Monday Morning Fly By: Today Is Basically a Recap of Your Twitter Feed
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 6:00 AM EDT
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Today's open discussion thread, complete with your daily dose of Philadelphia Flyers news and notes...
- Sean Couturier played a preseason game, registering five shots and a 69% faceoff rating: [potnoodlez]
- Joonas Lehtivuori had an assist in a 2-4 loss to Niko Hovinen's team: [euroflyers] [Highlights]
- Jakub Kovar stopped all 18 shots in a 4-0 win: [euroflyers]
- After stopping 24 of 25 in a 2-1 win: [euroflyers]
- Niko Hovinen won in a shoot out: [euroflyers] [Highlights]
- Listing those players you never expected to see on the Flyers, but who wound up here anyway: [HockeyBuzz.com]
- A spreadsheet of every NHL game for 2011-12 that includes goals for and goals against per game information for each team: [On the Forecheck]
- Looking at how the NHL coaching landscape has changed over the last ten years: [Puck Daddy]
- Predicting the results of their own re-draft from last week: [NHL.com]
- Reviewing the NHL 12 demo: [Flyers Faithful]
- Presenting shot type and shot target data, looking for suggestions on what to do with it: [Arctic Ice Hockey]
- Looking at marginal cap efficiency for last year, where Paul Holmgren was above-average: [The Copper & Blue]
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For some reason, this post shows up in the archive, but not on the front page. I blame Irene.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Geoff wants his last article to have top billing for a little longer since Irene may have stolen some of it’s thunder. So blame Geoff’s ego here.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
The new more " in depth" look posted above the FlyBy sure doesn’t help.
Assistant Masthead Power Person on Down Goes Spezza as ItsAFez66
I'm the Pronger. DUH, WINNING.
Chem and Gus to the restaurant.
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun
Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Aug 29, 2011 11:59 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
What can I say Don, I just have to keep twisting the stats to prove I’m right.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Her name is Bernadette by the way. Bernie is only what her most familiar of friends call her.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
For the record, I came up with the answer about 4 minutes later. The old “clear your head, it will come to you” method.
The things Erin texts you…
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I was at dinner with Jenn and her parents for her BDay. Since I was a bit under the weather, I was DDing, and they were all feeling it at that point of the night, so I decided to check my phone; that text was the sole reason i perked up and survived the night. Erin is a savior.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
How long do you think we’ll be able to stretch out the ‘blame Irene’ excuse? Until everybody has power, until the flood water recede, or until everybody is back at work afterward?
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s already worn out to me. Took 5 minutes at work for that to happen.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
My grandfather’s neighborhood n South Jersey is still under water, and I had to call out of work today instead of going in late, so I figure I should get at least one more day. Lots of people here still don’t have power, I was really lucky to get mine back so fast.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s a bit different where we are, most people have power, and there is very little flooding. People in NJ I give the benefit to because they have to have some of the worst water drainage in the US; I’ve been stuck there from just normal storms.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
I got off lucky. I know plenty of people still without power, but mine only went out briefly sometime Saturday night. I only know this because the clocks on my stove and microwave were reset. No flooding near me either, just a lot of leaves and small branches down, and my grass is growing exponentially from all the rain we’ve gotten this month.
So I’m back at work and already had a meeting this morning that has impacted me much worse than the storm did. This week is gonna suck.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Not all of NJ has poor water drainage, but certain areas do flood a lot, like the Admiral Wilson Blvd floods during light rain sometimes. There is flooding between where I live and where my job is, but not flooding in my immediate area. I just got a nasty migraine from all the storm noise; several hours of banging branches, howling wind, sirens outside, etc, is not exactly a great situation for a migraineur.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Till I get my power back. I went to my first day of school, which was almost cancelled, with my power still out. Such fun
Following Dan Carcillo where ever he may go
Giving up isn't an option
by Cillo stache on Aug 29, 2011 3:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Time to preorder NHL 12 today
I eat sentimentality for breakfast, but stats stop me dead in my tracks
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Aug 29, 2011 9:25 AM EDT reply actions
Is Kovar going to be in net for every minute of this season as well?
