’s to offer contracts to (though apparently they have been offered).
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Well yeah but they were probably minimum QOs, got knows what they’ll sign for.
Although the 6.7M does include Lappy and Leighton, for what it’s worth. That cancels out one of those RFAs, but not both.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Lappy and Leighton are issues with or without the trade though.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Yep. But when you account for them both not being on the cap when the season starts (using the 10% overage to handle them for now); them being taken off will balance out the contract of one of those RFAs. We should be able to get at least one of them signed for less than 2.7 million.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m aware, but this could have been done without the trade. The trade didn’t make any of that happen.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
100% agree. If I’m not making a whole lot of sense just ignore me then, my coffee hasn’t kicked in and I might still have headache related aphasia
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah my point was, the 2 big trades (in themselves) didn’t clear up all this cap space…meaning the kind of cap space that the Flyers could use to go after a big name UFA (B Richards) or Stamkos. But people keep clamoring, especially about Richards. At least from the stuff I’ve been subjected to over the weekend.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
No I don’t, considering that could have been done with smaller moves.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
It could have technically but like all the rosters we ran through once Brzy was aquired there probably would have been 3 AHLers in our starting lineup to fit him and no Schenn Simmonds or Vorachek and no #8 over pick and forget being able to sign a 4 million dollar UFA.
Basically in the ideal world were you could move Versteeg and Hartnell for some 2nd round picks at best the forward core would look like this.
Richards-Carter-Briere-Giroux-JVR-Betts-Shelly-Nodl-Holmstrom-Read-Wellwood and maybe 2million in UFA contracts to fill out the rest.
We all went through it with a full $1mil (or more) less in cap space. Plus at this point, you are starting an argument of semantics. Feel free to keep reading as to why I made the comment, and what I meant with it…I’m done conversing about something so trivial..especially with you.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
and boom goes the dynamite
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
eh, the guys coming in really have no leverage. Jake has underperformed, and Simmonds has performed to what was expected, but even then that’s not a 3 or 4 million dollar hit.
Now if they somehow get a 2 way forward instead of Leino cough Jussi Jokinen *cough, then we’ll be in business
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Again, there isn’t really much of a difference in the cap from all the moves. Granted you have one less hole to fill, but that’s it.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I’d contend that’s a big difference.
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:07 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s not B Richards or Stamkos money though. And people are still talking about that non sense, which is my point. That didn’t gain that kind of cap space from the trade, but people are talking like they did. I’m not saying the trade didn’t get x, y, or z…I’m saying the trade didn’t clear any cap space for a big addition to the roster.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I see your point. In my defense I never saw it as superstar money, but more as picking up a free agent here or there that’s a specialist
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I’m not trying to make the claim that it wasn’t good for filling out the roster like signing Bryz Our Goalie and Savior isn’t good for filling out a roster…but rather they hadn’t cleared all that space. I was at a BBQ, and everyone was quoted the space they cleared without considering the Simmonds and Voraceck contracts. And they kept talking about Richards and Stamkos. That’s why I said what I said. it was mildly unbearable. And since everyone knows I play, and that I have season tickets…everyone wants to repeat what they hear on WIP to me. So, in order to avoid an hour long argument with charts and graphs that I would have to repeat to 12 or so people, I just smile and nod (then go to the bathroom to hit my head against a wall for 5 minutes)
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
But when you realize it’s about to be Jussi Jokinen time, you get excited
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Totally ok with that, because it’s in the realm of reality.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
and when you look at his stats, he’s better than Leino
well I’m just looking at his G, A, Pts, but I have to believe he’s a 2 way player
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions
He's more physical
He goes more to dirty areas, plays harder, and (no proof of this assertions) I suspect he’s more durable. Leino has that hip thingy that worries me, considering what he’s asking for.
by Georgia_Flyer on Jun 28, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
P.S. Geoff, I love the headline this morning. And I can’t believe you went back to my webshots to steal that picture.
Just because I think it’s funny, they just finished putting up brand new boards and painting them. It looks about 200% less ghetto now.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
haha, I actually went to Travis’ facebook because I didn’t want to grab one he didn’t like. This was in his “Profile Pictures” folder, which is where I wanted to look.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 8:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Haha, okay.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions
If he didn’t have one there, I was going to go to your webshots, or at least what I think is your webshots.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 8:56 AM EDT up reply actions
It is, well at least it’s mine but I don’t really use it. That pickup game is the only thing there.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions
This picture makes me sad when the hell is the next BSH roller hockey game.
