Relative Deployment Z-Score
Hockey players have roles. Some players are asked to score, some are asked to be physical, some are asked to shut down top competition. With that said, how do you go about comparing players between roles? It’s easy to look at point totals and say “Player A is better than Player B because he has more points,” but that doesn’t mean it’s correct. What if Player A is getting more playing time? What if player A is facing weak competition and aided by strong teammates? What if Player B is facing top competition with weak teammates? Advanced stats like CorsiRel QoC and QoT along with Offensive Zone Start % paint the picture of how the player is being used---but that still doesn’t solve the problem of how to compare players in different situations. I am attempting to solve this problem by creating a stat called RDZ: Relative Deployment Z-Score. It’s simple in theory: How does a player fare against other players who were deployed in similar situations.
To start I’ve compiled data for the past five years (06-07 to 10-11) for every forward who played at least 40 games in a season (If a player played 40 games or more in each of the five years, there will be five different results---one for each season). The total sample size is 1,514 players broken down like so:
| Comp | Team | Players |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | 1 | 83 |
| 1 | 2 | 100 |
| 1 | 3 | 94 |
| 1 | 4 | 87 |
| 2 | 1 | 103 |
| 2 | 2 | 116 |
| 2 | 3 | 101 |
| 2 | 4 | 59 |
| 3 | 1 | 114 |
| 3 | 2 | 122 |
| 3 | 3 | 109 |
| 3 | 4 | 81 |
| 4 | 1 | 58 |
| 4 | 2 | 35 |
| 4 | 3 | 93 |
| 4 | 4 | 159 |
In order for this to be broken down I copied and pasted every team (individually, 30 teams per season, 5 seasons, 150 teams) and figured out the Comp/Team stats for each player for ever year (Yes, this took a while and the spreadsheets contain tons of data). Once I had it broken down I then separated it into 16 different spreadsheets, one for each deployment situation (1v1, 1v2, 1v3, 1v4, 2v1, etc). Over the last five years 83 players went up against top competition with top teammates over the course of one full season. The next step was to set up a graph (I am not good enough with the SB Nation Fan Post to copy/paste graphs, if someone can help me with this I think it would be easier to explain) comparing the OZS% to each of G+A1/60 and CRel for every player (Two different graphs). I was looking for some sort of regression line, ideally sloping upward (As OZS% goes up, so should both G+A1 and CRel) and after the data was entered, I found the results I was looking for. When isolating each of the 16 scenarios we could then isolate other stats within each individual scenario looking for correlation and causation. The results were promising, with the G+A1 having a positive slope and an R^2 value of .117 for G+A1 and .0832 for CRel (not great, but when you look at the actual graphs you can see that there is an obvious correlation with OZS% and both G+A1 and CRel).
Once I had the expected G+A1 and CRel for a given OZS%/QoC/QoT combination, we can then enter the individual’s OZS% and find the expected G+A1 and CRel for the player. Once we have that we can find the variance between actual and expected. In the data for the 83 players who were “1v1” the average variance between actual and expected G+A1 was “-7E-04” or “-.000746987…”, either way, it’s basically zero (average variance for CRel was 0). The standard deviation of G+A1 was .3295 and 4.88 for CRel. If you have the actual variance, the expected variance, and the standard deviation of variance, we can then calculate the “Z-Score,” or a formula for explaining how many “standard deviations” each individual result is away from the average. 66.6% of a population falls between the Z-Scores of -1 and 1. 95% between -2 and 2, and 99.7% between -3 and 3. So when looking at a Z score think of it like this: 0 is average (better than 50%). 1 is better than 84.1%, 2 is better than 97.7%, 3 is better than 99.9%. -1 is better than only 15%, -2 is better than only 2.3% and -3 is better than .1%. The whole theory of the stat is that if you know a player’s Z-Score for 1v3, or 2v4, or 1v1 etc... you can then compare it to anyone of any other situation.
We calculate the Z-Score for both GA1 and CRel and call them “GA1Z” and “CRelZ”; we then take a 50/50 average of the two scores to give us our Relative Deployment Z-Score. I use the 50/50 because I want to put equal value on individual scoring and the ability to drive the play forward. Before we look at the players I want to look at the average G+A1/60 and CorsiRel's of each situation given a 50% OZS:
| G+A1/60 | Corsi Relative | ||
|---|---|---|---|
| Top Comp | |||
| 1st line team | 1.4608 | 1st line team | 6.6446 |
| 2nd line team | 1.4549 | 2nd line team | 2.0847 |
| 3rd line team | 1.3476 | 3rd line team | -0.499 |
| 4th line team | 1.1651 | 4th line team | -6.993 |
| Any Team | 1.3781 | Any Team | 0.959 |
| 2nd Comp | |||
| Top Line | 1.4978 | Top Line | 6.5877 |
| Second Line | 1.4326 | Second Line | 3.9334 |
| Third Line | 1.2176 | Third Line | -1.704 |
| Fourth Line | 1.1169 | Fourth Line | -5.779 |
| Any Line | 1.3453 | Any Line | 1.375 |
| 3rd Comp | |||
| Top Line | 1.5766 | Top Line | 6.9723 |
| Second Line | 1.3718 | Second Line | 2.804 |
| Third Line | 1.1924 | Third Line | -0.8371 |
| Fourth Line | 0.9839 | Fourth Line | -5.223 |
| Any Line | 1.2838 | Any Line | 0.852 |
| 4th Comp | |||
| Top Line | 1.4426 | Top Line | 6.6281 |
| Second Line | 1.2234 | Second Line | -0.477 |
| Third Line | 0.9647 | Third Line | -2.171 |
| Fourth Line | 0.797 | Fourth Line | -9.194 |
There have been other attempts at stats similar to this one, but nothing takes into account all three major situational factors: O-Zone Start %, competition AND teammates. You can clearly see in the above table that for each level of competition, as your teammates get better, so do both your individual scoring and your ability to drive the play forward---not to say that wasn't expected. It is important because there is an individual formula for every scenario.