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
@boknows71
Days when Driving Play doesn’t have a new post tend to be slow.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
On that note:
Next up from me: Devils vs. Flyers playoff results from 1995-2011, Martin Brodeur vs. The Cast of Thousands – Has Brodeur really been the difference?
This is probably make me sad.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Bull, the winners get the worm…. I worked hard to get in the top 10 in the #2 league.
My son was born in Ottawa (Go Senators!) to a Father (Go Flyers!) and a Mother (Go Canucks!) who's families root for two different hockey teams (Go Habs!)(Go Bruins!) Little Maxwell is going to have such a confusing life.
Winners are punctual. The winner of the tardies bracket is hardly a winner.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
This should be taken as tongue and cheek. Slow day.
Also, it’s hard to argue top 10 in the 2nd bracket necessitates any sort of promotion to the “big league”, and deserved the snarkiest of responses. I would assume it’ll be first come first serve once again, with reserved spots for the masthead.
Though, with the growing size of BSH, at least active commenters, it would be fun to have promotions/relegations every year in maybe a 3 league system.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
someone’s been watching too much Premier League
playing in the scrub fantasy league wasn’t fun last year, and my interests suffered
I eat sentimentality for breakfast, but stats stop me dead in my tracks
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Aug 29, 2011 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions
That and I’m pretty sure that was the idea floated around with the 2 leagues, that they would do a “Champions” league this year top 10 from each of the 2 leagues from last year then first come first serve for 2nd/(possibly 3rd league)
My son was born in Ottawa (Go Senators!) to a Father (Go Flyers!) and a Mother (Go Canucks!) who's families root for two different hockey teams (Go Habs!)(Go Bruins!) Little Maxwell is going to have such a confusing life.
Promotions/relegations might keep people more interested. I also hate the EPL FWIW. The “big league” wasn’t particularly interesting either. A lot of people missed the draft (me included), and there were a lot of people who didn’t care (or couldn’t access their team in one particular case). Luckily there was Geoff’s constant wheeling and dealing to keep things interesting (1st was extremely far ahead, there was a tight battle for 2nd/3rd and then 4th and 5th). Basically if you interest suffered in the other league, they would have suffered in ours; maybe you just don’t have what it takes.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
I can say that I certainly don’t have what it takes. I didn’t care after about October 15 last year.
Visit the BSH Store :: Get us on Twitter :: facebook, too!
Broad Street Hockey - Covering the Philadelphia Flyers. Got goaltending? Searching since 1987.
by Travis Hughes on Aug 29, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
kicking your ass Don would keep me interested throughout the whole year
and if I do lose interest, you can bust my balls for a whole year
I eat sentimentality for breakfast, but stats stop me dead in my tracks
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Aug 29, 2011 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I know how many people frequent the site and I’m not always able to check it everyday, so I was hoping by winning the league maybe I’d be guaranteed a place in the top one. But no matter, I’ll take what I can get!
I think people falsely assume the top league was some uber competitive league where everyone was really in to it. It wasn’t. I’m willing to bet both leagues were fairly similar and you didn’t miss out on much.
I don’t remember the deal, but I’m sure Travis could easily promote the top 5 or 10/relegate the bottom 5 or 10 for this year. Though i feel DG should get a pass since she couldn’t access her team at all.
You sir are a gentleman of four outs!
http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2010/8/26/1652702/2010-11-bsh-fantasy-hockey-details
Yeah it was top 5.
It was my first fantasy league for Hockey so I was pretty into it in league 2, had no idea what I was doing and mostly got my main points catching lightening on people like Fowler, Ranger’s Staal, and Jeff “Are you Fu-” Skinner.
My son was born in Ottawa (Go Senators!) to a Father (Go Flyers!) and a Mother (Go Canucks!) who's families root for two different hockey teams (Go Habs!)(Go Bruins!) Little Maxwell is going to have such a confusing life.
You get those people on the waiver wire?
That’s how you win at fantasy: Win the wire.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m surprised you remembered.
For those that didn’t get the reference, Yahoo randomly locked me out of it and I couldn’t access that part of the page for a while. By the time the glitch went away, the season was more than half over.
