Kimmo Timonen wasn't happy after Saturday's game
by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 5:25 PM EST
in Philadelphia Flyers News
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Not gonna editorialize here. Just going to let Kimmo Timonen speak for himself, via this transcript from the Flyers' PR department.
Q: Was the big difference in this game the special teams?
"Well obviously they got three [power play] goals, so it was huge. We were disappointed with the effort actually. The emotional level, playing against the top team in the conference...league...to be honest I think we got half the guys going half the guys not."
Q: Right from the beginning?
"Well, that was my opinion. You might have seen differently but that's what I saw."
Q: It's got to be disappointing since they're the top team in the conference and they've beaten you--
"That's what I just said. It was a big game for us and I was expecting more. Obviously it was a tight game but they got three power play goals and we didn't score any. So, obviously it came down to our special teams."
Q: Did you voice that concern in the dressing room after the game, or even between periods?
"Well I think everyone realized we could've played better. It was a tie game, 2-2, but still, I felt like we could've pushed more and pressured more, but they got another two points."
Q: Is it concerning to you that this is a team that, right now, looks like it's going to win the Eastern Conference. They just seem like they're consistently a lot better than you guys.
"They play the system every night. They play the same way every night. There are no surprises and if there is a breakdown the goalie makes the save. They block a ton of shots and somehow they get the job done. Like I said, it was a top team and that's why they're at the top. They play the same way every night, they work hard, they do the same system every night and their goalie plays very well every night."
Q: Do you think there's as much talent in this dressing room?
"Well it comes down to effort and talent and...everything. I don't think there's much of a skill level difference from the bottom team to the top team. It comes down to the system, how you execute the system, how do you play every night. Sometime you go up and down and then you lose games and that's not the way the championship teams play.
Q: I know there's no captain on this team right now but this is the kind of thing that Pronger would rail about in the room is this where not having him becomes an issue?
"Well obviously we could [use him] but he's not here and we all should get by that by now. He's not coming back and obviously we would be more than happy to have him back but he's not here. Would he say something? I don't know."
Q: Is it important to get going tomorrow?
"We just need everybody going at the same time. We just can't have one or two lines going and four D or whatever. We need everybody to get going here. This is the time of year where you need everybody going and if you don't, that happens [losing]. And tomorrow if we're not ready to play, it's an even tougher opponent than today."
Q: You look now where we are in the beginning of February with just 27 games left in the regular season do all these games now mean that much more?
"Well obviously we are in the playoffs but you know we're not that far off so obviously every game matters and every game matters the way like I said you have to bring it every night I don't care who you are you're 18 or 40 it doesn't matter to me every game matters and you have to bring it."
Q: Is your youth really showing when it comes to (inaudible) and the special teams?
"It's four guys out there, It's not just the youth, it's everybody knowing what to do out there and today we had a couple of mix-ups. Overall I think it's been okay this year but today we had a couple of breakdowns and they scored."
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It’s very hard to like the Flyers lately. I love Jagr, Simmonds, Hartsy and Bryz, but every day I’m given another reason to hate the team.
"Because wives and girlfriends aren’t on the road."
by BannedStreetBully on Feb 11, 2012 5:40 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I like both G and Kimmo. I like alot of guys. Its just the group I named are the ones I love. Carcillo and Richards are ex favorites.
John LeClair and Hexy are all time man-crushes.
"Because wives and girlfriends aren’t on the road."
by BannedStreetBully on Feb 11, 2012 11:03 PM EST up reply actions
I think a lot of the results of these games would be different if you guys weren’t so snake-bitten with injuries this year. I think Timmo has a point about committing to the system, I am not going to pretend I have seen more than 10 Flyer games this year but you guys look like a totally different team every time we play you. You are always physical and you always find goals around the net, but I don’t know what is going on with your defense and… well I am not even going to bring up the goaltending issue.
The Rangers have become a great work ethic team that does what it can to control the tempo of a game by being physical and having a constant, relentless forecheck. I don’t think we ever “out-hit” or “out-physical” you guys, your team is just too damn big and tough.
I am not sure how you guys can add some quality and consistency to your defensive group. Your team, for the most part, is still very young and this has been an absolutely crazy year for you in terms of new faces and big changes… the team is proving a lot of people wrong by performing at the level they are currently performing at, but there is no question that the team can be better.