Lets take a look at five players of all different situations:
| QoC | C | QoT | T | OZS | G+A1 | Crel |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| -0.907 | 4 | 0.557 | 1 | 52.2 | 0.63 | -2.6 |
| 0.457 | 2 | 0.04 | 3 | 51.8 | 1.95 | 6.7 |
| 0.56 | 2 | -0.487 | 3 | 38.7 | 1.14 | -17.6 |
| 1.175 | 1 | -0.107 | 3 | 47.7 | 2.16 | 9.1 |
| 0.74 | 1 | 1.382 | 2 | 49.5 | 1.04 | -3 |
Lets take another look at those same players:
| NAME | Team | Year | GP | TOI/60 | QoC | C | QoT | T | OZS | G+A1 | Crel | ExpG+A1 | ExpCRel | GADif | CRDif | GA1Z | CRelZ | RDZ |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| DARROLLPOWE | PHI | 2009 | 60 | 9.47 | -0.907 | 4 | 0.557 | 1 | 52.2 | 0.63 | -2.6 | 1.46372 | 7.24 | -0.83 | -9.84 | -1.74 | -1.76 | -1.75 |
| ERICSTAAL | CAR | 2010 | 70 | 14.89 | 0.457 | 2 | 0.04 | 3 | 51.8 | 1.95 | 6.7 | 1.2293 | -1.02 | 0.72 | 7.72 | 1.99 | 0.00 | 1.00 |
| CHRISDRURY | NYR | 2010 | 77 | 12.28 | 0.56 | 2 | -0.487 | 3 | 38.7 | 1.14 | -17.6 | 1.14415 | -6.01 | 0.00 | -11.59 | -0.01 | 0.00 | 0.00 |
| PAVELDATSYUK | DET | 2011 | 56 | 14.94 | 1.175 | 1 | -0.107 | 3 | 47.7 | 2.16 | 9.1 | 1.3 | -1.26 | 0.86 | 10.36 | 2.40 | 1.60 | 2.00 |
| MATTCOOKE | PIT | 2011 | 67 | 12.02 | 0.74 | 1 | 1.382 | 2 | 49.5 | 1.04 | -3 | 1.45 | 2.16 | -0.41 | -5.16 | -1.16 | -0.81 | -0.98 |
Datsuk is far and away the best player (his +2 rating means he’s in the top 97.5 percentile of his situation) of the above. Top competition with only 3rd line help, he’s expected to have a GA1 of 1.3 and CRel of -1.26 and he’s blowing it away with a 2.16 and 9.1. Staal’s not quite scoring as much, his Corsi is slightly lower, he’s playing similar situations, but playing second line competition opposed to top line and he’s in the offensive zone 4% more. This bumps his RDZ to 1 (85th percentile). Drury is the one performing as expected with his scoring, but he’s a -17.6 opposed to a -6.01 expected, but he’s doing it while only starting in the offensive zone 38% of the time. Cooke’s with second teammates vs. top competition, scoring well below expected and being driven back while he’s expected to go forward, resulting him in a -1 (15th percentile). Powsie’s ’09 campaign was horrible. Top teammates vs. bottom competition aided by a 52% OZS, his GA1 is almost less than half of everyone else on the chart, and his CRel is 10 points lower than expected. Now that we see how the stat works, lets check out the Flyers this current season.
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Let me start off by saying that Sean Couturier’s 2.535 RDZ is the second best of every player I’ve compiled data for, behind only Sidney Crosby’s 2011 season: 2.817. As a matter of fact, only 7 times ever has a player recorded a 2 or better (1500+ players evaluated): Crosby (‘11, ‘10, ‘08), Ovechkin (‘10), D. Sedin (‘10), Datsuk (‘11), and Guillaume Letendress’s fantastic ’09 season in which he, like Scooter, destroyed 4v4 situations with a 48.8 OZS% to the tune of a 1.53 GA1 and 6.2 CorsiRel when only a .8 GA1 and -9.4 CRel expected. So, yeah, Couturier is playing amazing. Talbot is another surprise behind Scooter, but not when you really look at how good he’s playing in his tough situations. Giroux, Voracek, Read, Jagr, and Harry Z all playing significantly better than an average player would given the situations. Before you freak out and say Hartnell is way underrated---don’t forget this is an even strength only stat, but he’s still above average. Simmer is the last one that can say that. A few of the Flyers at the bottom of this list shouldn’t surprise anyone. Shelley is horrible, in the bottom 10th percentile. Schenner is also in the bottom 15th but that’s been moving up quickly. Rinaldo is surprisingly average and so is JVR, but Danny B has had a rough even strength season, in the bottom 20th percentile. His scoring is almost on pace (1.52 actual, 1.7 expected) but his CorsiRel is just not.
