Friday Morning Fly By: I Think Jaromir Knows Who Claude Is Now
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 6:00 AM EST
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Today's open discussion thread, complete with your daily dose of Philadelphia Flyers-related news and notes...
- Some good anecdotes about Claude Giroux in the following stories, as Paul Holmren explains how Jaromir Jagr didn't know who he was: [CSNPhilly] [Toronto Sun]
- Kimmo Timonen is awesome. Go remind yourself of that: [SB Nation Philly]
- Travis says last night's player draft is the best part of All-Star Weekend: [SBNation.com]
- Pavel Datsyuk was the first pick last night, while Logan Couture was left sitting by himself: [SBNation.com]
- Scott Hartnell and Joffrey Lupul shared a toilet last night. The word "swords" is used by one of them. Not awkward at all: [Puck Daddy]
- Going into the second half, the Flyers will need better play at home and continued contributions from their rookies: [SB Nation Philly]
- What should fans expect to happen at the deadline? [Flyers Faithful]
- Marc-Andre Bourdon has been coughing up the puck lately. That has to stop: [The Checking Line]
- Ten highs and ten lows from the month of January: [Bill Meltzer]
- Video segment on the Flyers at the break: [Frequent Flyers]
- Some excerpted quotes from Claude Giroux's interview with Mens Health: [the700level]
- The Phantoms got a Harry Zolnierczyk back temporarily, which offered Tim a chance to speak with him: [PostStar]
- So the NHLPA is going to be releasing videos filmed by players, including Scott Hartnell, Joffrey Lupul, and Martin Biron: [Puck Daddy]
- Jeff Carter is supposedly on the trade block, but if that's true, shouldn't the Blue Jackets' management go too? [Puck Daddy]
- Arguing they should not necessarily be forced out: [The Cannon]
- R.J. Umberger is having a down year. Could he be replaced by... Derek Dorsett?? [The Cannon]
- Another interview about goalie mask designs featuring the two best things associated with the Islanders - Al Montoya and the Fisherman: [Backhand Shelf]
- The Kings lead the group of teams who should breakout in the second half: [Hockey Prospectus]
- Fenwick rankings at the All-Star break: [Arctic Ice Hockey]
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I agree with Travis
The next hockey of any kind I will watch is Winnipeg at the WFC next Tuesday night. But one thing from last night I didn’t like was the drunken idiot peanut gallery. I think it got to a pathetic level of stupidity and it actually took away from the event. Every player not a Senator was heckled and booed. That can’t be what the NHL had in mind. If I was lupul I would be livid and trust me I can take a joke with the best of them.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
by MJDII on Jan 27, 2012 6:55 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
I find it hilarious. The general thought is the Winter Classic is a great event but All Star weekend is a time suck. Truth be told Winter Classic forces a meaningful game to be played in crap conditions all for the sake of an event, where the All Star weekend takes meaningless games/competitions and incorporates them in to a weekend event with a ton of stuff going on. I’ve been to both, the All Star weekend is roughly a million times more fun as an event just to be around. As far as watching on TV goes though, yeah it kind of sucks, but then again so does the WC for different reasons.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
I could care less about the game but the Superskills competition is what this weekend is all about. Granted it’s seemed to have lost a bit of nostalgia in recent years, but growing up it was probably the one night I looked forward to most all season.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z38WH8Gz8-I explains it all.
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I thoroughly enjoyed the 3 on 3 rookies game and super skills when I went to the one in Atlanta. Add to that all the stuff they had going on, and getting to meet a ton of players, it’s just an awesome event. Growing up watching the skills competition was always my favorite, I loved it.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
I would believe the evolution of a rookie is starting out trying as hard as possible not to make mistakes and not take any chances. At some point he starts to feel a little more an more comfortable and begins to add to his game and it is going to have some hiccups. I guess from this point on legitimate evaluation can be made.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
by MJDII on Jan 27, 2012 7:00 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
I completely agree. He’s a rookie – mistakes are to be expected. As you wrote, Bourdon has become more comfortable and we’re seeing him make plays that are less safe. Add that to the fact that defense is the most difficult position in which to make the transition from the AHL to NHL and I don’t think we’re seeing anything worrysome – or for that matter, unexpected.
by mattsotheran on Jan 27, 2012 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
While I agree with both of you that this is the natural learning curve for a rookie defenseman, I disagree that it is not worrysome.
Rookies make mistakes, everybody makes mistakes. But they are a problem that needs to be solved. This isn’t like Couturier making a few rookie mistakes, this is a guy that was playing in the ECHL last year and the Flyers admitted they had all but given up on him as an NHL prospect. In other words, his leash is – rightfully – considerably shorter since we don’t have the confidence that his earlier play is what can be expected.
Marc-Andre Bourdon had a good start to his NHL career, but he does not deserve to play through his struggles for long since he has a much longer history of playing mediocre hockey at the AHL level than he does of playing good hockey anywhere else.
And M, as someone who wanted Andreas Lilja over Danny Syvret, I would think you’d be calling to kick Bourdon’s ass to Glens Falls by now.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
You and I have had a lot of these disagreements about “prospects”. And yes I wanted a savvy, steady, experienced veteran that had been through the wars. I was expecting to get that from Lilja. This season has taken a really strange turn and without many other options bourdon is here so I’m gonna ride the wave. But as I said I believe this month is truly a legitimate NHL evaluation period. And as we have argued, I believe you either got it like Scooter or you don’t. At least we will be able to say if bourdon doesn’t cut it over the next month he is not an option, move on.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
by MJDII on Jan 27, 2012 2:10 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Yeah, I understand that. I’m just shocked you’re giving him a month is all.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
just watching clips of last nights,it just seemed awkward
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Reading those articles
And the comments made by Peter Luuko and the way Giroux presents himself to the media – you just get the feeling that the Flyers have learnt from the Richards lesson. Now all the false-rumors and media-narrative aside, there is no doubting that Richards at times was disliked by a section of the fan community even while being the best player on the Flyers. Richards was the ‘face of the franchise’ but that phrase is all about presenting the franchise to the media and public. I feel Giroux is doing a better job being that face – from a business perspective – than Richards was. Also, it should be noted that if we did not trade Richards when we did his NTC would have kicked in and he would have been locked in as Captain Richie ‘Face of the Flyers’ for years. All very interesting if you think not from a hockey perspective but from a business and public relations perspective.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 27, 2012 7:15 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Richards was the ‘face of the franchise’ but that phrase is all about presenting the franchise to the media and public. I feel Giroux is doing a better job being that face – from a business perspective – than Richards was. Also, it should be noted that if we did not trade Richards when we did his NTC would have kicked in and he would have been locked in
This, so much this. I never did that fanpost I planned, but this is the core of my argument. The Carter trade was to get cap room. While some cap room was received for Richie, too, I believe that trade was primarily about “something else.” PoL has more or less summarized my intended argument here. This wasn’t about hockey talent, and only tangentally, in my opinion, about “locker room chemistry.” This was about how a business differentiates itself to the public, and what a corporation values in its public liaisons and corporate spokespeople. You can argue all you like about a “hockey team not being a company!”, that is absurd in the Comcast/Flyers context. And the Flyers did not want that NTC to kick in for someone they were paying to be a C (in their opinion) who was not good at PR. You do not have to like this analysis (not even sure I do) but I think this had a lot to do with it.