"All hail the Flyers" Jim Jackson.
by darkside3744 on Jun 28, 2011 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t even play, and I have been complaining about this since April.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t mind playing in net. Less movement for me
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 8:59 AM EDT up reply actions
If Jussi Jokinen enters my life, I don’t know what I’ll do
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:16 AM EDT reply actions
Jussi is also “clutch” in the shootout.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
is he a two way player?
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Not as much as you probably think he is…middle to low end of the pack in comp, middle of the pack zone starts. You’d want Cole if you are looking for more of a defensive type 2 way, we’ll call Jussi and offensive type kinda two way…that work for you?
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I think I would prefer Cole over Jokinen but I do like that Jussi is 5 years younger, FWTW.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
I’d take either. With Simmonds and Versteeg, I’m more willing to go Jussi. But getting Cole would allow one of Simmonds to Versteeg to potentially flourish on a line put in more opportune positions.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Isn’t Jussi going to want Leino money? He’s got better numbers.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Hey may, not sure, but I also feel he is a better value.
This market is perplexing, with the cap rise and thing crop of forwards, I’m afraid to guess on salary. Leino is asking (reportedly at least) a good $0.5-1mil more per year that I thought he would even ask for…so…yeah.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Eric Cole works for me too. If we get either, I mark it as a success
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
From the DGB link ... reviewing the draft.
Loser: Philadelphia Flyers – Were unable to draft a player to fill their most glaring roster hole, a #1 center who can score, kill penalties, play physically and provide leadership, although in fairness we all know those type of players are pretty much never available.
’Nuff said.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
Someone else…I think it was ESPN, so take it for what it’s worth, but they gave the Flyers I think a C or C- grade for the draft but cited losing Richards and Carter as reasons for the low grade…despite them not actually being part of the draft.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
I really don’t understand why ESPN doesn’t use TSN content on their website at least. It would save ESPN money and give TSN exposure.
What can't Giroux do?
and then there’s that whole accuracy thing.
"All we want is to be treated like human beings, not to be experimented on like guinea pigs or patronized like bunny rabbits. "
"I don't patronize bunny rabbits."
by Mike B on D on Jun 28, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Also, TSN is partially owned by ESPN.
In preparation for NHL free agency, thinking of changing my screen name to Bhudde in 10OC.
I’m probably biased because I work for ESPN.com, but I actually think we do a better job with NHL content on the web than TSN does. TSN is better for breaking news but ESPN has more in the way of stories and analysis.
I’m not saying ESPN.com is the greatest destination for NHL content, far from it, but I think there’s more there than they get credit for. Plus the presentation is much better (IMO).
I think the ESPN NHL writers get too much flack. I find them on the higher end of the mainstream media in terms of content, and they simply can’t be blamed for being the only people who care about hockey in their company, especialy when they do care quite a large bit.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
It varies widely. I like Buccigross, and LeBrun is fairly good, but I’m not fond of Hradek or Burnside or Melrose.
Bob.
I think Buccigross is too involved with being a hipster to say anything of value, LeBrun is LeBrun, Hradek works hard and gets better than average results, Melrose gets a bum rap for being the cover model for the NHL but his analysis is often level-headed, and Burnside is hit or miss—either poignant or an idiot.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Personally, I enjoy Bucci’s humor, but I can see how it’s not for everyone. LeBrun is solid but not brilliant. Hradek does seem to have improved – honestly, I hadn’t read him for a while, but his work seems better than I remember. Melrose will be Cherry in five or ten years; right now he’s on the back end of the wave, and he’s getting left behind the game. For the first couple years after I got back into hockey, Burnside never wrote a single positive piece about the Flyers. Now it’s only 90% negative.
Bob.
I don’t think we’d love DGB so much if he wasn’t dead on almost every time.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
To me, it’s that he mocks everyone, including (especially) his own team. When a guy can laugh at himself, it’s easier to laugh with him when he’s laughing at your team.
Bob.
by The Dark on Jun 28, 2011 12:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I’m really resisting all urges to make my own roster, but refuse to do so
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:29 AM EDT reply actions
haha, this makes it sound like you’re refusing to resist all urges.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions
because I really am thinking about making this roster. but I said that i detest all fictional rosters
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Erik Cole is a C/LW right?
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:47 AM EDT reply actions
Ugh.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - Covering the Philadelphia Flyers. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
our? Shit i love what’s going down
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
more tickets for me, and more tickets for my “Night Train” poster
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t even know what to think anymore.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - Covering the Philadelphia Flyers. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on Jun 28, 2011 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions
i learned to love the nuclear bomb awhile ago, Travis
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
have to trim down the fat, some how
those who retire the fandom are ok in my book, just don’t smile when I’m drinking champagne on Broad Street
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions
I keep it classy
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Welcome home! Please tell me you at least knew about most of this before you actually got back
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
He learned of it in a Jamaican bar. Best place to be to learn something like that.