And here are all Flyers for the past 5 years:
| NAME | Team | Year | GP | TOI/60 | QoC | C | QoT | T | G/60 | A1/60 | OZS | G+A1 | Crel | ExpG+A1 | ExpCRel | GADif | CRDif | GA1Z | CRelZ | RDZ |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| ANDREASNODL | PHI | 2011 | 67 | 12.26 | 0.88 | 1 | 1.708 | 2 | 0.66 | 0.51 | 43.8 | 1.17 | -0.9 | 1.34 | 2.16 | -0.17 | -3.06 | -0.47 | -0.48 | -0.48 |
| ARRONASHAM | PHI | 2009 | 78 | 8.6 | -1.004 | 4 | -0.593 | 4 | 0.72 | 0.63 | 53.5 | 1.35 | 0.8 | 0.79 | -8.45 | 0.56 | 9.25 | 1.64 | 1.27 | 1.46 |
| ARRONASHAM | PHI | 2010 | 72 | 9.81 | -0.028 | 4 | 0.279 | 3 | 0.85 | 0.85 | 51.7 | 1.7 | -0.1 | 0.98 | -1.54 | 0.72 | 1.44 | 1.93 | 0.23 | 1.08 |
| BLAIRBETTS | PHI | 2010 | 63 | 9.29 | 0.371 | 2 | -3.955 | 4 | 0.41 | 0.51 | 39.2 | 0.92 | -16.1 | 0.91 | -9.92 | 0.01 | -6.18 | 0.01 | -0.82 | -0.41 |
| BLAIRBETTS | PHI | 2011 | 75 | 6.73 | -0.483 | 4 | -4.643 | 4 | 0.48 | 0.12 | 26.9 | 0.6 | -18.8 | 0.82 | -14.10 | -0.22 | -4.70 | -0.64 | -0.65 | -0.64 |
| CLAUDEGIROUX | PHI | 2009 | 42 | 12.53 | -0.087 | 3 | 0.183 | 2 | 0.8 | 0.91 | 51 | 1.71 | 11.6 | 1.38 | 3.13 | 0.33 | 8.47 | 0.00 | 1.31 | 0.66 |
| CLAUDEGIROUX | PHI | 2010 | 82 | 12.38 | 0.204 | 3 | 1.789 | 2 | 0.47 | 0.95 | 50.6 | 1.42 | 0 | 1.38 | 3.00 | 0.04 | -3.00 | 0.00 | -0.47 | -0.23 |
| CLAUDEGIROUX | PHI | 2011 | 82 | 13.61 | 0.821 | 2 | 2.056 | 1 | 0.75 | 1.29 | 49.2 | 2.04 | 14.1 | 1.49 | 6.53 | 0.55 | 7.57 | 1.42 | 1.21 | 1.31 |
| DANIELBRIERE | PHI | 2008 | 79 | 13.18 | 0.098 | 4 | -0.112 | 3 | 0.92 | 0.63 | 56.9 | 1.55 | -4.4 | 1.01 | 0.40 | 0.54 | -4.80 | 1.44 | -0.77 | 0.33 |
| DANIELBRIERE | PHI | 2010 | 75 | 12.94 | 0.129 | 4 | 2.205 | 1 | 0.87 | 0.68 | 56.5 | 1.55 | 10.1 | 1.51 | 8.44 | 0.05 | 1.66 | 0.09 | 0.30 | 0.20 |
| DANIELBRIERE | PHI | 2011 | 77 | 14.65 | 0.252 | 3 | 0.051 | 3 | 1.49 | 0.8 | 53.1 | 2.29 | -0.3 | 1.26 | -0.42 | 1.03 | 0.12 | 2.32 | 0.02 | 1.17 |
| DANIELCARCILLO | PHI | 2009 | 74 | 10.61 | 0.269 | 2 | 0.166 | 2 | 0.08 | 0.31 | 55.1 | 0.39 | -2.3 | 1.51 | 4.41 | -1.12 | -6.71 | -2.92 | -1.10 | -2.01 |
| DANIELCARCILLO | PHI | 2010 | 76 | 10.95 | 0.506 | 1 | -2.026 | 4 | 0.79 | 0.36 | 47.8 | 1.15 | -6.7 | 1.12 | -7.35 | 0.03 | 0.65 | 0.09 | 0.10 | 0.09 |
| DANIELCARCILLO | PHI | 2011 | 57 | 7.68 | 0.125 | 4 | -3.631 | 4 | 0.55 | 0.14 | 40.6 | 0.69 | -8.1 | 0.80 | -11.19 | -0.11 | 3.09 | -0.34 | 0.43 | 0.04 |
| DARROLLPOWE | PHI | 2009 | 60 | 9.47 | -0.907 | 4 | 0.557 | 1 | 0.42 | 0.21 | 52.2 | 0.63 | -2.6 | 1.46 | 7.24 | -0.83 | -9.84 | -1.74 | -1.76 | -1.75 |
| DARROLLPOWE | PHI | 2010 | 63 | 10.64 | 0.166 | 3 | -0.352 | 3 | 0.81 | 0.45 | 45 | 1.26 | -2.3 | 1.08 | -1.51 | 0.18 | -0.79 | 0.40 | -0.13 | 0.13 |