It will be many years before the Richards trade is fully understood and evaluated, and maybe never (kinda like the Lindros trade). Curiously, it will also be on the radar of Kings fans for an entirely different reason if Schenn captures his potential and Simmonds keeps up his current excellence. Then, the trade would be controversial for Kings fans as well.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Also
Someone remind me anout how we managed to get Giroux on an affordable (hell, bargain) contract that leaves him as an RFA at the end?
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 27, 2012 7:18 AM EST reply actions
*about
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 27, 2012 7:18 AM EST up reply actions
Homer saw the mayan calender ending and wanted to go out on a good note?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 9:03 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
This is the most logical explanation.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Because they signed a guy to an RFA contract the way you’re supposed to?
We can be happy about that. But shit, things are gonna be ugly in the 2014 offseason.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
OT
Im sure someone here can help me. Ive installed both Chrome and Firefox and I can not get either of them to import my Bookmarks. I have searched and tried everything Ive read on Google. Neither Chrome nor Firefox will import, although they both “seem” to. I even tried exporting from IE as an html and neither browser imports that either.
How can i get all my IE favorites into Chrome?
by lava96 on Jan 27, 2012 8:03 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Taking a slightly different approach, you can use a plugin called Xmarks to synchronize bookmarks between browsers/computers. It works with IE, Chrome, Firefox, and Safari. I first started using it at home because my computer was dual-boot, and I wanted the same bookmarks regardless of which OS I was using, but then it became even more useful when I moved from Firefox to Chrome, added Win7 to my machine (triple-boot, woo!), and created a subset of my bookmarks that I want to have at work. Definitely recommend it. If you decide to give it a shot, let me know if you have any questions about setting it up.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
If Columbus can get a good return for Carter I think it’s actually a fairly brave move. It’s like how we claim the Flyers won’t be willing to admit their mistake on Bryz and get rid of him as soon as they can…Columbus would be making a big move to admit that they traded Voracek, Couturier and Cousins in an unfortunate misadventure.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 27, 2012 8:18 AM EST reply actions
I will be a very happy fantasy manager if Carter gets traded. I’m not really complaining; he’s been about as productive as the rest of my centers. However, the rest of my centers are 3rd and 4th liner rookies. So. There’s that.
I heart our rookies.
"Who's more crazy? Who's more...weird?"
"That was a fluffernutter!"
by LeepinLizardz on Jan 27, 2012 8:24 AM EST up reply actions
JK…….
but given Carters NTC kicks in at the end of this season you have to think he should be on the move, why Columbus doesn’t part with Rich Nash is still beyond me they need to rebuild for the ground up
Nodl 12G 127GP, Talbot 10G 44GP
I don’t think Carter’s NTC would be much of a problem for Columbus. I assume Carter would keep it in a permanent state of ‘waived’ and remind Howson of the fact at least twice a week.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Jan 27, 2012 8:39 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Exactly.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 8:46 AM EST up reply actions
This made me LOL so hard
"Want a donut go to dunkin donuts, want a linebacker go to Penn State."
- Cris Carter, NFL Draft, 4/25/09
twitter: @princessblueezy
Chris is just kidding, but I proposed that trade last night. Carter + Mason for Bryz, Bartulis, and Cousins.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 8:47 AM EST up reply actions
that was my wondermeant...
I thought maybe send them briere and bryz…we get hopefully happier carter who knows if we don’t think he plays his heart out we send him to bumble fuck and we drop about 12 mill in cap space and get about 5.75 back
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 8:59 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I don’t see them picking up that much salary. They can’t afford to.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
True 7 mill more is a lot for that kinda team
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:18 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Briere has NMC. Not sure he wants to be banished to Columbus, either.
by Georgia_Flyer on Jan 27, 2012 11:22 AM EST up reply actions
Bryz has NMC too.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
NMCs for everyone!
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
by doubleh on Jan 27, 2012 12:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’d move Schenn to wing, personally.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
I agree – am I in the minority that thinks he ‘plays more like a wing’ anyway? Scooter is an OBVIOUS and natural centerman, but Schenn … not so sure.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
Mr. Obvious needs to work on his faceoffs during the offseason.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Yeah, but don’t forget – he is only 19. There’s a lot he can work on in the offseason. (And his 46% isn’t shabby in comparison to his teammates.)
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
I honestly don’t know, but I know moving him to wing has been talked about before.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
Im not good with all the stats, but Schenn have looked stronger on the wing then at center.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 27, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
I like Schenn on the wing but he is a left hand shot playing the RW. This is the most natural of positions. Carter begin the right hand shoot makes more naturally fits the RW. But Jagr is a lefty so there are exceptions I would picture Schenn on the LW with Briere as the center as a more a dynamic fit with Simmonds or Read on the RW.
Nodl 12G 127GP, Talbot 10G 44GP
Carter has that wicked wrister from the off-wing though.
by mattsotheran on Jan 27, 2012 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
Carter would take JvR’s spot when they trade him for a defenseman. Even though he doesn’t like to play winger.
/onlyslightlykidding
by Georgia_Flyer on Jan 27, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
I said carter for bryz straight up and every1 just laughed:(….and made fun of my overuse of elipses problem
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 8:58 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think everyone laughed because of the elipses, while the Carter for Bryz is more of a chuckle because it makes too much sense and zero sense all at the same time.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
That was deep man
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:16 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Ur totally blowin my mind
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:17 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Do you think carter would want to come back and if so would he play his ass off remembering his stalin esque send off to siberia(columbus)
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:35 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think he’d be split on coming back (in a fantasy world). Richie is gone, the team’s identity has almost completely changed even while still playing at a top level, and his place on the depth chart would probably be 3rd line because of G and Briere anchoring the top 2 lines. I think a move out West is what the man needs. Not necessarily to Flyers West, but certainly west of the Mississippi. The dude just needs a “competitive” change of scenery. (I wouldn’t really call Columbus competitive, hence the quotes).
Jagr shoots, Jagr scores!!!!!!
Giroux was Carters center the last season here.
by Anders Jensen on Jan 27, 2012 11:09 AM EST up reply actions
Not sure that was true for most of the year, however IMO those two together were at their best with G centering.
by Georgia_Flyer on Jan 27, 2012 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
The person on the ice most often with Carter last year was Claude Giroux. The person on the ice most often with Giroux last year was Jeff Carter.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 1:22 PM EST up reply actions
Does Mason get buried in the minors? Because there are tons of other backup goalies available that are better than him.
Hell on Ice/In Lou We Trust/Twitter
Everyone has more goals than Scott Gomez
by Kevin Sellathamby on Jan 27, 2012 9:33 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I immediately put him on waivers. I included him more as a favor to Columbus than to use as the Flyers backup.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
good point. Makes sense for both parties I guess.