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Haha, thanks.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 7:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I said I'd never do one, but I am very proud of this roster
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.000m)
Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m) / Erik Cole ($3.500m) / Kris Versteeg ($3.083m)
Tom Sestito ($0.700m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Andreas Nodl ($0.845m)
Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
Paul Mara ($1.100m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,552,761; BONUSES: $3,940,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $747,239
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 9:53 AM EDT reply actions
And this roster does not build confidence for me either. I don’t know if it because I am really not the familiar with some of the new faces or if it’s because I am bitter about the FO and the trades.
I just get a bad feeling that this team is not going to accomplish much this season. I know it’s a negative attitude to have, but I can’t help it.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions
I think it’s just bitterness.
Under that roster this team is just aggressive and heavy hitting. More under the Boston regiment and school of thought
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions
I think you are right. Bitter, bitter, bitter…….. Yes I am.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
That is my roster damn it.
Eric T makes a good point with Laich as the 3rd line Center over Schenn and with the draft pick of Coutier maybe send Schenn to wing for his career is a good thing.
hey hey, I would never go back and copy and paste a roster. I made this one fresh, with some CCB ingredients
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions
and if you thought i was being defensive i apologize\
i have a certain defensive tone when I’m being accused of something
that wasn’t it
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Everyone has already done that with Leights and Walker, why not just throw Shelley on that pile.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I am staring to think this might happen. Someone might need to take on Salary maybe we can send someone Walker as well.
I’m curious to see what happens to Walker and Leights. Everyone is operating on assumptions right now, which may be fair, but they are still assumptions.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Walker Leighton and Shelly have bad deals but they are not Brian Campbell bad and you get to fill out 3 roster spots.
I mean its is a projected roster from a fan, its not like we have any real information to go by.
What can't Giroux do?
But we do have real information. It’s the two years remaining on Shelley’s contract.
Speculation is fine for the open roster positions (Cole, Gagne, etc), but Shelley and Hartnell are, more than likely, here to stay.
You are right about that, but I mean we don’t have an idea what management thinks. I would say its safer to speculate waiving shelley than speculating that the Flyers sign free agent x at salary cap hit z, the latter has plenty more variables.
What can't Giroux do?
We can and should waive him but it doesn’t seem like Holmgren is going to do that so I think everyone has sort of agreed to keep him on the capgeek roster.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
One can only hope that with Sestito’s signing he can replace Shelley this year, and (maybe hopefully) Hartnell next year.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
I think Sestito can become a 3rd line winger one day. He’s better offensivly then a 4th liner anyway.
Samesis
Based on what?
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
http://www.behindthenet.ca/projecting_to_nhl.php
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Not if you ask Don. But we can hope at least – and a half-point per game in the AHL projects (using some goofy made-up equation based only on objective observation and not any real math) is around a 20-point player per season.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m cautiously cautious about Sestito. I see him as the 13th forward, spelling Shelley. We’ll see what he does with limited time in the NHL.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Fair enough. I’d love to see him develop into a Hartnell, but I’d accept a Shelley replacement.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m talking only about this year. But I figure he is wait and see. I really only criticize players a lot when watching them if they don’t move well without the puck consistently, and that was him. It was really bad. But, we’ll wait and see, I see him as a Mike Rupp, which is definitely a Shelley upgrade, but it isn’t Hartnell.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Not to mention Simmonds and Voracek signed discounted contracts, for no reason whatsoever. I’m assuming we’ll want their contract to expire when they are still RFAs; for them to agree, they’ll want some actual money.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
I do love some E-Coli
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok, Seravalli really needs to stop with the Stankos tweets. I finally called him out on twitter about it with a stupid trade idea. But still, I like cap space damnit.
Samesis
Cap Space is overrated. ;) Lol
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions
But still, I like cap space damnit.
It’s all relative. The Flyers still have the least amount of cap space in the League.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions
doesn’t pain me to say it
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions
After next year they’ll have cap space? How?? They have to sign Coburn, Carle, JVR, and Versteeg.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Not if they trade them all first.
Dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnnn.
On the Mike Weber bandwagon!
Sabres took the scenic route, but they still MADE IT TO THE PLAYOFFS!!!1
by Ubiquitous on Jun 28, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Too soon. Funny… but too soon.