| DARROLLPOWE | PHI | 2011 | 81 | 9 | 0.189 | 3 | -1.302 | 4 | 0.33 | 0.58 | 37.2 | 0.91 | -9.3 | 0.83 | -9.57 | 0.08 | 0.27 | 0.17 | 0.04 | 0.11 |
| IANLAPERRIERE | PHI | 2010 | 82 | 9.54 | 0.279 | 3 | -2.82 | 4 | 0.23 | 0.54 | 40.6 | 0.77 | -16.1 | 0.87 | -8.42 | -0.10 | -7.68 | -0.22 | -1.12 | -0.67 |
| JAMESDOWD | PHI | 2008 | 73 | 6.54 | -0.455 | 4 | -2.444 | 4 | 0.5 | 0.25 | 30.7 | 0.75 | -16.6 | 0.81 | -13.30 | -0.06 | -3.30 | -0.19 | -0.45 | -0.32 |
| JAMESVANRIEMSDYK | PHI | 2010 | 78 | 11.15 | 0.188 | 3 | 0.629 | 2 | 0.69 | 0.62 | 58.8 | 1.31 | 8.1 | 1.49 | 5.68 | -0.18 | 2.42 | 0.00 | 0.38 | 0.19 |
| JAMESVANRIEMSDYK | PHI | 2011 | 75 | 12.79 | 0.663 | 2 | 2.507 | 1 | 1 | 0.56 | 52.6 | 1.56 | 0.5 | 1.52 | 6.77 | 0.04 | -6.27 | 0.10 | -1.00 | -0.45 |
| JEFFCARTER | PHI | 2008 | 82 | 13.02 | 0.824 | 1 | 1.914 | 1 | 0.9 | 0.28 | 39.5 | 1.18 | 7.3 | 1.22 | 3.74 | -0.04 | 3.56 | -0.13 | 0.73 | 0.30 |
| JEFFCARTER | PHI | 2009 | 82 | 14.14 | 0.785 | 2 | -0.045 | 3 | 1.4 | 0.72 | 40.6 | 2.12 | -1.4 | 1.16 | -5.29 | 0.96 | 3.89 | 2.67 | 0.00 | 1.33 |
| JEFFCARTER | PHI | 2010 | 74 | 13.53 | 0.326 | 2 | 3.146 | 1 | 1.2 | 0.36 | 53.3 | 1.56 | 4.8 | 1.53 | 6.82 | 0.03 | -2.02 | 0.08 | -0.32 | -0.12 |
| JEFFCARTER | PHI | 2011 | 80 | 13.93 | 0.896 | 1 | 3.06 | 1 | 1.4 | 0.48 | 43.8 | 1.88 | 7.8 | 1.32 | 4.93 | 0.56 | 2.87 | 1.70 | 0.59 | 1.14 |
| JODYSHELLEY | PHI | 2011 | 58 | 6.13 | -1.217 | 4 | -5.426 | 4 | 0.34 | 0 | 38.3 | 0.34 | -17.1 | 0.81 | -11.68 | -0.47 | -5.42 | -1.38 | -0.75 | -1.06 |
| JOFFREYLUPUL | PHI | 2008 | 56 | 12.71 | 0.305 | 3 | 0.544 | 2 | 0.84 | 0.67 | 46.6 | 1.51 | 0.5 | 1.33 | 1.69 | 0.18 | -1.19 | 0.00 | -0.19 | -0.09 |
| JOFFREYLUPUL | PHI | 2009 | 79 | 12.75 | 0.193 | 2 | -0.163 | 3 | 1.13 | 0.6 | 46.9 | 1.73 | -2.9 | 1.20 | -2.89 | 0.53 | -0.01 | 1.47 | 0.00 | 0.74 |
| KRISVERSTEEG | PHI | 2011 | 80 | 13.8 | 0.86 | 1 | -0.462 | 3 | 0.76 | 0.6 | 52.8 | 1.36 | 1.8 | 1.41 | 0.42 | -0.05 | 1.38 | -0.14 | 0.21 | 0.04 |
| MIKEKNUBLE | PHI | 2008 | 82 | 12.65 | 0.808 | 1 | 1.804 | 1 | 0.69 | 0.41 | 44.3 | 1.1 | 3.1 | 1.33 | 5.07 | -0.23 | -1.97 | -0.70 | -0.40 | -0.55 |
| MIKEKNUBLE | PHI | 2009 | 82 | 12.93 | 1.216 | 1 | 0.284 | 2 | 0.91 | 0.4 | 47.1 | 1.31 | 3.1 | 1.40 | 2.16 | -0.09 | 0.94 | -0.25 | 0.15 | -0.05 |
| MIKERICHARDS | PHI | 2008 | 73 | 12.62 | 0.468 | 2 | 0.61 | 2 | 0.91 | 0.78 | 31.5 | 1.69 | 4.7 | 1.19 | 2.20 | 0.50 | 2.50 | 1.29 | 0.41 | 0.85 |
| MIKERICHARDS | PHI | 2009 | 79 | 14.13 | 0.948 | 1 | 0.306 | 2 | 0.7 | 0.97 | 40.2 | 1.67 | 1.1 | 1.27 | 2.16 | 0.40 | -1.06 | 1.15 | -0.17 | 0.49 |
| MIKERICHARDS | PHI | 2010 | 82 | 14.09 | 0.811 | 1 | 1.78 | 2 | 0.83 | 0.26 | 46.8 | 1.09 | 4.6 | 1.39 | 2.16 | -0.30 | 2.44 | -0.87 | 0.38 | -0.24 |
| MIKERICHARDS | PHI | 2011 | 81 | 13.26 | 0.752 | 2 | 1.513 | 2 | 0.78 | 0.84 | 46.8 | 1.62 | 1.1 | 1.40 | 3.63 | 0.22 | -2.53 | 0.57 | -0.42 | 0.08 |