Hell on Ice/In Lou We Trust/Twitter
Everyone has more goals than Scott Gomez
by Kevin Sellathamby on Jan 27, 2012 10:07 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I don’t know if Columbus wants to do that, but… He’s paid a lot of money, is a pending UFA, and he kinda sucks. Maybe they want to keep him, but I’m betting they’d rather have Sanford at this point. For the Flyers, they can afford to pay a goalie millions of dollars to play in the AHL.
The question then becomes: Do you put Leighton on re-entry or just go with Bacashihua? The Flyers would probably go Leighton, and I wouldn’t be furious.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
What happened to bob?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:19 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Fuckin a! Late to the party as usual for me
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:24 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Lights-Out as the backup, and Bob as the starter … odd, that was my preferred scenario before the season. And everyone hated it then.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
I didn’t.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
I hated it because I hate anything to do with that contract, but it’s about hating the contract, not the player.
Bob.
Right. I hate the contract too, but I’d rather Leighton at $1.55m as a backup – making the two goalies cost $3.3 million – than Bryz as a starter – making the two goalies cost $7.42.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Realistically, Leighton at $1.5m as a ~30 game backup … not too bad if you consider it.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
It’s still not good, but it’s not horrible either.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
Until stupid Lavy starts him in the playoffs, which is why he can’t be the Flyers backup
OPERATION TANK IS A GO. It’s the only explanation for Mike Weber. He’s on a secret mission.
heh fair point.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
Leighton career: .902 SV%, 2.99 GAA with Chicago, ‘Canes, and Flyers. His seasons with more than 19 games played and less than 35, those numbers are pretty accurate, as he maintains a .902 SV% and a 2.92 GAA. Do those numbers say ’starter’ in the NHL … maybe not. But they do say good backup.
Our boy Boucher is in similar range stats-wise, as is Sanford, or Hedberg, or some other pretty serviceable backup goalies. Boosh makes just under a million, Hedberg makes one-and-a-quarter million, and Sanford pulls up the rear at $600k. Budaj makes $1.15m, Alex Auld (!!!) makes a cool million, Scott Clemmensen makes $1.5m as does Dan Ellis and Jose Theodore.
So you’d like to see Leighton’s salary cut by a third at most, but hey – you got ’im, you might as well use ’im!
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 4:36 PM EST up reply actions
But they do say good backup.
I disagree. Of all the goalies since 1998 to face 2000 shots at even strength, Leighton’s 0.902 Sv% is tied for 20th worst. Out of 98 goalies, that’s not “good backup”.
Some “good backups” include:
Manny Legace – 0.911
Chris Mason – 0.911
Martin Gerber – 0.910
Scott Clemmenson – 0.909
Jose Theodore – 0.909
I mean, would you call Joey MacDonald (0.902) a good backup? Jeff Deslauriers (0.901)? Vesa Toskala (0.903)? Rick DiPietro (0.903)? Marc Denis (0.903)?
At least Boucher has been demonstrably better than his career numbers the last three years. Leighton has not.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 28, 2012 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
So you wouldn’t have Hedberg, or Sanford? And yes – I would absolutely call Vesa Toskala a good backup; his numbers suffered greatly behind that hideous defense in Toronto. Take the Toronto years out, and he’s rolling around a .909.
And let me hoist you upon your own petard – if Boosh has been performing better than his career then he’d be a horrible choice because you expect regression to the mean, right???
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 28, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
if Boosh has been performing better than his career then he’d be a horrible choice because you expect regression to the mean, right??
If you’re picking him expecting (and paying for) .916 goaltending because that’s what he did last year, then he’s a horrible choice, because his career .901 rate is a better guess of his future.
But “regression to the mean” doesn’t mean we expect him to hit .885 and balance out or anything. Given two goalies with the same career average, where one has been above that average lately and one has been below it, I’d take the one who’s been above it, since there’s some chance he has improved.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
Alright stats-boy … quantify that one.
there’s some chance he has improved.
I actually would agree with you … but I doubt significantly that the stats will supoprt it. Theer are too many corollary factors: age, team, external factors, etc. I was only using the Boosh example as a ‘poking the beast’ for Geoff, where his own words bite him in the ass.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 30, 2012 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think Boucher’s talent is correctly judged by only looking at his previous three years, thus I would expect some regression – as I repeatedly said he could not be expected to have another year like last year – but there’s at least something to suggest Boucher is better than Leighton, which is what I said.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 30, 2012 1:26 PM EST up reply actions
Um. I’m not sure what you’re challenging me on here.
The hypothetical I posed was a choice between two goalies with the same career numbers, one who had been better than those numbers in recent years and one who had been worse. I posited that there is some chance that the goalie who has been better in recent years is now better, and you demand quantified proof?
Does that mean you’re prepared to argue that there is absolutely no possibility that the goalie who has been better in recent years is now better? That it’s absolutely impossible that the goalie who has been worse in recent years has suffered some aging or injury that now makes him an inferior goalie.
I didn’t say it was statistically likely that the goalie with lesser numbers is now worse; I only said there was some chance. Statistical proof of “some chance” would require me to find only a single occasion where the goalie who had lower recent numbers went on to have a lesser remainder of his career. Are you prepared to argue that no such occasion exists, or did you just misunderstand the concept of “some chance”?
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
Submitted as proof that there is some chance that the goalie who has been better recently is now better:
At the end of 2008, Tim Thomas and Marty Turco each had .913 career save percentages. Over the three previous years, Thomas had gone .917-.905-.921, while Turco had gone .898-.910-.909.
Since then, Thomas has gone .933-.915-.938-.933, while Turco has gone .898-.913-.897-out_of_hockey. The probability that Thomas’ .930 over 4726 shots and Turco’s .903 over 4397 shots came from two goalies with the same talent is 0.00000166.
Therefore, I submit that Thomas, who had the better recent results, was in fact now better, and that therefore there is some chance that the goalie with better recent results is in fact now better.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
OK, you win. And I admit – once in a while, I just like to see the hamster wheels a-spinnin’.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 31, 2012 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
I coulda sworn that I read in one of McManus’ pieces around the time of the Outdoor Classic that Leighton said that if the Flyers have an injury, they’d bring Bacashihua up first because he costs a million less.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
With Ilya Bryzgalov and Sergei Bobrovsky signed to long-term deals in Philadelphia, there was never a place for him with the Flyers this season. His play with the Phantoms – and it’s been good enough to earn him a third trip to the All-Star Classic – won’t do anything to change that. His prohibitive salary cap hit ensures that.
“If there’s an injury up there, they’re going to call up (Jason Bacashihua). And I’ve expected that. They told me that when I get sent down that would probably be the scenario,” Leighton said.
Great article, actually.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
Right, but that’s if there’s an injury. If the Flyers traded their starting goalie, they need a backup for the remainder of the season.
Bacashihua makes perfect sense as a short-term replacement since he doesn’t have to go through re-entry. But as a permanent backup goalie, the stakes completely change.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, that’s true.