"All we want is to be treated like human beings, not to be experimented on like guinea pigs or patronized like bunny rabbits. "
"I don't patronize bunny rabbits."
by Mike B on D on Jun 28, 2011 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I say only 2 of them get resigned. And only JVR will get a huge jump in pay. Say JVR gets $3.5, and Coburn gets $4. Carle gets the same, and we let Versteeg walk(which would be great cause we could get a 2nd rounder for him being a RFA), we should be fine.
Samesis
You just spent $11.5 million of the $21.5 million in cap space (+ any potential increase), leaving 7 players to sign with $10 million.
You call that cap space???
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
I’d call that a conundrum
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions
John didn’t do the math.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
I was told there would be no team loyalties involved
see what i did there?
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Then we let Carle walk. big deal. I know you like him, but I’d rather have Coburn over him any day.
Samesis
So you’re still at a $2 million average for 8 players. That’s cap space to you?
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh, so you’re backing off the “cap space next year” claim?
Good.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Nice backpedal.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Deion Sanders esque
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
You guys are thinking wayyyyy too far ahead. Holmgren could very well trade our entire roster before next summer.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions
I can’t see how Versteeg stays. As for the other three, I think they will try to re-sign JVR and only one of Coburn and Carle. Unfortunately.
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Chris Pronger interview
The Flyers are 2011 Atlantic Division Champs, the Phillies just keep winning pennant after pennant. Great time to be a fan of those two teams on Broad Street.
Tyler Kennedy wasn’t given a QO for those who care.
"You can commit no mistake and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." - Jean-Luc Picard
lil bastard is quick
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions
That’s surprising to me. He’s a great third liner and can fill in in the top 6 decently in case of injuries.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
just bring him in, suit him up. He’s our anti Aaron Asham
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Great idea. I remember him scoring a lot of timely goals against the Flyers. Pretty suprising they would let him walk.
From Parts Unknown.
by Dos Furioso on Jun 28, 2011 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Decent? I’d vote for getting him or Talbot over someone exorbitant (sp?) like Stamkos.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I want Gagne back,
he would only cost about 2.5 million according to reports
by Bob's Crab Emporium on Jun 28, 2011 10:06 AM EDT reply actions
Sorry, I love Gags, but 2.5m is still a lot for a guy as fragile as he is at this point. You may not like Leino, but he’s a lot more durable at this point.
I also think they are totally different players: Gags is a sniper, Leino logs the puck, sets up plays and digs pucks out, and he’s damn good at it.
I’d take Gagne for $2.5M over Stamkos minus 4 1st rounders any day of the week. I’d also take him over Leino at $2M.
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
nope, it’s Erik Cole time
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Fuck. I live in DC. I love Laich. Awesome two way forward. Guy just a freakin’ class act all around. How much was he signed for?
Bleeding orange and black since birth. I really should get a doc to do some blood tests; this can't be normal.
by Brave Fellow on Jun 28, 2011 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
RealKyper Nick Kypreos
Lots of disappointed #NHL teams hearing #Capitals Brooks Laich re-signs 6 yrs. 27M. 4.5 will be the cap hit.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
You aren’t factoring in the tire changing.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
by DLJr on Jun 28, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The price we pay to not have to deal with the annual goalie controversy stories in April. If I trusted the MSM not to re-hash those stories anyway I might be okay with it.
If the Flyers aren’t a lock for the President’s Trophy, then those same stories will get pulled out as easy filler pieces.
by hebrew hammer on Jun 28, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Yep I think all the Brzy not being a playoff performer articles have already been written and post dated for April 26th 2012.
At least we can always retreat here for real articles.
by hebrew hammer on Jun 28, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
The goalie controversy stories don’t disappear until we bring home the Cup. And then they’d only take a brief hiatus.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
Over/under on the first MSM article about how we need to look somewhere other than Bryzgalov: Jan 15
We should do an over/under thing like they do on The Good Phight. It covers a wide range of events and dates by when they’ll happen.
I lurk on Twitter as @LusipherPE
Brief hiatus? That’s overestimation.
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
I’d venture to say successful teams rarely have “cap space” as has been discussed above. You have to be up against the cap to field an above average team. You don’t see winning teams saying “maybe we’ll sign Stamkos this offseason”. The Stamkoses and Carters, unless drafted, go to the Columbuses of the world unless a team (LA) is doing a major restructure, which we arguably are doing as well. So all of these hissy fits about not having cap space in 2013 is moot unless you want to be the Panthers. Shitty team, cap space galore.
The you have no clue what everyone on here is talking about when they say cap space, since everyone is referring to something completely different (enough space to not depend on LTIR and still have room for injury call ups is the biggest amount of cap space we are referring to).