But if it’s really important to somebody else, I’d be alright with being relegated. Yahoo’s auto-draft for me was so bad that I didn’t have a prayer even if I could access it. If this is going to turn into a performance-based Champions league thing, I’m not ultra-competitive enough to take the spot from somebody who is.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I just like playing against people that know hockey. I didn’t even remotly understand the point system so I limped through the season without anything better than a 3rd line center and found ways to make up points by grabbing wings good on the draw from waivers.
And Geoff, I actually drafted Staal and picked the other two up very early season, Skinner I saw play early and I liked his play, and Fowler I admit I grabbed because he has an ironic name.
My son was born in Ottawa (Go Senators!) to a Father (Go Flyers!) and a Mother (Go Canucks!) who's families root for two different hockey teams (Go Habs!)(Go Bruins!) Little Maxwell is going to have such a confusing life.
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/frequentflyers/Ovechkin-Bryz-to-Philly-is-not-very-nice.html
Y’all got a shout-out from Frannie Seravalli.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/frequentflyers/Ovechkin-Bryz-to-Philly-is-not-very-nice.html
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Aug 29, 2011 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Holy shit, how does philly.com still have autoplay?
It should be pointed out that Frank giving you credit for incorrect numbers: I believe he thought the chart showing each goalie’s 2010-11 ESS% was actually showing their career numbers.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
OT
My son had his first day of school (kindergarten) today. This am business has me dragging ass today.
My town was seriously flooded yesterday from the ‘cane, but was all cleaned up by this morning. We never lost power, although I’m sure many families did. You go, Upper Providence Twp!
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Montgomery.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Yeah. Perkiomen Creek floods everytime there is serious rainfall.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
yeah it does, that creek is no joke. I also drowned in it when I was 17.
http://restorations.bandcamp.com/
Almost drowned, I assume. Unless I’m writing to the ghost of Val_d’Or.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
I was pronounced dead, came back to life in the ambulance. It was my own fault. There’s a rope swing up by spring mountain and I went up without eating all day then you had to swim across the “creek” (which is really a river let’s be honest). I got within 5 feet from the bank and went under. My best friend was just in front of me and grabbed me out and called 911. I’ve been pronounced dead 4 times already, I’m like a cat.
http://restorations.bandcamp.com/
Selena Kyle’s lesser known twin brother.
Yeah, it’s hardly a creek. It’s friggin huge. Also, how many times has that hotel flooded? 50? More? It was underwater again yesterday, as was the Ford dealership, the kitchen place and the Hess station.
Rte 29 and 113 was also a nightmare. Water was up to the guardrails.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
I have no idea why they start school this week only to have off for a few days next week with Labor Day. w/e
A loose tooth already?!? I didn’t realize it started so soon. Not looking forward to that.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
He banged his tooth in a fall a while back and suffered a little damage that might be causing some premature loosening, but it’s definitely wiggleable.
I figured the pre-Labor Day start was so you could get the orientations and supply-buying and teacher-meeting stuff out of the way before the holiday and start for real afterwards.
I guess so, but it’s only kindergarten. Not like there’s a lot of prep work involved there, but w/e. This is going to be a tough year with half-day of school and then home with me all. day. long while I try to work (and blog! lol). I got him a DS, but he keeps bringing the Lego Batman game up to me to “help him” get to the next level when he gets stuck. Honestly, I am worse at video games than your average 1st grader. I just have absolutely no tolerance or interest in them.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Yeah, but at least at our school, the fourth graders start the same day as the kindergarteners. And I could see where you want the older kids to remember what’s what and get out of the summer routine and into the school routine.
But yeah, the short days are rough. We’re signed up for an after-school program partly for that reason.
another new link.
http://eye-on-hockey.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/27694626/31569138
Adam Gretz of CBS sports giving props to Blair Betts … and Darroll Powe … and MAXIME TALBOT. (Thank you for calling.)
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
So we’re paying Talbot 1.75 per over 5 years to be Darroll Powe (minimal ES time at poor-to-mediocre performance in order to benefit from SH time)? We could have paid Powe 1.06 per over 3 years, and he would have done a better job.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Personally, I wanted to keep Powe.