I guess then you’d have to decide which risk is larger: the risk of Leighton getting caught on re-entry waivers at $775k, or the risk of Bacashihua coming up and them proceeding to ride Bob into the ground. Which couldn’t possibly end poorly.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
well couldnt they just bring leights up in the offseason seeing as bob hasnt had that many starts i would mind him starting more or most of the games even
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Well, in the off-season Leighton is UFA, so none of it matters.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly. It’s the risk associated with Bacashihua which makes me reconsider my “never put anybody on re-entry waivers” stance.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:09 PM EST up reply actions
Bacashihua makes perfect sense as a short-term replacement since he doesn’t have to go through re-entry. But as a permanent backup goalie, the stakes completely change.
So then hopefully we can stop talking about scenarios where we trade Bob because we have Bryz and he’s not needed…
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Would Leighton clear though? The Flyers would still be on the hook for half of his hit, correct?
by mattsotheran on Jan 27, 2012 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
If claimed on re-entry, the Flyers would have half his hit against their cap, yes.
Would he clear? No idea. I didn’t think he’d clear last April, but he did. If you trade Bryz to Columbus, the only team I can think of that could claim Leighton is Tampa. It’s a risk, but is the risk/reward better than the risk/reward of using Bacashihua instead?
But again, this is all in the highly unlikely hypothetical of the Flyers trading Ilya Bryzgalov before the deadline. Highly unlikely.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
What, no Calvert?
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*Statement has not been verified nor regressed
by George E. Ays on Jan 27, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
That was my proposal on Twitter :)
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, you proposed Calvert, not Mason… but I agree on Mason. Who knows what a change of scenery can do.
by tinmansstory on Jan 27, 2012 6:32 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I forget who it was that countered with that. It makes sense from Columbus’ point of view.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 28, 2012 12:12 AM EST up reply actions
Anything good from the draft last night? I don’t really pay attention to the All-Star game, it’s kind of like my break from watching hockey
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 8:35 AM EST reply actions
Wow. NHL.COM has it Couture C San Jose Sharks. By now they still haven’t got that changed. That is slower then the MLB.
I wasn't even a year old but I stayed up to be outside the Vet with my Dad and Mom when the Phillies won the World Series 1980.
I am Stupid that is all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I wasn't even a year old but I stayed up to be outside the Vet with my Dad and Mom when the Phillies won the World Series 1980.
by Christopher A on Jan 27, 2012 8:38 AM EST up reply actions
Am I the only one who wants the team to just stand pat and do nothing at the deadline? Worry about fixing their issues next year.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Probably….if they can pull off a steal for a longterm d man I want it done
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 9:01 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Nope I agree, unless moves are made for the future and we shed players for future considerations; but that won’t happen, and deals for the future don’t happen for “buyers” at the deadline.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Yeah I’m a little concerned about what might take place at the deadline.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Me too.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jan 27, 2012 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
Unless you’re Brad Boyes
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
I’m in that boat myself. I just don’t see what can be done now that couldn’t better be handled in the off-season. The supposed ‘need’ for a defenseman is just a myth; the Flyers defense is just fine. So unless you find some team desperate enough to take some salary dumps off our hands, then you stand pat.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 1:17 PM EST up reply actions
It’s fine now. The rookies are playing well and Timonen is made of steel. But what is the contingency plan for an inevitable injury or dip in play?
by mattsotheran on Jan 27, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions
OT
Sitting in stat class…the hell is the big draw here I’m bored out of my mind
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:15 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Stats don’t get fun until you get to the applications of them. Take something like econometrics or forecasting if math and modeling are your things.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Well is stat as hard as algebra cause I can’t do algebra to save my life
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:28 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Depends, people get certain types of math more easily than others. Stats isn’t particularly natural for me, I was more in to matrix calculus (probably because engineering was my main point of interest for a long time), but I enjoyed the applications of advanced stats (not referring to sports here) more and more as I learned more and more about it, so that’s what I ended up following.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
Interesting … I didn’t think anyone besides my mother found matrix calculus stimulating. I sure as hell don’t. Natural systems modeling (which, yes, does include some uncertainty measures that are best created fractally or matrices-based) was more my interest as an engineer. (My mom is a calc professor, BTW.)
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
I have my BS in Chemical Engineering, which might help explain it.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
That actually does make sense; the mutability of the hydrocarbon bonds always confused the shit outta me. I went for more concrete engineering (excuse the pun), so my degree is civil.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
Stats was kinda forced on me when I was a med student. T tests, confidence intervals, etc. I struggled with it at first, but grasped it when I had to do more advanced stuff, ironically. I was half-annoyed when I was about to publish my first journal article and found out our research staff kept a statistician on hand to do the real handiwork
Jagr shoots, Jagr scores!!!!!!
HA!
Have fun with all your fancy maths. As a Computer Engineering major I only had to deal with 0s and 1s. That and a lot of boolean algebra.
And all I've done for want of wit, To mem'ry now I can't recall.
So fill to me the parting glass, Good night and joy be with you all.
by PyropenguinX on Jan 27, 2012 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
OT:
Ferris Bueller 2? Don’t know how I feel about that.
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Jan 27, 2012 10:23 AM EST reply actions
Todays day and age? Probably bad….even though I’ve never seen the first
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:25 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
It’s Broderick…could go either way.
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Jan 27, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
*Facepalm Go rent/stream/buy that this weekend. Seriously.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Jan 27, 2012 9:07 PM EST up reply actions
Are you kidding me?
Is it Ferris trying to figure out his 401 k?
"Can I refill your eggnog for you? Get you something to eat? Drive you out to the middle of nowhere and leave you for dead?"
by PraiseMartyMoose on Jan 27, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
Any word on a friends movie….matt perry needs a career jumpstart
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:30 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Could be just a commercial?
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Jan 27, 2012 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
See I think it has to be, I mean what point is there to remake that movie. Unless they have Cameron married to some crazy woman or has joined a cult and Ferris sneaks him out.
"Who's more crazy, me? Or defensemen? Who's more weird?"----- Ilya Bryzgalov
"Grow some balls and just do it" ---- Claude Giroux
Semper Fi...
It’s for a Honda commercial
http://jalopnik.com/5879809/exclusive-ferris-buellers-mysterious-super-bowl-ad-is-for-honda
Prepare your sleep apparatus.
On the twitterverse
Is that fenwick article saying NYR is do for a big time regression?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
by reaper1221 on Jan 27, 2012 10:39 AM EST via mobile reply actions
No, it’s not.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
"Oh, that sensible and sober* Rangers fan guy who is cool, actually" - Dominik, Lighthouse Hockey
*Statement has not been verified nor regressed
by George E. Ays on Jan 27, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
We will come to some sort of agreement on this trade eventually, Shaun
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 10:49 AM EST reply actions
If you don’t I have one sitting and waiting for him hahaha.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
you should take it then, honestly. I have a hard time evaluating my players right now anyway. Lucic, Horton, Bolland and Ryan are performing fairly well right now. As a combo in net I am losing a starter spot, but the only way I see fully utilizing that spot is if I get a player like Skinner in return
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
Personally i think Rinne > Elliot & Halak. One Rinne always me to be lazy, two Rinne has played in 90% of Nashville’s games so you aren’t really gaining that many more starts, and three Elliot is not as good as the numbers he has posted. Basically Shaun gains ~4 starts but gives away ~5 shots against per game. So he MAY get 4 wins, but he actually will lose 34 shots against total if Rinne plays 90% of the remaining games this season (as he has through 49 games). So it’s kind of a wash if you include the effort needed to figure constantly check who’s getting the start that night.