| NIKOLAIZHERDEV | PHI | 2011 | 56 | 11.61 | 0.221 | 3 | 1.785 | 2 | 1.29 | 0.18 | 49.9 | 1.47 | 17.3 | 1.37 | 2.77 | 0.10 | 14.53 | 0.00 | 2.25 | 1.13 |
| R.J.UMBERGER | PHI | 2008 | 74 | 12.76 | 0.553 | 2 | 0.038 | 3 | 0.57 | 0.83 | 44.6 | 1.4 | -2.9 | 1.18 | -3.76 | 0.22 | 0.86 | 0.60 | 0.00 | 0.30 |
| RILEYCOTE | PHI | 2008 | 70 | 4.2 | -1.091 | 4 | -4.481 | 4 | 0.2 | 0.41 | 44.8 | 0.61 | -10.8 | 0.80 | -10.30 | -0.19 | -0.50 | -0.57 | -0.07 | -0.32 |
| RILEYCOTE | PHI | 2009 | 63 | 4.16 | -2.28 | 4 | -1.742 | 4 | 0 | 0.46 | 65.7 | 0.46 | -0.8 | 0.78 | -5.86 | -0.32 | 5.06 | -0.96 | 0.70 | -0.13 |
| SAMIKAPANEN | PHI | 2008 | 74 | 10.71 | 0.218 | 3 | -0.55 | 3 | 0.3 | 0.15 | 43.1 | 0.45 | -6.2 | 1.04 | -1.77 | -0.59 | -4.43 | -1.34 | -0.72 | -1.03 |
| SCOTTHARTNELL | PHI | 2008 | 80 | 12.99 | 0.279 | 3 | 0.623 | 2 | 0.69 | 0.63 | 45.9 | 1.32 | 1.5 | 1.32 | 1.46 | 0.00 | 0.04 | 0.00 | 0.01 | 0.00 |
| SCOTTHARTNELL | PHI | 2009 | 82 | 13.32 | 0.473 | 2 | -0.417 | 4 | 1.26 | 0.66 | 43.4 | 1.92 | -2 | 0.99 | -8.31 | 0.93 | 6.31 | 2.29 | 0.84 | 1.56 |
| SCOTTHARTNELL | PHI | 2010 | 81 | 12.43 | -0.025 | 4 | 2.866 | 1 | 0.36 | 0.89 | 50 | 1.25 | 3.7 | 1.44 | 6.63 | -0.19 | -2.93 | -0.40 | -0.52 | -0.46 |
| SCOTTHARTNELL | PHI | 2011 | 82 | 13.55 | 0.253 | 3 | 0.495 | 3 | 1.13 | 0.54 | 53 | 1.67 | -0.5 | 1.26 | -0.43 | 0.41 | -0.07 | 0.93 | -0.01 | 0.46 |
| SCOTTIEUPSHALL | PHI | 2008 | 61 | 11.41 | 0.571 | 2 | 0.881 | 2 | 0.78 | 0.6 | 45.9 | 1.38 | 18.3 | 1.39 | 3.55 | -0.01 | 14.75 | -0.02 | 2.42 | 1.20 |
| SIMONGAGNE | PHI | 2009 | 79 | 12.74 | 1.018 | 1 | 0.497 | 1 | 1.01 | 0.6 | 47.3 | 1.61 | 1.7 | 1.40 | 5.90 | 0.21 | -4.20 | 0.64 | -0.86 | -0.11 |
| SIMONGAGNE | PHI | 2010 | 58 | 13.24 | 0.741 | 1 | 1.835 | 2 | 0.86 | 0.31 | 52.7 | 1.17 | 3 | 1.51 | 2.16 | -0.34 | 0.84 | -0.96 | 0.13 | -0.41 |
| VACLAVPROSPAL | PHI | 2008 | 80 | 15.54 | 0.34 | 3 | -0.172 | 3 | 1.01 | 0.97 | 59 | 1.98 | -1.6 | 1.39 | 0.38 | 0.59 | -1.98 | 1.33 | -0.32 | 0.51 |
| VILLELEINO | PHI | 2010 | 55 | 11.42 | 0.354 | 2 | 0.019 | 3 | 0.48 | 0.19 | 56.2 | 0.67 | 9.5 | 1.26 | 0.66 | -0.59 | 8.84 | -1.63 | 0.00 | -0.82 |
| VILLELEINO | PHI | 2011 | 81 | 13.42 | 0.138 | 4 | -0.059 | 3 | 0.77 | 0.77 | 62.3 | 1.54 | 0 | 1.05 | 2.41 | 0.49 | -2.41 | 1.32 | -0.39 | 0.46 |
And a closer look at the best and worst seasons over the past five years:
| NAME | Year | GP | TOI/60 | C | T | OZS | G+A1 | Crel | ExpG+A1 | ExpCRel | GA1Z | CRelZ | UtZ |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| SCOTTHARTNELL | 2009 | 82 | 13.32 | 2 | 4 | 43.4 | 1.92 | -2 | 0.99 | -8.31 | 2.29 | 0.84 | 1.56 |
| ARRONASHAM | 2009 | 78 | 8.6 | 4 | 4 | 53.5 | 1.35 | 0.8 | 0.79 | -8.45 | 1.64 | 1.27 | 1.46 |
