Max Talbot elbowed in head by smirking Steve Staios

by Travis Hughes on Jan 13, 2012 12:15 AM EST in Philadelphia Flyers News

You know, when this happened live, I wasn't exactly sure if it was a hit to the head. It only took one replay for me to realize how blatant a Rule 48 violation this was though.

Steve Staios elbowed Max Talbot right in the face in the third period of tonight's Flyers vs. Islanders game at The Dump (not the furniture store), and on the bench afterwards, you can clearly notice a smirk on the face of the 38-year-old. It's not a toothy smile or anything, but there's definitely something there.We'll wait while you look for it on the video.

Check the 1:45 mark. He looks about 60 years old, not 38, so we understand if you missed it.

There was no penalty on the play, and Peter Laviolette told the media after the game that the referees said they weren't sure if the head was the principal point of contact. We'll let that slide; officials miss things in live action. What we can't let slide is a lack of suspension, and it will be utter BS if Brendan Shanahan doesn't do something about this hit.

We suspect he will -- after all, it's textbook Rule 48, and elbow right to the noggin. It shouldn't be this difficult to get this stuff out of the game, but, well, maybe NHL players need a lesson they can comprehend. All this "principal point of contact" stuff can be pretty confusing, after all.

Hitting-lesson_medium

Someday, they will learn.

In the meantime, Talbot did indeed finish the game, but the team almost certainly didn't comply with NHL concussion protocol following the hit. Talbot likely said he was fine so they let him finish out the game, and he actually had an assist on Sean Couturier's game-winning goal a few minutes later.

But when a player is hit in the head, regardless of what they say, the team is supposed to send them back to the quiet room. It's mandatory, mostly to protect players from themselves. Of course Talbot doesn't want to come out of a close game late in the third period. Of course he's going to say he's fine. Who knows if he really is, though?

Anthony SanFilippo of the Delco Times said that Talbot didn't look great during his session with reporters after the game. Luckily for us, he took video of that exchange and posted it on this nifty thing called the Internet, so we can all judge for ourselves. What do you think?

Let's hope Talbot is okay. He's been extremely valuable to the Flyers defensive game so far this season, and losing him would absolutely suck, especially if it's to a scary head injury.

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Comments

I just posted this in the other thread, but while I get that the refs might miss the hit, it makes me very unhappy that they took so long to blow the whistle. Also, I posted in the game thread that I would have strongly preferred Talbot to be checked out in the locker room, especially since it was so late in the game, and several BSHers agreed with this.

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by Bud in TN on Jan 13, 2012 12:25 AM EST reply actions

I agree with the “get thee to the quite room” call, but I don’t see a whole lot in the video that makes me think he’s screwy, but I don’t always watch a lot of the interviews.

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by JerseyDriver on Jan 13, 2012 12:30 AM EST up reply actions

Also, he’s a little weird to begin with, so hard for me to tell.

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by doubleh on Jan 13, 2012 1:57 AM EST up reply actions

I’m not shocked. Remember this bullshit?

Warning: Thoresen. May be painful for any males.

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by Chemistry66 on Jan 13, 2012 12:34 AM EST up reply actions

God that made me so angry to watch. The idiot commentator talking about how that’s “pain not peril” gets suddenly quiet as Thoreson can’t get off the ice on his own power.

On the bright side, the obnoxious goal celebration isn’t so obnoxious anymore knowing how that series eventually ended…

by Woowooo on Jan 13, 2012 12:58 AM EST up reply actions

Living there was awful, and their sports fans only made it worse. I’d rank it behind only NY and my least favorite places on Earth.

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by Ed Van Chimp on Jan 13, 2012 1:04 AM EST up reply actions

speaking of him

hes been a point per game player in the khl since he left

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MICHAEL!

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by reaper1221 on Jan 13, 2012 2:45 AM EST up reply actions

Oh Chem, you’re just the worst for this.

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by Snevik on Jan 13, 2012 11:32 AM EST up reply actions

It’s the rules. The refs couldn’t blow the play dead until the Flyers had possession. I fucking hate that rule. I don’t believe the Flyers had it until the whistle blew. Could be wrong, video won’t play for me right now.