Shaun knows my deal, I think I’m over paying, I’m not even entirely sure I like the deal, but I may do it out of boredom and a gamble on a player.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
One Rinne always me to be lazy
That should be allows me to be lazy.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
then it won’t happen then. No sweat off my back
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Just my POV, doesn’t mean Shaun agrees. I’m sure Shaun doesn’t agree a with me that I’m not really getting much outside of a few wins for trading Lehtonen for Rinne, so I shouldn’t have to make up that big of a gap.
But yeah, emotional attachments do that, and Shaun and I both have emotional attachments to Rinne that changes the price I guess, meh. But you probably have more stuff that’ll help him, so I think he wants to work things out with you.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
…and he’s offering me Blues. Haha.
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Jan 27, 2012 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
McDonagh/Elliot/Halak for Wheeler/Rinne?
Drop the forwards since we can’t really agree on them?
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Jan 27, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
McDonagh is my best defenseman.
And we will work this out, I am confident in that
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
The Hartnell/Lupul bathroom exchanged cracked me up. Hartsy is still antagonizing the fellow all-stars hahahaha. His tweets during the draft were great too. This is a guy that’s just truly thrilled to be there and be considered amongst the top players in the world. I’m so happy for him.
Jagr shoots, Jagr scores!!!!!!
I enjoyed the Giroux interview in Men’s Health too… I only read the 700 Level post, but if I have time, I’m going to read the rest. He gave great insight and his answer about Jagr was awesome.
www.southpawcurve.blogspot.com - check out my baseball blog!!
After all the issues with “Cooter” as a sobriquet, “Jeep” has a nice ring to it….
by Lesion of Doom on Jan 27, 2012 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
So I just noticed this… apparently Scooter is one of the players blogging his experience at the ASG this year.
http://www.nhl.com/ice/blogpost.htm?id=5974
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jan 27, 2012 12:24 PM EST reply actions
Mike Richards "rapping"
Mike, I love you, but if such a thing as charisma really exists, you have zero of it.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Yeah, he was really dry in that video.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
OT but needs to be seen after last night
This is an absolute case of overreaction and is a prime example why journalism is dead. Media pushed this story as a controversy and forced Thomas to respond as if this has NEVER happened before.
Theo Epstein wasn’t fired by The Red Sox when he chose not to go. Manny Ramirez wasn’t traded for not going to the White House with a handful of other players. (although he forced his was out later).
The St. Louis Cardinals didn’t trade Pujols or fire Larussa for not going.
NOT ONE NBA TEAM that has visited the White House in the past decade visited 100% intact.
NO uproar there.
But notice, NOT ONE Boston or Canadian columnist or newspaper noted that, did they?
This overreaction by Kevin Dupont, TSN’s Dave Hodge and others is ridiculous and is a prime example of the Media creating a controversy to sell papers.
* A Like
* Reply
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
My reaction
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
new 2 journalism or new to the way things people want things to work now adays
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
over-reaction.
eventually ones accepts cynicism and doesn’t believe a single word that comes about on twitter, unless it’s funny
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
and doesn’t believe a single word that comes about on twitter, unless it’s funny
Unless its from Paulina Gretzky.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
#FireRoseman
@boknows71
sorry, just can’t do it
When I look at her I see Gretzky
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
Wow, never saw her before. Although she’s totally not my type, and yet another woman who looks better in her natural hair color, I’m surprised I didn’t even realize she existed.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 4:42 PM EST up reply actions
The St. Louis Cardinals didn’t trade Pujols or fire Larussa for not going.
They didn’t “trade Pujols or fire Larussa for not going” because the Cards visited the White House a week ago, which, y’know, was one month after Albert Pujols left the Cardinals (and in the process became one of the least liked people in St. Louis) and two months after Tony La Russa retired.
People are stupid.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
pffft, well it’s still true then…
Proud provider of the PECO Power Play.
by coheedandtbs on Jan 27, 2012 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
And just quickly going through past articles on NBA teams visiting the White House, most of those absences sound like they were just players who went to different teams after the season ended. (Other than Delonte West. This is funny.)
That, obviously, is quite different from what Thomas has done, which is quite clearly “I’m not going because I dislike the President and completely disagree with his views.”
Curious, reaper: where the hell is this quote from?
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
i think pd i forget..but still a snub is a snub
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
If it was a Yahoo commenter, I’m really not expecting accuracy and/or coherence.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
I disagree. Did Kris Versteeg snub the President when he didn’t join the Blackhawks on their visit despite no longer being on the team? I don’t think so.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
i do..he had the money to make the trip and im sure they wouldnt have had a problem since he did win the cup…im looking at this in a completely independent way….while childish its not the first time some 1 invited didnt show
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
So this is the same as Tim Thomas:
"It’s pretty cool to get the chance to go the White House, but after thinking about it I just decided to take a pass and let those guys enjoy themselves. I’m still buddies with [the Blackhawks], but I haven’t been on that team for almost a year. […] I’m on a team [the Flyers] that might play [the Blackhawks] again. Who knows?""
Yeah, no. Not even close to the same thing.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
maybe thats a pr move? how do we know versteeg just didnt want bad publicity?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Then he decided not to go for different reasons. Tim Thomas was making a protest. If Kris Versteeg isn’t saying he’s protesting, he can’t be protesting.
Thus, completely different snubs.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
but still a snub
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
In your opinion apparently. I don’t consider it a snub, at least with respect to the President.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
my opinion is that theres a bias going here my the media
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Welcome to the world. You went down the Versteeg wormhole and said you still consider it a snub, I don’t, it’s opinion at that point. That’s where I commented, not on the way the media conducts itself.
being obnoxious and self righteous while ignoring the point since 9/29/11
independent…… kinda hate mainstream media for this whole reason
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Then we disagree on the definition of the word.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 3:12 PM EST up reply actions
I think, at least in Versteeg’s case, bailing on your current team, the one that lost to your old team, for your old team, is probably not a good idea.
I was kinda surprised that Kaberle went with the Bruins, actually. Wonder how the Habs took that.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Jan 27, 2012 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
Right?
Players who are no longer with the team failing to join their old team on the White House trip is not the same as Tim Thomas saying “I can’t stand in the same room as the President because I hate government.”
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
hey hey, it’s I hate The Government
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
“That’s what happens when you make bad decisions in your life. You can’t go to the White House.”
lol
by mattsotheran on Jan 27, 2012 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Out of all of this, I forget which TSN reporter it was, jokingly implied that Thomas was a member of the KKK. I would’ve laughed, if Libertarians weren’t characterized as racists to begin with (as has been my experience)
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:14 PM EST reply actions
I get serious laughs too when the Department of Education authorizes search warrants for individuals based on the fact that they didn’t pay their college loans
Seriously, it makes me chuckle LOL
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
Is TT a Libertarian? I heard he was a member of the Tea Party, which shares/shared some of the same beliefs (in it’s original form before the religious factions took hold), but not all.