| JEFFCARTER | 2009 | 82 | 14.14 | 2 | 3 | 40.6 | 2.12 | -1.4 | 1.16 | -5.29 | 2.67 | 0.00 | 1.33 |
| CLAUDEGIROUX | 2011 | 82 | 13.61 | 2 | 1 | 49.2 | 2.04 | 14.1 | 1.49 | 6.53 | 1.42 | 1.21 | 1.31 |
| SCOTTIEUPSHALL | 2008 | 61 | 11.41 | 2 | 2 | 45.9 | 1.38 | 18.3 | 1.39 | 3.55 | -0.02 | 2.42 | 1.20 |
| DANIELBRIERE | 2011 | 77 | 14.65 | 3 | 3 | 53.1 | 2.29 | -0.3 | 1.26 | -0.42 | 2.32 | 0.02 | 1.17 |
| JEFFCARTER | 2011 | 80 | 13.93 | 1 | 1 | 43.8 | 1.88 | 7.8 | 1.32 | 4.93 | 1.70 | 0.59 | 1.14 |
| NIKOLAIZHERDEV | 2011 | 56 | 11.61 | 3 | 2 | 49.9 | 1.47 | 17.3 | 1.37 | 2.77 | 0.00 | 2.25 | 1.13 |
| ARRONASHAM | 2010 | 72 | 9.81 | 4 | 3 | 51.7 | 1.7 | -0.1 | 0.98 | -1.54 | 1.93 | 0.23 | 1.08 |
| MIKERICHARDS | 2008 | 73 | 12.62 | 2 | 2 | 31.5 | 1.69 | 4.7 | 1.19 | 2.20 | 1.29 | 0.41 | 0.85 |
| JOFFREYLUPUL | 2009 | 79 | 12.75 | 2 | 3 | 46.9 | 1.73 | -2.9 | 1.20 | -2.89 | 1.47 | 0.00 | 0.74 |
| CLAUDEGIROUX | 2009 | 42 | 12.53 | 3 | 2 | 51 | 1.71 | 11.6 | 1.38 | 3.13 | 0.00 | 1.31 | 0.66 |
| BLAIRBETTS | 2011 | 75 | 6.73 | 4 | 4 | 26.9 | 0.6 | -18.8 | 0.81548 | -14.10 | -0.64 | -0.64 | -0.6431 |
| IANLAPERRIERE | 2010 | 82 | 9.54 | 3 | 4 | 40.6 | 0.77 | -16.1 | 0.87016 | -8.41524 | -0.21 | -1.124 | -0.6714 |
| VILLELEINO | 2010 | 55 | 11.42 | 2 | 3 | 56.2 | 0.67 | 9.5 | 1.2579 | 0.65944 | -1.629 | -0.0028 | -0.8159 |
| SAMIKAPANEN | 2008 | 74 | 10.71 | 3 | 3 | 43.1 | 0.45 | -6.2 | 1.04267 | -1.7686 | -1.335 | -0.721 | -1.0283 |
| JODYSHELLEY | 2011 | 58 | 6.13 | 4 | 4 | 38.3 | 0.34 | -17.1 | 0.80636 | -11.68025 | -1.381 | -0.745 | -1.063 |
| DARROLLPOWE | 2009 | 60 | 9.47 | 4 | 1 | 52.2 | 0.63 | -2.6 | 1.46372 | 7.24058 | -1.740 | -1.762 | -1.751 |
| DANIELCARCILLO | 2009 | 74 | 10.61 | 2 | 2 | 55.1 | 0.39 | -2.3 | 1.51396 | 4.41127 | -2.922 | -1.099 | -2.011 |
The first thing I want to point out is that in 2009 the Flyers were led by 46 goal scorer Jeff Carter, 30/30 Scott Hartnell, and now All-Star Joffrey Lupul. All 3 are in the top 12 in the past 5 years, all 3 had a negative CorsiRel, however they lit the lamp enough to more than compensate for the very mediocre CorsiRels. Aaron Asham makes the list. twice. Giroux’s rookie year and his 2011 make the top 12. Upshall’s first year as a Flyer and Mike Richard’s breakout 2008 season were all memorable. Nicolay Zherdev and his ridiculous Corsi from last year put him up here, and Briere and Jeff Carter’s 2011 rounds out the memorable seasons. As for the bad ones… Powe’s rookie year, Kapanen’s final year, Leino’s half Det/half Philly season, and Danny Carcillo’s first season’s were all ones to forget. A surprising appearance by a dominant PK duo: Lappy’s 2010 and Bettsy’s 2011. A not surprising appearance by king argument starter (and not-so-good hockey player): Jody Shelley.