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by KreiderDesigns on Jan 13, 2012 8:28 AM EST up reply actions

The flyers cleared the zone pretty fast afterwards, then an Islander picked up in his own zone and he skated into neutral ice with it before they blew it.

by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 10:41 AM EST up reply actions

Yeah, after I got to watch the video again I learned my memory failed me.

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by KreiderDesigns on Jan 13, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions

I can understand them not blowing the whistle if the Islanders had the puck in the offensive zone, but they had it all the way back in their defensive zone. Blowing the whistle would not have affected the play of the game.

by TommykUD on Jan 13, 2012 8:31 AM EST up reply actions

Was at the game

These pics probably don’t add much, but here’s Lavy talking to the ref (it was really amazing to watch, didn’t have to raise his voice to get his point across.):

Here’s Max sitting on the bench right after the hit:

by youaretheman26 on Jan 13, 2012 1:01 AM EST reply actions

so what you're trying to say is

your seats really sucked, huh?

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by HankMonahan on Jan 13, 2012 2:16 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs

may as well have taken a seat next to jvr

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MICHAEL!

Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.

by reaper1221 on Jan 13, 2012 2:42 AM EST up reply actions

I’m really missing the reason why professional hockey players can’t keep their fucking elbows in. Mites hit cleaner than today’s professionals.

Subban would have had a clean, pretty hit, but opens up and extends after the impact on Krecji’s face.

Staios did exactly the same thing. If he keeps his elbows in and makes contact, the play is clean.

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by dinkster on Jan 13, 2012 2:08 AM EST reply actions

Jesus christ!?

just saw that picture of the skater… is that michael jackson in hockey gear?

Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!

Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.

by reaper1221 on Jan 13, 2012 2:46 AM EST reply actions

i’m cursed with having center ice so i only get the other teams broadcast. their commentators were saying the hit was clean and it was an elbow to the chest. i laugh at 90% of the commentators and their lack of knowledge of the game and always dressing their teams bad plays and penalties as there’s nothing wrong.

by hbcivicsi93 on Jan 13, 2012 3:02 AM EST reply actions

Sooner or later somebody has to be made an example of in regards to blatant head shots like this. And yes I’d be saying this if one of the Flyers made that hit. There’s no place in this league for scumbag hits like that.

by Kanayd on Jan 13, 2012 3:43 AM EST reply actions

From an islander fan perspective, I think you're spouting BS, no disrespect, if you say there is a conclusive elbow to head contact point shown in that video.

I’ve watched the replay about 100 times, no joke, slow motion pausing zooming everything, and I’ve come up with the primary contact point being a forearm shiver to Talbot’s chest. "Maybe" there is elbow contact to Talbot’s head, but it’s in no way conclusive. I looked for the head contact over and over and none of the angles show direct conclusive head contact. And apparently Talbot had no concussion since he finished the game playing and never went for a concussion test off ice. Expect no suspension. Possibly a borderline hit, given inconclusiveness, but in no way suspension worthy given inconclusiveness.

Not to “accuse” Talbot of acting, but he’s acted many clean hits as dirty ones many a time in his career (as I’m sure you’ve seen when he played on the pens). So this could be one of those scenarios. Talbot ain’t clean himself and is a dirty hockey player. He doesn’t do it all the time, but he should be one of the last people talking about clean play and I could pull up a handful of youtube clips that agree with me. I think some of Cooke rubbed off on him when he was playing with the Pens.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 4:37 AM EST reply actions

In the video above, go to 1.26, watch Talbots head, it goes backwards like he has been hit in the head.
I dont care if he got concussed or not, if its an elbow he needs a suspension because else players will keep doing stupid stuff like this because they will only get punished if they injury someone.

by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 4:42 AM EST up reply actions

Full disclosure

I’m an Isles fan, but I’m not necessarily biased here; if Staios is suspended, the league would be doing us a favor-he’s terrible.

That said, I really don’t see any evidence of his elbow hitting Talbot’s head. I think his head is driven back by the force of the hit to his upper body. If you watch the angle at around 47 seconds, you can clearly see Staios’s arm is down, and doesn’t come up until after the hit is over. It’s a little hard to see because of our terrible jerseys, but if you go frame by frame you can see that’s the case.