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
I would say no clue is going a little far. I guess if you sign Leino to a $4 million cap hit then you do flirt with that kind of inflexibility if you aim to keep steeg, coburn, jvr and carle.
Gotta use the guide book for that one.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
In Net.....
On a somewhat positive note, after watching this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOqOWGjDuRQ&feature=related
I am excited to see what Ilya can do while wearing the Orange & Black.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
Looks pretty good. He is a large man.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Maybe it is the white mask but his style reminds of a Leighton. A Leighton with quick reflexes and the understanding of how to cover the five hole. How is his puck handling?
A Leighton with quick reflexes
Ilya = a leighton we can all be proud of…
by fitzy first on Jun 28, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
A Leighton with quick reflexes and the understanding of how to cover the five hole.
So the exact opposite of Leighton
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 11:52 AM EDT reply actions
Big guy who stands up with a white mask is where the similarities stop. I like it when goalies make great saves look easy that shows positional is on. Bob makes great saves but they don’t look easy it is all is insanely fast lateral movement.
Instead, the architect tore up his plan. Moving the pieces around, Holmgren made the Flyers bigger and younger – but no one knows, not for sure, if they got better.
They just got different.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
Sorry – the text is a quote from the editorial.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Dreger is saying on twitter that TB will match any offer for Stamkos which is what I’m sure most of if not all of us figured.
i dont believe any of those stamkos rumors… flyers are always rumored to be in the mixed to no avail
by fitzy first on Jun 28, 2011 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
And Eric showed him why that was stupid.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions
We are killing Sam around here. This might be the 1st time I hope he is right thought and would be more than willing to apologize.
Here’s the thing: He has no basis for making that prediction. If he was right, it’s not because he did the legwork to figure out why he was right.
That’s my whole problem with him. He doesn’t do the research, he just either spits out random thoughts or regurgitates the organization’s line. If he’s right, it’s dumb luck. Until he starts doing research, at least.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
This off season has further flamed my hatred of my local cable company. I only get the NHL Network when I am paying for the Center Ice Package.
With the moves we have made I really wanted to hear/watch what they had to say.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
NHL ntwork
has NOTHING to say right now. You’d think they’d be all over the big news, but its basically just draft week.
Samesis
Yeah, it’s been terrible. That station needs an overhaul or something (I think it’s called “programs” or content in the biz). Recaps replayed every hour on the hour is boring. Where is the analysis? Where are the trade discussions?
"All we want is to be treated like human beings, not to be experimented on like guinea pigs or patronized like bunny rabbits. "
"I don't patronize bunny rabbits."
by Mike B on D on Jun 28, 2011 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions
This is my big complaint with the NFLN as well. They could be breaking down film and providing a super high level of analysis and insight, but instead, they provide programs that are basic and elementary and pander to the casual fan.
Agreed. I want more live games and more analysis, not just a glorified score ticker hosted by Kevin Weekes.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
MLB Network, which I get on basic cable, actually does this.
In preparation for NHL free agency, thinking of changing my screen name to Bhudde in 10OC.
I have them all (I don’t specifically pay for them, but Comcast here lumps them in with the Travel Channel and the Science Channel and BBC America and stuff); and MLB is definitely the only one that does that.
NHLN’s 12 hours a day or replaying the same episode of On the Fly over and over again in horrific. And then things like the Brind’Amour retirement ceremony were never re-played even once. You have that stuff, at least re-air some of that stuff.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Roller Hockey
Keep meaning to mention this, but keep forgetting. New park in Collegeville—Anderson Farm Park—has a brand, spanking new Deck Hockey Rink. http://www.uprov-montco.org/andersonfarm.html
It’s pretty sweet. They built an ampitheater, too. Nice set up.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Whew, that was fast. Blink, and you’ll miss the presser.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Fast and boring.
My teams are the Flyers, Phillies and the Steelers. Deal with it.
by LegionofDoom on Jun 28, 2011 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Just about 5. Breaking News started at 1:03—I know, ‘cuz I checked and said, "You’re 3 minutes late!". Barkann had to introduce it all and that took a minute and then a minute to wrap it up. It ended at 1:10.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
ESPN
The Pittsburgh Penguins still have every intention of re-signing forward Tyler Kennedy. According to the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, that’s partly why the team didn’t make Kennedy a qualifying offer:
“The Penguins cut Tyler Kennedy loose Monday, but general manager Ray Shero said he wants to re-sign him before NHL free agency begins Friday …
… Kennedy, a right winger, became an unrestricted free agent after the Penguins chose not to tender him a qualifying offer by a 5 p.m. deadline (Monday). Shero said that decision was made to avoid an arbitration hearing.