Questions?
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This is really cool. A ton of work, but really interesting. I ran into the same problem with my data table on Calder candidates — it was too wide. Not sure how to reformat unless I remove columns, reduce the font or scrunch them a little more.
There have recently been a few posts pointing out how amazingly well Cooter is doing! Incredilby incredible! (as Milbury would say)
For me it was only too wide when I wasn’t signed into my SBNation account. As long as you’re signed in you should be able to see everything.
There have recently been a few posts pointing out how amazingly well Cooter is doing!
Yeah, it was very cool to see that Scooter is playing so well. I give a lot of credit to the front office—-they took a lot of shit for keeping Scooter and waiving Betts, but it’s really turned out to be the correct move.
by OrangeNblacK on Jan 25, 2012 9:34 PM EST up reply actions
As I understand it. You take play X and use him in a certain way Y and see how much better he perfom then league avg (Z)
I think somebody did a similar study called balanced corsi rel.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 26, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, but the normalization here is a bit confusing. I am assuming he normalized somehow for 1v1, versus 1v2, versus 1v3 etc since he is comparing Couturier to Crosby, Grioux, etc. (or else those comparisons would be incorrect to make) but it’s not obvious how he did it (after going to lengths to explain how he kept them in separate categories). I’m also not sure what competition metric he used, I believe he is using the +/- base QoC and QoT, but I’m not certain. Also, I don’t think I agree with making them 1, 2, 3, and 4’s versus their actual numerical value.
This was fairly difficult to follow. I understand the intent, it’s just not obvious that it was done correctly.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
I didnt read trough all of it, because im not that good with statistics (most of kinda maths is no problem, just statistic make no sense from a logic point of view)
by Anders Jensen on Jan 26, 2012 2:19 PM EST up reply actions
I used CRelQoC and CRelQoT as comp/team levels. I used 1,2,3,4 to be able to give me 16 different populations. There are 16 ‘formulas’, one for each situation (1/1,3/4,4/4 etc), and all you need to do to calculate the RDZ is have 5 stats: CrelQoC and CrelQoT (the integer 1,2,3,4; not the raw #), OZS% (The independent variable—- the OZS% affects each situation differently (I have data/graphs/tables showing the slopes of the regression lines (and r^2 values) of how the OZS% affects each of the 16 situations differently), G+A1/60 (Once you pick one of the 16 situations (one of 16 independent data sets with their own linear regressions) you plug the OZS into the “x” value in the formula. Your result is the Expected G+A1 given QoC, QoT, and now OZS. Take that number (which is now actual GA1 minus expected GA1. Each of the 16 situations has it’s own ‘average varience’ and it’s own ‘standard deviation of varience’. Actual variance of GA1 minus expected variance over standard deviation of variance = Z-Score of said variance—- where the ‘variance’ in question is the difference between the player in question and the average player in the same exact deployment) and CorsiRel (Same as GA1 but using the CorsiRel numbers instead). Add the GA1z with the Crelz and divide by two for your final Relative Deployment Z-Score.
by OrangeNblacK on Jan 26, 2012 3:09 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
When I get home I can post formulas for regression lines, average variances, and standard deviations of variances for each of the 16 situations. Or I can email you the data if you want to check my work? Or if someone could teach me how to upload an excel document to the post…
by OrangeNblacK on Jan 26, 2012 3:14 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
If you could use mediafire or some website and just provide a link to your Excel document? (linking to mediafire is not against the rules is it masthead?)
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 26, 2012 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
I think the one thing I would really like to check with this is whether the sample is actually normally distributed. Because if not then I believe using the Z distribution wouldn’t be accurate. There are tests which check for normality; the D’Agostino-Pearson test is one of them (null hypothesis = normal distribution, therefore p>0.05 on this test indicates it’s a normal distribution). If I get time I might run the test for you at some point if I get my hands on the Excel document.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 26, 2012 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
So basically it should only be used to compare players within the same category of deployment correct? Comparing Couturier to Giroux, or Crosby, etc. would be incorrect to do as they would fall in to a different grouping? Or do I have it wrong still, because the way it reads to me is that the comparisons only work within each deployment category, Player X was deployed in Situation 2, and Player Y was deployed in Situation 2. Player X had an RDZ of 1.2, and Player Y had an RDZ of 2.3, Player Y outperformed Player X in Situation 2. That’ what it is telling you correct?
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
He’s using the Z distribution – by which I mean he is normalizing all of his 16 cohorts into a normal distribution with mean of 0 and standard deviation of 1. So he’s saying that within his cohort, this is how much Crosby’s performance is better than his peers, and within his cohort, this is how much Couturier’s performance is better than his peers. By normalizing it he can seek to make comparisons between categories. He cannot say that Couturier outperformed Crobsy because they had situations, but he could say that Couturier’s performance in his situation is at a level above his peers that is greater than Crosby’s performance in his situation.