Now, there is a chance that his shoulder did make contact with the head-again it’s hard to see because of the jerseys. But even this is more of a guess because there is no frame you can point to and say-there: shoulder to head. Without that, the idea he hit him in the head is all inference, which seems a dicey way to suspend a player.

Either way, good game last night, and I understand the response-it looked questionable at full speed. And really it is questionable, but I don’t see any clear evidence it was dirty.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 8:35 AM EST up reply actions

Watch

Thats an elbow to the head

by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 10:47 AM EST up reply actions

That's the problem with this

We’re examining a grainy photo taken hundreds of feet from the incident. There is no way to make a definitive statement based on that.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs

____________

I actually agree with you that I can’t see anything where I can directly see contact with the head. However, it is clear that his head snaps back pretty forcefully upon contact:

Your explanation for that is:

I think his head is driven back by the force of the hit to his upper body.

I don’t see how that makes sense. If you’re moving forwards and someone rams your chest, your head snaps forwards. For the head to move backwards faster than the rest of his upper body, I think there has to be impact with the head.

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Writer at Broad Street Hockey

by Eric T. on Jan 13, 2012 10:57 AM EST up reply actions

With that being said, I dunno whether you legislate based on this kind of inference. I’m pretty sure he hit him in the head, but I dunno if pretty sure is good enough.

@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey

by Eric T. on Jan 13, 2012 10:58 AM EST up reply actions

Agreed. If Shanahan is using this season to let us all know what the world is going to look like, coming down hard on this one says that we’re heading to a place where a hit simply cannot result in contact to the head or you’ll be punished, no matter what you intended or what the other player did to contribute to the result or any other context.

/s, more often than not

by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 13, 2012 11:03 AM EST up reply actions

Warning! Danger! Laws of physics and use of reason and empirical observation on display here. True fans shield your eyes!!

/s, more often than not

by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 13, 2012 10:59 AM EST up reply actions

I don't know

I’m looking at those (and they are the ones I based my original opinion on), and in the first and second one you can see that his arm is at chest level (in the first one his glove is blocking most of the Flyer logo). In the third one his elbow has reached head level, but Talbot’s head is already a good foot away. There is no contact between elbow and head in the third one.

Like I said, there is a chance in those first and second photos that his shoulder is making contact with his head, but that is unclear.

If you’re moving forwards and someone rams your chest, your head snaps forwards.

True, but Talbot wasn’t really moving forward- he had just turned and started a stride. Still murky to me.

Realistically this video isn’t going to prove something, and like you say below, can you really Shannaban on pretty sure?

I’ll say this, the refs probably missed a charging call on the play. He’s so slow it had to have taken him 50 feet to reach that speed. But they missed a lot last night.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions

Yeah, I agree that his arm came up during or after the hit, and his elbow didn’t hit the head (it just looked elbowy because of the way the arm flailed around after contact).

I just don’t see how his head snaps back like that if the contact is in the chest. In the first image, his head is in front of his body. In the second, it’s even, and in the third, it’s snapping back.

It doesn’t sound like we’re in big disagreement though. Just a matter of degree between “a chance…but unclear” and “pretty sure”. And I just don’t know how clear a video Shanahan needs; has there been a case like this so far this year?

@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey

by Eric T. on Jan 13, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions

I just don’t see how his head snaps back like that if the contact is in the chest. In the first image, his head is in front of his body.

Right-something happened. I do think the force of being hit in the shoulder could do it. I think Staios’s shoulder could have hit his head. I also think (in part because it was Talbot and I think he’s a baby and a phony-bias disclosed) it’s possible that Talbot could have thrown his head back. Shoulder to head is the most likely explanation, but as Dom pointed out over at LHH, this his actually has quite a bit in common with what was outlined specifically by the NHL as a legal hit to the head, featuring Chris Pronger.

Be interesting to see what happens. I bet there is a good chance we get a video explanation either way because it’s such an in between play.

by afrosupreme on Jan 13, 2012 12:14 PM EST up reply actions

In that video, the player’s body moves back and then his head whips afterwards, and it’s clear that the contact was not with the body. That’s what happens when shoulder impact causes whiplash — the head goes forwards first and then snaps back.