Either way, the TSN analysts’ joke was stupid, but these people who start their kids names with all the same letters (I’m looking at you, Briere) frustrate me.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
I’m still on the fence about what Thomas is. What he said was very Libertarian, and something I believe to be true. However, from what I read, he’s donated to the Tea Party in its current form
So it’s the same words that mean slightly different things to different groups. It seems like Thomas’ Libertarian brand is low taxes/civil liberties/high defense spending, and well to be short, that’s not the message that i prescribe to
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, it’s still a lot of gov’t, just the kind of gov’t that blows up shit. Also, the current Tea Party is not high on civil liberties, so I’m confused as to why he’d say what he said and then donate to them. I do know that he is very into Glenn Beck, as is Pujols and LaRussa.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
And that’s where I kind of just scratch my head and ask why Glenn Beck? it also kind of takes away from the Gadsden flag I keep in my room. Oh well, First World problem
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:28 PM EST up reply actions
i would guess its still the same reason some people back occupy wallstreet…it started out a novel idea and turned into a homeless hippies orgy of a lifetime fill with public defication and crime
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
All movements have succubi who glom on to them with their own personal agendas. ’Twas always thus and always thus shall be.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
exaxtly…much why people still classify themselves as republicans and democrats even though moth have moved far far away from what they once were
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
The Republicans aren’t really even republicans anymore. They’ve been hijacked by special interest groups and have moved so far right I don’t even know where the middle is anymore.
I’m going to re-register as a GD independent, but if I do that I can’t vote in certain elections. It’s stupid.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Let’s stop this right here. No need to focus on one political party.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Let’s spread our hate/love equally.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
#FireRoseman
@boknows71
Sorry, I’m just disillusioned today, Geoff.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
No worries. I just don’t want this to get out of control.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
Nicely done Geoff
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
the republicans are republicans because they have become corporatists and the liberals arnt liberals because they have become for lack of a better word socialist lite…i havent registered yet my self but im going independant as well
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
damn it i need to start reading below b4 i hit post
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Agreed – both parties spend their time on non-issues, and then recommence feeding at the public trough. I am a registered Republican, and am generally appalled at the ‘issues’ they care to debate. Not that the Democrats are any better, frankly. In the modern era of instant-results polls, the parties have decided that catering to their ‘base constituents’ – which seems to be defined as the tinfoil hat crowd who have nothing better to do than answer telephone polls midday – is the best idea, rather than working together towards the common good of us all. It’s disheartening.
Maxime Talbot - in the Orange and Black ... better than chocolate and peanut butter!
by MaximumTalbot on Jan 27, 2012 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
It seems to be the logical conclusion of the two-party state. Both parties during their primaries cater to the extremists in the party, then, during the actual election, try to be as close to the middle as possible to grab the independent voters and the non-traditional party members (Yellow Dogs, Log Cabins, etc). They set themselves up as essentially polar opposites on most issues, and that’s based on opposition to the other party rather than a cohesive philosophical grounding. It’s unlikely to happen, but a true multi-party system would allow for more consistent political parties, while the compromises within the House and Senate would return, rather than whichever party is out of power utilizing every method possible to prevent business from proceeding.
Bob.
Yes. In this context multiple personalities is healthy. Bi-Polar is not.
What the World Needs Now
Is a New Kind of Tension
’Cuz the Old One Just Bores Me to Death
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 27, 2012 7:43 PM EST up reply actions
In OT news...
I GOT INTO GRAD SCHOOL HOLY CRAP.
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
Is there a Grad school for .gif posting and being DWMP? j/k, congrats!!!
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Haha, there’s probably a school for everything.
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
Well done sir. If you are someone that indulges in frosty cold beverages I hope you have a few too many tonight.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
#FireRoseman
@boknows71
Haha, I’m a girl. But thanks. I may have to have something alcoholic.
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
Ya think I’d read people’s taglines.
Don’t have too many drinks then, guys will take advantage of that. Trust me.
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
#FireRoseman
@boknows71
Haha, my tagline doesn’t mention it at al.
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
Congrats!!! This is wonderful feedback about your abilities!
/repressing instinct to type “RUN FOR YOUR LiFE!! NOW!! WHILE YOU CAN!!”
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Sweet jukes. Whatcha going for?
Keeping alive the old Vaudeville joke, "I'd rather be dead than play Philadelphia."
Well, if I end up going to this program (because I did apply to others) I will get a Ph.D. in Chemistry and an M.S. in Forensic Science
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jan 27, 2012 3:13 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
on another side note
how is anonymous hacking dana white not internet terrorism….the things they do for human causes aside how is that particular attack not terrorism?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
As a past 4chan user in a past life, Anon just likes to cause havoc. They “personal army” for people when it is in their best interests to do so. Otherwise, they just like chaos. Dana White challenged them, they accepted, and well Dana White knows that Anon doesn’t full around
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
fool*
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
i simply see it as “if you dont agree with us we take you out” which is exactly what a dictator would do…just in an informational sense
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Sounds like a Hollywood response to a certain bill being shot down
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
yeah but that was done legally through voices of the citizens
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
yeah, and then Hollywood yanked their funding to the White House
I remember that kid when i was growing up who would take his football home with him when his team was losing
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
im not sure what your trying to say….what im saying is if your going to do something do it legally
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
and what I’m trying to say is that if the other side is as crooked as they come, selling their votes to the highest bidder, then I really don’t care about legality. I will not break the law, but I will not condemn others for speaking their mind in a time when it seems the people’s opinions matter less and less
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
see but that starts the slipper slope argument of what happens when no1 defys them and they realize they can get whatever they want if they just threaten to hack every1 who stands in their way?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
you’re assuming these are highly motivated individuals. They do things for the “Lulz” so to speak. There will be blowback on their part, and it’s probably already occurred in some shape or form. Names of Anons have been leaked to the authorities, so on and so forth.
I do not condemn what they are doing, but I will not support them either. They are not heroes or protagonists. They are a gray area, nothing more or less
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Jan 27, 2012 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
when they broke the law, yes
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
however i see where your headed with this as a character assasination
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
besides did they even break any laws on the books that are here today? or just the archaic ones of back then
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
That’s a false dilemma fallacy (as well as phrasing things in pejorative language). The concept of a law being unethical has as much relevance now as it did in the past. I don’t agree with Anonymous’ methods, but even now, legal and ethical are two distinctly different concepts.
Bob.
well if we are going to start using debate terms…isnt yours a straw man ?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Do you see the problem with this thinking? They only seem “archaic” now, with the hindsight of history making them unjust in a way that was not at all obvious at the time to many people.
Sometimes the change comes from those in power. But sometimes it has to come from the people.
Apartheid in South Africa would not have changed if blacks and coloreds did not organize, rise up and draw world attention to what was going on. Are you saying that they should have only done what was legal? The only legal options available to them were to bend to white rule.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:38 AM EST up reply actions
All you need for a quality homeland dwelling is
One morning, as Illya Bryzgalov was waking up from anxious dreams, he discovered that in his bed he had been changed into a monstrous verminous bug. He lay on his armour-hard back and saw, as he lifted his head up a little, his brown, arched abdomen divided up into rigid bow-like sections.