‘We want clarity in this situation. By doing this we get the most clarity,’ Shero said. ‘An arbitration hearing can go into early August. We want to know what’s going on before then’ …"
Kennedy wants to re-sign with the Penguins. A deal between the 24-year-old forward and the club is expected by Friday.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 1:19 PM EDT reply actions
What about this roster?
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Steven Stamkos ($7.000m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m)
Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
Wayne Simmonds ($2.000m) / Kris Versteeg ($3.083m) / Andreas Nodl ($0.845m)
Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($1.500m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Tom Sestito ($0.577m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,268,928; BONUSES: $1,825,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $31,072
Doesn’t work.
a) You won’t get Voracek to sign for 1.5M
b) You didn’t leave any money for injury callups (need ~700k for that)
c) Even with this roster, I don’t think you’ll get Stamkos to sign for 7M; you certainly won’t get him for the ~5.5M that’s left when you address (a) and (b)
d) You don’t have a center for your third line. Who is facing the top competition?
e) You’ll never be able to call up Schenn — he’s exiled to the AHL forever, or until you blow up the team again next year when you can’t afford the raises for JvR, Carle, and Coburn.
It would cost more to pry Stamkos from Tampa than 7 mil because that’s what they’re offering him now and he hasn’t accepted. At least 1 Phantom too many. Voracek won’t sign that low. There’s no salary cap space for the inevitable injury call-up. Lastly, try to put the lines in a coherent order.
What can't Giroux do?
I was just seeing if it was even possible to put him on the roster without raising the cap $10,000,000
by phillies0100 on Jun 28, 2011 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
And now you know…it’s not.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Don, curb stomping dreams
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I’d be more patient, but there are several flaws, plus I’m just sick of the NHL 12 cover boy nonsense.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
Speaking of stomping dreams, I plan to stomp on many kids in that game with my suffocating trap defense
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah…I feel a little bad for being one of 18 people saying “no no no no”, but Stamkos really just doesn’t fit unless they trade away at least one and maybe two more major earners.
Hey sign me up for 2 or 3 years at $10mil and trade away Briere and Hartnell, I’ll even let Schenn eat up tough minutes and learn on the job…but yeah, that’s not happening.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
This would actually save money in the short term. Stamkos will get a lot, but he will not get the combined cap hits of Briere and Hartnell. Though unfortunately, there is no chance the Flyers will be able to trade/dump Briere’s contract.
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Yeah, hence why I said it won’t happen. Hartnell+Briere+Couturier+? for Stamkos? Maybe, I’m not sure. I don’t even want to play this game because it isn’t realistic. But if I wanted to get Stamkos here, that’s where I figure the Fyers would have to start.
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
This is one of the proposals that Geoff usually jumps all over as “incredibly overoptimistic” or to the degree of wearing his ‘I love Holmgren’ underoos around the stadium or some such nonsense.
Get’r’done!
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Even with the “that’s not happening” admission?
Without it, I would have said something.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 28, 2011 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
You usually tend to ignore my posting disclaimers like that, but I guess I get special (mis)treatment.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 28, 2011 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions
He also knows me personally, and we talked about the ridiculousness of the idea yesterday on the golf course…don’t feel too bad. Just be happy I let it slide ;)
Teaching Travis how to Dougie since 2011.
Geoff has Boosh, Mike's got Powe, Nodl is all mine!
This probably has a lot to do with it.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jun 29, 2011 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions
boo that man
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Update
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m)
Kris Versteeg ($3.083m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
Andreas Nodl ($0.845m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Ville Leino ($3.000m)
Jakub Voracek ($2.250m) / Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.800m)
Matt Read ($0.900m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) /
Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,751,428; BONUSES: $3,940,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $1,548,572
by phillies0100 on Jun 28, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
assuming VL signs for 3 million. If not, there’s tons of space to sign someone
by phillies0100 on Jun 28, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
and I’m missing a 6th D-man. Just fill in Bartilus, at $600,000
by phillies0100 on Jun 28, 2011 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
So are we done with the two-o’clock number? How about how much cap space would still need to be cleared in order to realistically sign Stamkos?
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 2:07 PM EDT reply actions
Basically, whatever you think Stamkos’ cap hit will be is how much space needs to be cleared.
What can't Giroux do?
Basically Hartnell + Schenn in the AHL for a full year, with another offseason of cap dumping next year. So no, this isn’t going to happen. Or at least it shouldn’t.