In this one, the head goes back right from the very instant of contact. If you are going to say Talbot threw his head back on purpose, you’re going to have to suggest that he saw the hit coming and decided ahead of time to snap his head back as he got hit, because there’s no reaction time at all — the head-snap follows instantaneously after contact.

Anyway, as I said, I think we’re mostly in agreement — we both say shoulder to head is the most likely explanation but that we can’t directly see it and therefore can’t say for sure. The rest is just tone.

@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey

by Eric T. on Jan 13, 2012 12:23 PM EST up reply actions

That's completely fair. Thanks for having a level head on your shoulders Eric.

I can see a shoulder(even an elbow with a weird angled arm) “possibly” as I said, but conclusively, no. But the answer could definitely be whiplash, check this hit against us last year. It was shoulder to shoulder contact, but it whiplashed comeau’s head and gave him a concussion:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_Wxm6hw8MA

It certainly is possible that there was no head contact, but it’s also possible that there was head contact, just no conlcusive evidence.

What do you mean they won 4 cups in a row? Is that possible?

by OzzyFan on Jan 13, 2012 8:21 PM EST up reply actions

Exactly.
“Back, and to the left….back, and to the left…”

by mtitanic on Jan 13, 2012 1:15 PM EST up reply actions

If he didn’t hit him in the head, why does the guy grab his head the second he hits the ice? The guy couldn’t even get off the ice right away. You don’t have that reaction to a hit when you’re hit in the chest, even if you’re embellishing. You don’t embellish for 12 full seconds in the middle of the third period in a one-goal game.

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by Travis Hughes on Jan 13, 2012 5:47 AM EST up reply actions

If he didn’t hit him in the head, why does the guy grab his head the second he hits the ice?

There are huge “whiplash” effects on hits at that speed. (One of the fastest I’ve seen this year…particularly out of Staios). Even when you make contact with a guys chest, the head will whip forward and make contact with a shoulder or helmet and then snap back.

I’m not saying that’s exactly what happened here, because again, I’ve watched a few different replays and honestly can’t say conclusively. They’re all far away and bad. It looks bad and the elbow does come up, but that could be after contact.

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by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 8:43 AM EST up reply actions

I also believe what will get Staios the games will be the hunting aspect of the hit and going up to hit. I’m a flyers fan and I can’t conclusively say elbow to the head but Staios easily could have lowered his shoulder instead of rising to finish the check.

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DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.

by MJDII on Jan 13, 2012 9:02 AM EST up reply actions

If you'd seen Steve Staios play lately

you’d know that this is unpossible! Kidding, but not really. I hear what you’re saying. I was actually surprised it was him though…he really doesn’t hit like that very much. I was fully expecting that to be Hamonic or Jurcina.

I was very surprised he was on him that quick, so it may have been “predatory”.

I do dislike me some Talbot, and as you indicated below, yes, most Islander fans believe him to be a bit of a predator/turtle, so this is one that most Isles fans will disagree on. I just wish there was some better video out there.

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by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 9:50 AM EST up reply actions

Trust me I have been cheering the guy with my nose pinched. He has been a beast and the old if he was on your team applies. Better video for conclusive evidence of the actual location would be for suspension reasons only. I am pretty definite on the predator on the unsuspecting recipient part. An history doesn’t define the the player.

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DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.

by MJDII on Jan 13, 2012 9:58 AM EST up reply actions

I just posted a link above and its pretty clear its an elbow to Talbots head.

by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 10:48 AM EST up reply actions

That's pretty far away, but I think you're almost looking at a physical impossibility

of that being an elbow. In the three picture sequence someone posted above, look at how close together their heads are. There would have to be far more spacing between the two of them in order for an elbow to be extended (at the head) at the time of impact.

If I’m standing sideways with my shoulder raised and elbow out at someone’s head level, the point of my elbow extends a good foot away from my body and it

Like I said, I think it still could be considered a headshot, but with a shoulder, not an elbow.

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by Keith Quinn on Jan 13, 2012 2:35 PM EST up reply actions

Their heads are only close when looking from that angle. Perspective is a bitch.