Nice mashup.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:04 PM EST up reply actions
so your comparing anonymous’ hacking people who dont agree with their opinion to nelson mandela and dr king? im not talking about them hacking organizations im talking about hacking people who rightly say what they are doing is illegal
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
No. You are.
The Dark: Would you have said that to Dr. King and Nelson Mandela?
You: when they broke the law, yes
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
i didnt bring them up an answer to a straw man isnt the straw man
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
It doesn’t matter that you didn’t bring them up. It matters that you said King and Mandela should have resorted to legal means to create change. That’s the point here.
You didn’t say:
“No. That was different. Here’s why…..” And then you said something about how they didn’t break any current laws, only past ones. That’s why I responded. Whether or not someone created a strawman argument didn’t force you to respond the way you did.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
what did king and mandela do that was illegal?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
One example for each:
Mandela was arrested for committing sabotage.
King was arrested for sitting in a whites-only section of a restaurant.
Why are you asking the question?
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
because i wasnt really a history person..however were those two instances what made things change or was it the showing of freedom of assembly where they got huge amounts of people to march and get action
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
What difference does it make? it was illegal. You said that King and Mandela should have limited themselves to legal actions.
In addition, these questions you’re asking seem to be an effort to determine King’s and Mandela’s ends and means. Why should that matter? All that matters is that they broke the law, which they shouldn’t have done, according to you.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
honestly this argument bores me because it doesnt pertain to what i was originally talking about… i was talking about anonymous attacking innocent people because they disagreed..unless king and mandela attack people then it has no place in the discussion..its a straw man i should have never answered and just because i answered it doesnt mean that it pertain s to the discussion. my thoughts when i answered it were if they did what anonymous did and attacked people then yes its illegal…whether u see that as a false dillema fallacy is none of my concern
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Well you’re bored enough to not notice that I said nothing about a “false dilemma fallacy.” That was someone else.
Your boredom suggests that you’re only interested in arguments that you start and that stay specifically on your point.
And yes, King and Mandela “attacked” a lot of people with their actions and words. Their attacks were greater than what Anonymous has done. So it’s not a strawman, it’s completely pertains to your argument, using your own standards.
This has been fun, but it’s sunny outside. Can I just conclude that you think King and Mandela should have limited themselves to legal means, since you said yes and haven’t changed that? I promise I won’t attack your character.
My first rule here: Never take it personally. If I do, it’s my bad, even if the other person meant it personally.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:24 PM EST up reply actions
but i dont i swear
words and actions "arnt the same as intentionally trying to ruin some1s life the way anonymous has done with releasing ss numbers bank statements adresses etc
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Cybercrimes can be very serious, but I’ll disagree with you, if you really think that action is worse than any of these conditions that are a result of many actions:
- living under law that prevents you from sitting where you would like on a bus, because of the color of your skin
- being deprived of any of the opportunities that we take for granted as basic rights, because of the color of your skin
- being threatened by a bunch of liberals who want to destroy society by making blacks and coloreds equal under the law
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
your talking about what those who were against equality felt like…so like you said its different, im talking about opression through terrorism with no way to stop it, equality was achieved
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
“Equality was achieved.” Do you know how many people were killed before this happened in the U.S. and in South Africa? How many people were physically beaten, their property destroyed, children threatened, lives on hold or ruined? Whites and blacks?
Again, if you want to call this cyber-based “oppression through terrorism” worse, fine. I’m not stopping you. I disagree.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:51 PM EST up reply actions
its not worse its different
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Ok. Separate but equal, I guess. Let’s just disagree.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
ok but im not sure what we are even disagreeing about any more…..i need hockey
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
fine then in your opinion do ends justify means?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
The only reasonable answer to such a general question is that “It depends.”
You accuse someone of creating a “strawman” and then when you’re talking with someone else you take a specific point they’re making and try to turn it into an absurdly broad generalization. How is that any better than creating a strawman?
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
because that general statement is exactly what is being inferred here…anonymous is out of control. they attack anything and everything they dont agree with regardless of whether or not its popular opinion that its wrong…case and point hack ufc because its supports sopa. ok do they really think that ufc is the one with the big pull? no they arnt ,how popular is ufc that they have pull in legislation.but ok that had to do with sopa. but when dana white says he doesnt agree with what they are doing and calls them terrosists(which is exactly what they became with the personal attack) the line has been crossed.
its no longer about some humanitarian effort against censorship, its now a personal vendetta over name calling…same with the ps3 break in..ok they are pissed about ps3 user agreement but the way they make a point is to take innocent un knowing peopls info….wtf?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
I’m inferring nothing about your argument. I’m focused on your claim that King and Mandela should not have broken the law. You keep wanting to change the subject and focus. So, same question THe Dark asked….
“Would you say the same to King and Mandela?”
Would you give the same answer?
Also, it was a reasonable and thoughtful question and then you respond by saying he’s heading towards “character assassination?” Huh? Where in any of this thread is anyone going after your character? It’s about your argument.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
no its not my argument it wasnt my argument as soon as we got away from anonymous…you honestly dont see where a character assasination could come from? i didnt say we was i was just preparing for it in terms of a civil rights movement…something along the lines of “you dont agree with the civil rights movement because u think you should always follow the law meaning you dont agree with nelson mandela or dr king” yes ive heard that b4 and it isnt the case
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
I see where it “could” come from. I could also see how it wouldn’t be, and based on the rest of thread it obviously wasn’t about that. So you make an assumption and attack someone else’s character by assuming that they’re going to attack yours. How does this improve things?
Perhaps you’ll take this as a character assassination too. What if he’d said “Washington and Jefferson” instead of “King and Mandela”? They broke laws too. Should they have continued to obey the law as British colonists?
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
ok now this is getting wierd
i was literally sitting and thinking if this would go toward the american revolution…and it did
get out of my brain!
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
That’s where the fun starts. You find an example that works for you and compare it to another that doesn’t and ask yourself why. What’s the difference? Is it because of the facts, or just your perspective?
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:27 PM EST up reply actions
with how far to the side we are im not sure which comment this is an answer to. so now legality is a perspective?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
The suggestion that Washington/Jefferson has some parallels to King/Mandela.
The “perspective” vs. “fact” that I’m talking about is the same as when in one game a Flyer takes a hit and we want a suspension and the next game a Flyer gives the same hit and we think a suspension is absurd.
And yes, legality is absolutely a perspective. It’s not a permanent truth, like 2+2=4. Your statement about yesterday’s “archaic” laws is an acknowledgement that legality is perspectival.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
i disagree, i think its only perspective in undeveloped society which we were. but again we have gone away from my point so now my to get back to it, do you think what anonymous did to dana white was terroristic? if not why so?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
I know too little about the details to say. My interest in this discussion was about whether citizens should only resort to legal means to achieve their ends. That’s where I came in and the only time I’ve strayed is to say that I think the consequences of racial discrimination in the United States and South Africa were greater.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:55 PM EST up reply actions
then if you disagree with some1 online and they hack your personal information and spread it around, would you call the cops?