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Steven Stamkos ($7.400m)
Jakub Voracek ($2.000m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Kris Versteeg ($3.083m)
Andreas Nodl ($0.845m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.700m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.580m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,425,872; BONUSES: $3,940,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $874,128
Can’t really help myself at this point. Waive Leighton, Walker, and Shelley and trade Hartnell. I think you have to keep Schenn up to start the season. We’d be relying on three guys with virtually no NHL experience to contribute right away, plus next year’s cap situation would be a mess. But you’d only have to give up two firsts, a 2nd and a 3rd. Highly unlikely, but would you take this roster? Also, if a team like Toronto offered a higher cap hit of $10 million, would Stamkos be able to choose between that and a Flyers offer of a $7.4mil cap hit if the Lightning didn’t match either?
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 2:26 PM EDT reply actions
Also, if a team like Toronto offered a higher cap hit of $10 million, would Stamkos be able to choose between that and a Flyers offer of a $7.4mil cap hit if the Lightning didn’t match either?
I believe the way it works is the player signs a deal, then his original team can choose whether they want to match it. So first he has to pick which one he wants, then they get to decide whether they’ll match it.
You’re forgetting the key fact that the Flyers don’t own their second or third round picks for 2012 thus they can’t make an offer sheet for the compensation would include them. The only chance of getting him via offer sheet would be an offer in the highest bracket. Thus 4 consecutive first round picks would be gone.
What can't Giroux do?
If only they had traded Powe for a third rounder next year. Do they have to be their picks or can they be acquired picks?
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Have to be your picks. You can reacquire your own picks but you have to do it before you make the offer. Its what blocked Brian Burke from making the offer sheet he wanted to for Kessel. Thus he had to make that terrible trade.
What can't Giroux do?
Thus he had to make that terrible trade.
Ha, that’s probably what he thought too.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, so it needs to be 7.84M cap hit or more. And probably needs to be at least 8.5M or run until he’s 40 if you want them to even consider not matching it. And it probably needs to both be 9M+ and run until he’s 40 if you want a good chance at getting him.
in a salary cap era such as this, no player is worth that much money
severely handicaps the rest of your team
do you poop on parties professionally, or do you just do it as a hobby?
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jun 28, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep. Seeing that on top if the unlikelihood.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
HAHAHAHA let's hope Seravelli's sources are wrong
Just for jollies, here is a “realistic” roster. Guessing you won’t like it.
Hartnell and Shelley are waived. Lappy is on LTIR. Bob is in the AHL (does he have to be ut through re-entry waivers, I forget); maybe you can get Stamkos for a little less or put Schenn in the AHL instead. Not many other options. In fact, Voracek’s number might be low.
NOTE: Wellwood and Sestito both make it because the cap hits of other Phantoms (like Holstrom) would be higher.
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Kris Versteeg ($3.083m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
J Voracek ($2.000m) / steven stamkos ($9.500m) / Andreas Nodl ($0.845m)
t Sestito ($0.600m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Mike Testwuide ($0.900m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.580m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Wayne Simmonds ($2.000m)
/ Schenn B ($3.110m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / J Backlund ($0.900m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,281,428; BONUSES: $850,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $18,572
In preparation for NHL free agency, thinking of changing my screen name to Bhudde in 10OC.
So Stamkos gets more than Crosby and Ovechkin?
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
He beat them both in the playoffs, therefore he’s worth more.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
I don’t have the CBA in front of me, but the Flyers have a “floor” in which to offer players, since they don’t have the draft choices to offer less (it HAS to be for the top offer, with the cost being four #1s). I also expect Toronto and others to pursue Stamkos if available.
In preparation for NHL free agency, thinking of changing my screen name to Bhudde in 10OC.
OOPS
Eric T’s post above:
Yeah, so it needs to be 7.84M cap hit or more. And probably needs to be at least 8.5M or run until he’s 40 if you want them to even consider not matching it. And it probably needs to both be 9M+ and run until he’s 40 if you want a good chance at getting him.
Overall point that getting him creates dreck stands.
In preparation for NHL free agency, thinking of changing my screen name to Bhudde in 10OC.
why can’t the flyers trust their talent pool, give em a chance… or learn how to draft instead of paying the premium price in free agency. it’s like we have no patience developing super stars but all the attention in the world for thugs or 13 minutes per game wingers
learn how to draft instead of paying the premium price in free agency.