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by hintzy64 on Jan 13, 2012 3:33 PM EST up reply actions

As hintzy64 said, perspective is tough bitch, Erics pics above is from an angle behind so you cant determine space, where my pic is from the side. All evidence points towards it been a head shot with some kind of forearm involved.

by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 3:51 PM EST up reply actions

See, back and to the left….back and to the left.

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DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.

by MJDII on Jan 13, 2012 7:07 AM EST up reply actions

Oops. Sorry.

by mtitanic on Jan 13, 2012 1:19 PM EST up reply actions

You’ve watched that replay 100 times? So you’re saying you spent 212 minutes of your life watching the replay of a hit on youtube?

by Phalange on Jan 13, 2012 8:15 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs

The only reason I can think of to watch a replay of that hit 100 times is because you’re hoping that it will look different to you than the first 99.

I’ve looked at two different clips and it seems obvious to me that at the instant prior to first contact Talbot’s torso is still upright, even leaning in to the Islander player, and it is his head which snaps back first, without whipping forward and not as a secondary whiplash effect. The Islander’s elbow is against Talbot’s upper body and his upper arm delivers the blow to the head at the same time. The arm is fairly upright, without the elbow cocked or significantly extended. This is the immediate impression at full speed and if you freeze it properly it is confirmed in replay.

Every fanbase does this, including ours. The exact same hit with different colored jerseys produces opposite responses, against all reason. Either we defend our guys against any attack, or we particularly loathe the other team, or this particular player is a douchescum and getting justice for a previous series of transgressions. It’s another example of the irrationality of fandom. We’re actually doing it here, too, with some comments that imply this hit is as suspendable as a hit can be.

Or perhaps it was an elbow shiver to the logo (I like the word shiver, because it’s something small and we tend to do it involuntarily and maybe he was just a little cold, they are playing on ice after all) and I can go back to drinking my tea with whatever hallucinogen is in it. The Flyers probably laced it so I can be a loyal fan.

/s, more often than not

by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 13, 2012 10:47 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs

Look at the time stamp of his post. It’s completely plausible, especially since he’s an Isles fan.

by mtitanic on Jan 13, 2012 1:21 PM EST up reply actions

I didn’t see the game, so maybe I’m missing some context, but why are the fans booing?

by GregF on Jan 13, 2012 6:50 AM EST reply actions

Talbot

I know this isn’t going to be popular, but this is not the first time talbot turtled and acted as if he was shout from the grassy knoll. I will never forget the infamous situation he had with carcillo and I’m not talk about the shhhh moment. I am talking about that faceoff which spurred on a new rule which was never used again against any other team but the flyers. Carcillo just grazed the top of his helmet and talbot hit the ice as if he was shot. He totally sandbagged. And of all people Islanders fans know what a chickenshit, weasel he can be after the whole Bailey debacle. I think it’s a crying wolf situation. The guy is growing on me because he has been lockdown great this season, but I was really not a fan of him or his play.

Now for last night Staios clearly hunted him as an unsuspecting player and went high on the body which what the league is including in punishment standards. I assume he will receive something.

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DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.

by MJDII on Jan 13, 2012 7:21 AM EST reply actions 1 recs

My thoughts are he’ll get 4 games if he gets anything. 4 games from now the Isles come to Philly and I’d bet they’d want to curtail any retribution in that game.

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by KreiderDesigns on Jan 13, 2012 8:25 AM EST reply actions

Disagree. Given the bad angles, realistically, this will be one game at the most.

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by Justin F. on Jan 13, 2012 10:54 AM EST up reply actions

Yeah what is with the shit camera placement? They had no better angle than those to use?

Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.

by KreiderDesigns on Jan 13, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions

Im pretty sure if we had full HD videos of the hit (like the NHL does), it would alot easier to determine if it was an illegal hit.
Thats one thing I like when watching NFL, they have full HD on all there games and they got a billion cameras, but they still have problems detecting if it is a catch or fumble on replays.

by Anders Jensen on Jan 13, 2012 12:04 PM EST up reply actions

The cameras must typically ignore Staios, since the play usually passes him by

But seriously, I was shocked that there were no better, clearer angles. Would make this much easier, open and shut. Absent that, even Keith Jones questioned his original call based on the shabby angles.