I think – but as I said, you can’t chuck a Z distribution on just any sample. You need to establish normality, and you do so using the D’Agostino-Pearson test which will give you p>0.05 if it is normally distributed. At least that’s what I’ve used in the past (although I don’t know too much about stats, just enough to work on some medical research analysis).
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 26, 2012 9:38 PM EST up reply actions
He cannot say that Couturier outperformed Crobsy because they had situations, but he could say that Couturier’s performance in his situation is at a level above his peers that is greater than Crosby’s performance in his situation.
Ok got it. Regardless, I just don’t think that’s enough to make the comparison as you pointed out, especially since it seems like first line guys are getting shortchanged on the scoring using the eyeball test in general. I think what it tells you is, Couturier at 18/19 is far better than 4th line guys, which we knew; but we truly don’t know how he’d perform in the situations Crosby, Datsyuk, Giroux, whoever are put in. So if he is trying to do that, which it still seems like he is to me the way some of the post reads, I think he has come up short.
Also, I really, really don’t like the categorization; 1, 2, 3, and 4.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
If I didn’t categorize by ‘1,2,3,4’ how would I be able to include O-Zone Starts at all? Doing it this way creates a way to compare situations as well as players. Being able to know which is tougher :1v2 w/ 65% or 4v4 w/ 45%? If we know that player A is outperforming player B in their individual situations AND that A is playing is playing in a tougher actual situation than player B, then we can make a conclusion.
by OrangeNblacK on Jan 27, 2012 7:32 PM EST up reply actions
Here’s my thing, and yes this is cherry picking, but:
Ollie Jokinen has a CorsiRelQoC of 2.108, second on his team. This puts him as “1” opposition.
Jim Slater has a CorsiRelQoC of 0.606, first on his team. This puts him as “1” opposition.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 29, 2012 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
If we know that player A is outperforming player B in their individual situations AND that A is playing is playing in a tougher actual situation than player B, then we can make a conclusion.
That’s a very specific case, and not the problem I’m referring to. I can already do that just looking at numbers on BtN.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Here’s a better example:
Player A: 1.3 GA1, 0 Crel
Player B: 1.5GA1, 5 Crel
Who’s better? B, obviously.
Player A: 2C3T 45% OZS, 1.3 GA1, 0Crel
Player B: 3C1T 57% OZS, 1.5 GA1, 5Crel
Who’s better? Tough one…
Expectation for player with 2C3T @ 45% OZS: 1.19GA1, -3.61 Crel
Expectation for player with 3C1T @ 57% OZS: 1.66GA1, 7.71 Crel
Okay, now that we know “A” is scoring at +.11 expected, and his Crel is +3.61, we can conclude he is playing better than the average player in that situation. Player “B” is scoring at -.16 what an average player would and his Crel is -7.71 what it should be. The actual stat “RDZ” may not be there yet, but the data is very useful. Knowing what a player should get in the situation he’s playing in is just as important as the situation itself.
by OrangeNblacK on Jan 30, 2012 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
I get the how you want to apply, I disagree that it’s useful in comparing those two players against each other, or that it’s even appropriate. The only use it has, IMO, is comparing a player in a given situation to other players in the same type of situation.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
And that’s not a negative, I just think it’s use is limited to that. And I don’t disagree at all as to the usefulness of knowing an expected performance given a certain situation.
Though I do have a question for you in the Talbot thread I’d like you to address.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Yeah pretty much agree with you.
I do appreciate the effort OrangeNblacK so don’t take it the wrong way but as always when you pioneer anything new it faces skepticism; I just don’t think this RDZ stat – in its current form – can be clearly interpreted. Another thing that really bugged me was averaging the GA1/60-Z score and the CRel-Z score. I just think there’s really no need to do that and it detracts from the final stat. Because what you’re implying is GA1 and Crel are both equally relevant to evaluating a player – which may well not be true.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 28, 2012 3:01 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah I don’t want to discourage work, I just want to point out the problems I see with it so people that may not be able to pick them out can see what I view as issues. I’m not trying to take shots at O&B at all. You don’t get anywhere by not making an effort.
And I agree with your other issue.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
It set off my Occam’s Razor alarm. But quantifying a game like hockey is a difficult and complicated task so it maybe certainly justified.
One thing became evident to me though, I think hockey metrics really needs to take a page from baseball and develop better initialism methods. Visually it’s an utter mess once you start floating around enough terms.
Giroux vs. Malkin analysis (top MVP candidates)
Giroux:
1C1T 45.9OZS: Expected GA1- 1.37, Expected CRel: 5.51
-—————————-Actual G+A1: 2.31, Actual CRel: 2.2
-—————————-Variance GA1: .94, Variance CRel: 3.31 1.76, Expected CRel: 8.56
Malkin:
3C1T 65.1OZS: Expected GA1
-—————————Actual GA1: 3.1 , Actual CRel: 13.1
-—————————Variance GA1: 1.34, Variance CRel: 4.54

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