Even though the Rangers have had your number this year I still consider your team to be one I’d rather not cross paths with in the playoffs, especially if you get healthy, add some pieces to your blueline, and find a way to play at a high level every night. With Pronger out of the locker room other guys have to become vocal and fill the leadership vacuum.
Take it easy.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
by Dig Deep on Feb 11, 2012 6:02 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Do you like lamp?
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Brick, where did you get a hand grenade?
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Brick, are you just looking at things in the office and saying that you love them?
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 11, 2012 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
Brick, you killed a man with a trident.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Better lay low for a while.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
Because you’re probably wanted for murder.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
he’s also what you call mildly retarded
A Flyers fan in Pittsburgh and doing my part to make them uncomfortable.
by Daniel Ramirez on Feb 12, 2012 3:31 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
the team is proving a lot of people wrong by performing at the level they are currently performing at
Unfortunately, if the Flyers don’t win it all, it will be heralded as a tremendous failure and that it proved them right. There’s no “hey, that was better than I expected” with our media and a good chunk of the fanbase. It’s all or nothing. “HOLY SHIT THEY WON!” or “THEY SUCK, FIRE EVERYONE!” And, even worse, either response will also likely be accompanied by a “and I saw this coming all along.”
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Well, those people are idiots.
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
Couldn’t blame Bryz for this loss eh, Kimmo?
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 6:06 PM EST reply actions
My apologies ahead of time. I still have ill will when someone throws their goalie under the bus and doesn’t take responsibility for defensively bad games
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
I still don’t think it’s obvious that he threw Bryz under the bus. You have to want to think that to be so confident. It’s just as likely that he was praising Lundqvist as he was blaming Bryz.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
In Geoff, taking my logic and going that extra 20 yards
you win this round
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
he was definitely blaming Bryzgalov
I am clearly not a fan of the Flyers and am not biased in any sort of way, but Timmonen is not a classy player.
Look at the interview he just had, he is blaming his teammates again instead of himself. If there are problems within the organization you don’t throw people under the bus, you make up some bullshit about how you think you could of played better. This guy is clearly not a team player, it would be best for you guys if you got rid of him.
By the way good game today, was really scared during that 2nd period you outplayed the hell out of us 5on5.
Timmonen is not a classy player.
Lost me there. He’s one of the classiest guys in the league.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 6:36 PM EST up reply actions
Timmonen is one the classiest players in the league hands down. He’s Lidstrom classy.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
so you advocate bashing your teammates within a media interview?
I am sorry but that is not the right medium in which to apply criticism.
“Bashing” is a harsh word. He is a veteran guy in the locker room trying to wake his team up and make a statement about how the group as a whole has to start playing better. Did he single anyone out (in this interview)? Did he say anything that wasn’t true?
The score was 5-2 when all was said and done, his team was outworked and beat by a team that does exactly what Timmonen says they do. The Flyers were beaten by the Rangers system this afternoon.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "The arsonist has oddly shaped feet." - Ron Burgundy
Blueshirt Banter
I would disagree with the last sentence, but yeah. Exactly.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
Q. “. Did he single anyone out (in this interview)?”
A. “I thought we played a decent game,” Timonen said after a crushing goal allowed by Ilya Bryzgalov to end the second period, and two bad defensive giveaways in the third led to the Flyers’ fourth loss in four tries this season against the Rangers.
“It didn’t go our way,” Timonen added. Then, when asked what he thought the difference was in the game, Timonen quietly but just as quickly responded, “the goalie.”
Yeah, that wasn’t this interview. Further, that isn’t even clearly referring to Bryzgalov, since it just as easily could have been referring to Lundqvist.
Try again.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
Q. ". Did he single anyone out (in this interview)?"
Notice the “in this interview”?
You can tell the interview you are quoting is the wrong one because the guy in net was Bobrovsky.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "The arsonist has oddly shaped feet." - Ron Burgundy
Blueshirt Banter
you should probably stop while you’re ahead here.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
read my first post
“he was definitely blaming Bryzgalov”
I commented solely for the purpose of arguing this point.
Today he did not single anybody out.
Last time he did, and his comments today only prove who he meant by his “the goalie” statement last game.
I admit I do not know this player as well as you do, but there isn’t a single Ranger or Red Wing that would talk about their team in that way. I dare you to find quotes otherwise.