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
or appropriate authority…i think its fbi who handle hacking
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
it may be a thoughtful question but it takes the conversation in a completely different direction and into past sets of laws..im thinking in terms of todays laws on terrorism, i was then asked to answer a question about dr king while still thinking in terms of todays laws yet it was actually in terms of laws in the past
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
It’s not about the specific laws. It’s about the general question of whether one should never break the law as a means to the end. You said that King and Mandela should not have. You didn’t say:
“I don’t know history.”
“That’s different.”
“It depends.”
You said “yes.” And you still haven’t changed that.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
i just told you my thinking on it..i wasnt thinking in terms of past laws i was thinking in terms of laws now…so back then if i were alive and know what i know now ..no they did fine….but it certainly is different since from my limited knowledge of the civil rights movement i dotn think king ordered personal attacks on people
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
I would say that if you want to have a full understanding of something that is happening now a historical context is essential. Including the awareness that back then they didn’t know what we know now.
Based on quotes from the time, many whites opposed to the civil rights movement felt like it was a powerful attack on their way of life, and an unjust attack. Against nature, against the laws of God. And King was certainly a leader of this attack.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
but it wasnt really an attack..it was a change…..having your personal information sent oiut so some1 can steal your identity isnt something you learn to live with its an attack
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
I couldn’t possibly disagree more.
Watch some video of what happened on the street in the American South and South Africa during this “change.” Or a good movie about the details of daily life during the American Revolution.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
i dont think u understand what i just said….to those who didnt want equality may have thought it was an attack but it wasnt
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
yes it was. their way of life was under attack and they were furious and terrified, both because of what the changes might mean and because people from outside their localities were telling them what to do and what was right and wrong.
I’d rather have my computer hacked than have the state tell me that I need to live next to a bunch of Rangers fans. That’s sarcastic of course but the point is that although I spend a lot of time on my computer and my life would be fucked if somebody hacked it, you’re comparing this to massive political/social movements that affected tens of millions of people, a bloody angry transformation of society that affected how people lived and experienced life constantly.
If your computer identity or you think someone else’s online identity is as important as that, ok. Can we just disagree?
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 2:07 PM EST up reply actions
but im not disagreeing! im simply saying it has nothing to do with online terrorism..of course it was a bigger deal
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
ok. it’s been a stimulating discussion. i am now leaving my online identity and going for a skate. enjoy your day.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
Also, I’m not saying that in some near or distant post-singularity future that we won’t decide that protecting our data is more important than protecting our bodies, physical property and other traditional rights. I just don’t think that’s where we are.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 28, 2012 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
The Boys of Statistics
Ted Williams is yet again ahead of the curve.
From glacial grave, a baseball godhead will
blossom, his skull flowers hacking the ISS
net, roots linking every satellite, neo-hived
geosynchronus eyes oversee every game
i just noticed a parallel between Max Headroom and Francis Bacon’s Shrieking Popes. something about those lines behind him.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 30, 2012 2:18 AM EST up reply actions
sweet. i love those paintings. in fact I don’t think there’s a Bacon that I don’t like. He’s easily in the J Reed’s Ironically Scoff’s At “Best OF” Lists Pantheon of the Great Modern Artists. Up there with Chagall and Duchamp…and begrudgingly Picasso. You know P made alot of great paintings but holy shit there isn’t a pitch that he wouldn’t swing at. Some great ISO and SLG numbers but also lot’s of dinks, bleeders, seeing eye singles and ground ball outs. He was only 5 foot 3 and girls could not resist his stare….
/link’d for the WTFers because I’m an asshole
I was introduced to Bacon in an exhibit at the Hirshhorn in DC back in the mid-80s. The poster outside showed the least gruesome painting in the entire collection, early and quite unrepresentative, but it drew in the street crowd. It was fun watching folks work their way from the first room “these are nice” to the second room “he must have had a bad day” to the third “oh” to the fourth “hon, the kids are crying.”
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Jan 30, 2012 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
Just something you should probably keep in mind, but I’d be careful with statements like
they attack anything and everything they dont agree with regardless of whether or not its popular opinion that its wrongbecause in the cases that have been brought up here, the humanitarian things that King and Mandela were fighting for weren’t popular opinion either. Right and wrong can be quite subjective, and popular opinion isn’t always a good indicator for which is which.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Jan 28, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
well im going to use flyerfanchicagos hits and say that is different
Beets,Bears,Battlestar Galactica.
MICHAEL!
Political Correctness - the belief that one can pick up a turd by the clean end.
"I got a crosscheck to the face and lost a bunch of teeth. You battle through it. That’s the way hockey players are made." - Claude Giroux
Any Bryz trade for Carter is pure fantasy. However, given that, it does yield wonderful possible fantasy dialog.
Homer: Jeff, I understand you’ve been made aware of our impending trade of Bryzgalov, Bartulis, Cousins, Shelley and a #1 draft choice for you, Steve Mason and Matt Calvert. Before we consummate the trade, I asked Columbus to give me a chance to have a discussion with you about it.
Carter: Sure, Mr. Holmgren!
Homer: First, you have to know, we would want you to be willing to play where you are needed. For example, you’ll start as 4th line center, between Harry Z-whatshisname and Zac Rinaldo.
Carter: No problem!
Homer: Plus, we would want you to be willing to play any position we ask you to without complaint, either wing, even defense like Talbot and Couturier played the other day.
Carter: Absolutely, in fact I will buy some goalie pads and stick just in case you need me for that!
Homer: OK. And from now on, no pictures with you "partying" in public. And no alchohol at all during the season, we don’t want that stupid Broad Street Hockey group to get any ideas.
Carter: Gotcha, I love fruit juice!
Homer: And you are going to go to corporate PR training so you have just the right answers for the press corps; with funny jokes, too.
Carter: Will look forward to it!
Homer: And after you are done PR training, I expect you will agree to do a whole set of commercials for Comcast Xfinity for a modest sum, that you then donate in full to Flyers charities.
Carter: Ready to do my part for the community!
Homer: And on every other week, you will personally ensure that my car is washed and detailed.
Carter: With pleasure! What brand of car wax do you use?
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
by Bud in TN on Jan 27, 2012 3:29 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Any Bryz trade for Carter is pure fantasy.
Yes, it is. But it all started out after reading Dreger saying “Brian Burke and most sane general managers would want nothing to do with that [contract].”
According to that, neither Howson nor Holmgren are sane. Or they’re just rare. Either one. Hence the fun.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
Hey, you didn’t notice in my fantasy Matt is included in the deal!
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Oh, I did.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, I did.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 27, 2012 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
Twice, in fact.
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
Lame.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Jan 28, 2012 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
/lastword’d
Madly in love with Jaromir Jagr's brilliant smile and epic goal salute.
Sean Couturier and Matt Read for joint Calder Trophy winners!
Ian Laperriere (EE-an luh-PAIR-ee-YAIR), proper noun. Definition: Bad-assery on skates
by Chemistry66 on Jan 28, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
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