"Fly Eagles fly..."
by 92-74-99-96 on Aug 29, 2011 4:37 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I was definitely okay with getting a third rounder; I’m not sure we need anyone else to play that role if we have Betts running the first unit and roster players capable of filling in on rotation. But I don’t get unloading someone only to seek out a more expensive option. Like Derek F said, now that third rounder is weighed against the difference in contract, and it doesn’t look quite as shiny.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Yeah, but, but, but, Talbot fights!
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Seven fights over the last three seasons, a 1-6 record. Powe has four fights over that span and a 2-1-1 record.
Just sayin’…
He got the shit kicked out of him by Carcillo; that hardly qualifies as fighting ability.
(I know we’re in agreement on this, I’m just pointing out that Talbot doesn’t really fight more often than most roster players—much less than someone like Richie—and when he does, he isn’t very good. Or, in other words, what Eric said.)
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Yeah, I know.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I was stating it for general consumption. I know you don’t stammer when you bring the thunder.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
haha, that was a response to “I know you know we’re in agreement.”
Though looking back, I see that it could easily come off as condescending. Not my intention at all. So, sorry. We absolutely agree.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Aug 29, 2011 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I am in the camp that wanted to keep Powe; but would it really have been asking too much to have that pick be for next year instead of 2013?
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I found the 2013 part a little strange myself.
"Fly Eagles fly..."
by 92-74-99-96 on Aug 29, 2011 6:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Also, values that can’t be measured in money! Like the angst of penguins fans, and inside info on Sidney Crosby! And french tweets!
Pissing off Pens fans is a sweet bonus. Haha…
"Fly Eagles fly..."
by 92-74-99-96 on Aug 29, 2011 6:47 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
To be 100% honest … I wanted to keep Powe too. Talbot makes a nice replacement though. Hopefully he’ll continue to upgrade his game in Philly, with more agitation, more (clean) hits, and good PK time.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Aug 30, 2011 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t really say that noting which players spend the largest fraction of their ice time on the PK is giving props to them — it doesn’t necessarily mean they’re doing anything particularly well.
Also, nobody here is saying that Talbot can’t play any role. It’s about cost. Here are the contracts for the people on that list:
Betts: 2 yr, 0.700 M/yr
Marchant: 2 yr, 1.125 M/yr
Powe: 3 yr, 1.067 M/yr
Fraser: 2 yr, 0.825 M/yr
Adams: 2 yr, 0.675 M/yr
Helm: 2 yr, 0.913 M/yr
Eaves: 3 yr, 1.200 M/yr
Reddox: 1 yr, 0.550 M/yr
Korpikoski: 2 yr, 1.800 M/yr
Talbot: 5 yr, 1.750 M/yr
Korpikoski is the only one even close to Talbot’s paycheck, and he signed that deal after a breakout 19 G, 40 point season. Snevik beat me to it, but the point is that 1.75M is way too much for a PK specialist, so you shouldn’t be bragging that Talbot made it into that list.
by Eric T. on Aug 29, 2011 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The way I read it, the author kind of gave props to Betts in the article, where he elaborated a little on the success Betts has had in the role, but he didn’t actually give props to any of the other people in the list. I felt he just used them for comparison purposes based on ice time, rather than specifically implying they were actually good at the role that Betts plays.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, that’s how I read it too — the chart was just to emphasize how uniquely a part of his role PK is, while praising him for those PK units always being among the league’s best. But I read penguinsfan’s comment as suggesting that Powe and Talbot and the others on the list were being given props for something.
That’s the way I saw penguinsfan’s comment to, so I agree with you.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Penguinsfan’s comment has produced the longest thread of “I agree with you” “I agree with you too” comments I’ve seen in a while.