They’re pretty awesome first round drafters of forwards and they like to get their defensemen through trades and free agency because it takes longer for them to develop. Let other teams groom them and then snatch ’em up.
by mantis toboggan on Jun 28, 2011 3:03 PM EDT reply actions
Heh, you know what’s funny? I’m wearing a Richards jersey in that photo up there.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - Covering the Philadelphia Flyers. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
He was… for whatever reason, mine didn’t have a C on it and I never bothered to get one put on.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - Covering the Philadelphia Flyers. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on Jun 28, 2011 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
In case anyone hasn't noticed yet..
Epic new BSH tagline is epic.
“Broad Street Hockey – Covering the Philadelphia Flyers: Have you accepted Ilya Bryzgalov as your savior?”
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
Credit to CoburnsCuddleBuddy (I think).
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - Covering the Philadelphia Flyers. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on Jun 28, 2011 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Frannie won't let it go ...
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/frequentflyers/Stamkos-Procedure-rules-myths.html
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
Seravalli lists the adjusted number for the top bracket at “$7,533,584”. That is the number from the offseason prior to 2009-10. The 2011-12 number is as $7,835,219. I don’t know why he’s using two year old RFA compensation brackets.
There are other factual details there I have a problem with, but I should just stop now. It’ll get ugly if I keep going.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know why he’s using two year old RFA compensation brackets.
He was told there’d be no math.
Bob.
:)
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions
That line never gets old.
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jun 28, 2011 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
more importantly ...
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/frequentflyers/Holmgren-talks-highly-of-Schenn.html
But Homer makes no guarantee Schenn will be on the NHL squad next season, quite distinctly.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
I want bonus points for using the BFP...
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Steven Stamkos ($8.000m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m)
Kris Versteeg ($3.083m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
Andreas Nodl ($0.845m) / Eric Belanger ($2.000m) / Stefan Legein ($0.816m)
Ben Holmstrom ($0.750m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Tom Sestito ($0.550m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m) / Ian Laperriere ($1.166m)
DEFENSEMEN
Matt Carle ($3.437m) / Chris Pronger ($4.921m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.666m) / Niko Hovinen ($0.871m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,400,956; BONUSES: $3,356,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $899,044
Bob.
No Bob? :(
Zac Rinaldo? sivfrwusoimdfvuasoidufvamsoivudfm
Stefan Legein actually in the NHL? Somehow I doubt that.
Gus! Yay!
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jun 28, 2011 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Unless Bob’s bonus is “play all 82 games,” so that his cap hit drops to <$1m after 1 game, he’s really hard to fit on a roster with Stamkos. If you replace Legein with Wellwood and Gus with Tyler Hostetter, you can fit Bob in, and have $613,294 in cap space. I’ve already (somehow) moved Hartnell, and it’s still hard to fit Bob.
Rinaldo’s cheap. For a 13th forward, I was looking for cheap. Batshit insane is still a negative factor, but less of one.
Legein could be replaced by Harper, Pither, or Wellwood for a lower cap hit, but I’m not sure about any of them either.
I was debating between Gus and Bourdon. I went with Gus. It’s only a $25k difference.
Bob.
Baby Wellie over Legein, most likely.
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jun 28, 2011 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions
But BFP already said he’s not coming to North America next year…. Seriously, can’t you just save the 71K and use Backlund?
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jun 28, 2011 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions
BFP also sits well with Homer’s rebuild strategy of Best Available Player * Most Unusual Name
Mourning Gagne forever.
Wow. Simmonds – Gone. Voracek – gone. Hartnell – gone. So you basically traded Carter and Richards and 4 first round picks for Schenn and Stamkos. BIG LOSS.
Maybe it should read "reformedpenguinsfan" since I have retired my Lemeiux jersey ... and purchased an Orange and Black Pronger jersey.
by MaximumTalbot on Jun 29, 2011 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions
I’d like to inform everyone that the comments on the DGB article are pretty good too.
Mourning Gagne forever.
Hilarious. Although I’ve gotta say that if it was anywhere other than DGB, that comment from Mike was true. We had three centers who fit those labels. Now we still have one.
Simon Gagne may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, he will always be a Philadelphia Flyer.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jun 28, 2011 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Hahaha, seriously.
I just added one.
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jun 28, 2011 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Mayyyyyyyyyybe.
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jun 28, 2011 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Figured that was you.
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jun 28, 2011 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I love it when DGB’s subtlety gets lost on people.
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Bahaha, I asked Carchidi if he knew he looks like Mr. Feeny from Boy Meets World and Ned Flanders from the Simpsons.
(The abbreviations/no grammar parts are him trying to save characters)
"@ItsAFez66: @BroadStBull Hey Sam, u look like Mr. Feeny from Boy Meets World? And Ned Flanders from Simpsons? I’ve been called worse!
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
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