That said, I’m also shocked people can watch those shabby angles and think it’s so conclusive. (The blurry screenshots above, too: Screenshots can be very misleading, and ones that look like a water-color drawing was dropped in the bathtub even more so.) Especially the “elbow” part, given Staios’ tucked posture before the hit, his elbow only appearing in follow through after the hit (which, if we’re going to go all PHYSICS!!1 on the situation, is a natural outcome as a checker tries to maintain balance after contact).

Truly, most Isles fans dislike Talbot but plenty also wouldn’t care if Staios missed some games. The issue is it’s at best an inference. First thing I thought after seeing the replays last night was, I’m not even sure what the Shanaban explanatory video would look like on this, when they normally zoom in on explicit clear angles in HD. (Like, does he say, “We’re pretty sure this happened, based on Talbot’s reaction”?)

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by Dominik on Jan 13, 2012 12:50 PM EST up reply actions

Yeah. I mean I want to see it clear as day as much as all the other Flyers fans but I have to admit that there’s no real proof in what we have here. I hope the league has something different either way. If it was an elbow, suspend him, if it wasn’t we stop bitching.

Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.

by KreiderDesigns on Jan 13, 2012 2:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

That said, I’m also shocked people can watch those shabby angles and think it’s so conclusive. (The blurry screenshots above, too)

This is pretty much my takeaway from the incident, along with Eric’s analysis of “we can probably infer a headshot, and that’s probably not enough.”

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by Snevik on Jan 13, 2012 3:45 PM EST up reply actions

Some of the above discussion (and even Travis' headline, in retrospect) does not make sense to me

I’m puzzled by Isles fans reaction, “hey this isn’t an elbow!”

Because the league’s mandate is not to “avoid hits to head by an elbow” but “avoid head hits”. I personally never noticed an elbow in the pictures. In my view, I thought this was more or less charging, and a hit where it was inevitable the head would be targeted. This is similar to the NFL’s verboten “helmet to helmet” hits. Yes, even in the NFL that is a judgement call and a murky area. But looking at the hit, it is inevitable that head trauma would result, whether or not an elbow caused it. I recognize that “long suspension” might not occur in this case, especially if it was the result of an over-zealous hit as opposed to an elbow, but this is exactly what the NHL is trying to avoid, and whether or not an elbow was involved, they want to end those hits. Thus, Travis’ picture is exactly what the NHL should be telling the players.

Note that my original concern about clueless refs and the Flyers inappropriately leaving Talbot in the game still holds.

by Bud in TN on Jan 13, 2012 1:51 PM EST reply actions

This is similar to the NFL’s verboten “helmet to helmet” hits.

Pet peeve: the rule is not against helmet-to-helmet hits — helmet-to-helmet contact is neither necessary nor sufficient to draw a flag.

The rule is that defenseless players (players in the act of making a catch, kick, or throw) may not be hit in the helmet or with the helmet. It doesn’t have to be helmet-to-helmet to be a penalty if the player is defenseless, and helmet-to-helmet hits are allowed and common against non-defenseless players (runners, blockers, etc).

I don’t know why this rule is so widely misunderstood, but it is. Which I guess relates back to your confusion about the relevance of the elbow (which I agree came up after the hit and probably wasn’t what made contact with the head) here.

@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey

by Eric T. on Jan 13, 2012 2:03 PM EST up reply actions

Eric, your pet peeve is making my point. The goal is to eliminate head trauma. The complication is to create rules that help eliminate it. Thus, Travis’ drawing is useful, since creating rules that do this, and make sense and are understood to both players and fanbase is complicated.

I think, whether or not Staios is suspended, even if it was somewhat “inadvertent” (sic) the hit he made on Talbot is exactly what the league wants to prevent.

by Bud in TN on Jan 13, 2012 2:28 PM EST up reply actions

I don’t think you guys are really disagreeing, but I also don’t think Eric’s clarification in any way proves your point. The NFL allows certain players to be hit in the head, and the illegality of a hit is entirely context dependent. They haven’t made any steps to protect the head from all hits, which you are encouraging the NHL to do.

Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."

by Snevik on Jan 13, 2012 3:49 PM EST up reply actions