It was only a matter of time until those came back, anyway.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Aug 29, 2011 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I have that effect on people. They come to a consensus … in order to disagree with me. :)
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Aug 30, 2011 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions
BUT … Talbot doesn’t just play on the PK. I would say that his on-ice contribution is adequate as a fourth-liner or marginal thrid-liner. I know – his faceoffs aren’t as good as Betts. Personally, I feel Betts is seriously underrated and underpaid. Powe was a good PK guy, who made tons of clean hits and played well at protecting the puck in the offensive zone. He had no ‘agitation’ beyond his hitting, and virtually no scoring potential though.
And reading into the list a bit – coaches don’t put ineffective penalty-killers out for that much ice time. Making the top shorthanded ice time list reflects (indirectly, admittedly) ability to some degree at least.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Aug 30, 2011 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s been shown many, many times that Talbot isn’t a very good ES player. He brings down the play of his linemates, no matter who they are. He starts in the offensive zone a lot and ends up in the defensive zone (even relative to people who are used in similar ways). I don’t know if Talbot was used exclusively on the fourth line in Pittsburgh last year, but I know Powe was here, and the posted similar numbers (Talbot: .37 G/60, 1.12 P/60, 8G, 21 P; Powe .33 G/60, 1.07 P/60, 7G, 17 P). In 2009-10—when neither played a full season, admittedly—the numbers were dramatically in Powe’s favor: .81G/60 and 1.34 P/60 for 9G and 15P v. .27G/60 and .95 P/60 for 2G and 7P. Regardless, Talbot doesn’t have more scoring potential than Powe, because they both aren’t very good at scoring.
What value is agitation if not in drawing penalties without taking them? Last year, Talbot drew 1.0 penalties/60 (of 5v5 play) while taking 0.7 per 60. That’s better than Powe’s -0.3 per 60 differential, but worse than Nodl’s +0.5 per 60, equal to Versteeg and Zherdev’s +0.3, and dwarfed by Giroux’s +1.1 (that’s coming back to earth next year; it’s a better differential than Crosby). What’s more, agitation is a two-edged sword. After Carcillo drew 3.0 per 60 in 2009 (with a 1.8 differential!), it was halved to 1.5 this year, with a slight bump in penalties taken, to boot (-0.1 differential, overall). Outside of skill players, very few players hold large positive differentials from year to year.
I don’t hate Talbot. I don’t mind having this conversation with you; I mind having to repeat this conversation ad infinitum. And at this point, it seems like you have resorted to making things up, which is a waste of everyone’s time.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
by Snevik on Aug 30, 2011 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Last year, Talbot drew 1.0 penalties/60 (of 5v5 play) while taking 0.7 per 60. […] Outside of skill players, very few players hold large positive differentials from year to year.
Put another way, while he was +0.3 penalties per 60 last year, he was -0.4 in the previous year and negative every year except for last.
Fair enough that you don’t want to repeat yourself. And you do make good arguments, backed up with numbers.
That said, I contend that Talbot is being paid based on potential. It seemed that his linemates in Pittsburgh were inconsistent, and when paired with the fourth line his companions were far worse than the equivalent roster players here – you would assume his numbers will get better in Philly. Pure speculation, I admit. And Jared stated that WOWY is rough to use on Pittsburgh because of the extreme disparity in skill levels between players – it’s better when the players in question are of similar skill sets, and Talbot really had no peers in Pittsburgh. If there was a way to apply WOWY-like evaluation between Powe and Talbot, you may get somewhere.
I don’t know what I’ve ‘made up’ though – the post you replied to was pretty concise and equivocal, not definitive or misleading. I guess (as I mentioned to Geoff) I need to take the time to formalize my argument in a fanpost (which because of my username few will read).
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Aug 31, 2011 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
WOWY is rough for the Penguins, but the evidence all points one way:
[E]very group was worse off with him on the ice. Most troubling is that this includes the fourth line. It appears that he performed worse 5-on-5 than the average Pittsburgh fourth liner over the last three seasons.
You differentiated between Powe and Talbot by a) agitation, and b) scoring. The numbers don’t really show a difference, however. That distinction is made up. Further, faith in potential surfacing at Talbot’s age tends to fly in the face of scoring and possession evidence. It would be pretty shocking if he has more than one more peak performance year left in him, and his peak performance has never been that great to begin with.
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
by Snevik on Aug 31, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
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