I tried. Maybe its the Steel Reserve, but I don’t see how this proves that Timonen was taking a shot at Bryz with that comment
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
actually Avery would
hahaha but we all know where he is at the current time, will never be a Ranger again.
So you take two different quotes, one that doesn’t have a clear meaning, and a 2nd one a week later, put the two together to make your point? Sorry, you’re reaching.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
It is called a pattern. Timmonen could of easily addressed this at practice or the locker room afterwards but he felt the need to do it within the media.
He could of talked about his own game last time, but he singled somebody out.
He could of talked about ONLY his own game today,but he once again brought some of the team in with him.
see the pattern?
I forgot that you have access to the Flyers locker room. Hence, you would know how he chose to address it there.
Is it really a problem, in a team sport like this, if he brings up the team instead of talking about only his own game in the media? You’re really stretching here…
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
You think he singled someone out. HE said the goalie was the difference, most likely meaning Lunquist outplayed Bryz. It happens. Didn’t say “Byyz sucks, he’s gotta step up.” And leaders call out their players when they aren’t performing. It happens. Why don’t you go find a bunch of other quotes to support your theory? Cause 2 doesn’t cut it.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 7:09 PM EST up reply actions
Should leaders only talk about themselves? Is that how leaders act?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
I’m kinda on the fence about Kimmo’s comments of recent.
Part of me thinks it great how outspoken he is about their struggles and he isnt afraid to go right at everyone on the team. The other part of me feels that a leader/captain would take more responsibility himself and start the blame at the top and then work down.
I dont know. Kinda contemplating it.
Right, because the Rangers and Red Wings are perfectly happy teams who never argue or get upset with one another about anything. It’s only the classless Flyers and the even more classlesser Kimmo Timonen
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I’m not sure classlesser is a word.
But I get what you’re getting at.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "The arsonist has oddly shaped feet." - Ron Burgundy
Blueshirt Banter
No, it is not. As a former English teacher, I know this well.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
by mikefive on Feb 12, 2012 6:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Needed to be said
Maybe he feels that his teammates needed to hear what he said.
Some guy at PSU Hershey Med Center just discovered a virus that eats cancer. Where were the CNN trucks for that? THON will probably break $10 mil this year. Put that on "Outside the Lines".
I went to UofM
and have been a fan of the Red Wings for over 12 years now, Lidstrom would never bash his teammates within a media interview.
Show me where he bashed his teammates, please. Since you went to UofM, you should be smart enough to find the quote where he bashed his teammates
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
Timmonen after the last game vs the Rangers [not today]
“"I thought we played a decent game," Timonen said after a crushing goal allowed by Ilya Bryzgalov to end the second period, and two bad defensive giveaways in the third led to the Flyers’ fourth loss in four tries this season against the Rangers.
"It didn’t go our way," Timonen added. Then, when asked what he thought the difference was in the game, Timonen quietly but just as quickly responded, "the goalie." "
As has been stated previously (multiple times) in this thread. That comment is in no way an insult directed towards Bryz unless you choose to feel that way. As I believe Timonen clarified later on, this comment was more of a praise to Lundqvist than anything else. To bash the guy for insulting his teammates based on that is completely unfair IMO
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
Bob.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:42 PM EST up reply actions
seemed pretty clearly that he was openly naming bryz for the loss; no like. no like at all.
the jets are in related but much-more-ghastly situation: bunch of azzholes throwing qb mark sanchez under the bus after a crap season. there’s not recovering from that; those guys are now a cancer in that locker room, and must be excised.
i’m with bryz and sanchez. you don’t say things like that about your ’mates… to the papers.
seemed pretty clearly that he was openly naming bryz for the loss; no like. no like at all.
What was the difference in today’s game? “The goalie”.
How you can say definitively which goalie he’s referring to, I’ll never understand.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:56 PM EST up reply actions
It's the Flyers and everyone on the Flyers is CLASSLESS!
Therefore, the negative answer is always the right answer!
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I think he was referring to both. What was the difference? The goalie. One goalie played out of his mind and the other had a bad game. The difference was goaltending. He probably should have used the word “goaltending” instead of saying “the goalie” but I’m not gonna fault a Finn on semantics in an English language interview.
by DrunkHockeyFan on Feb 11, 2012 8:48 PM EST up reply actions
I can buy this as well.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
It’s “clear to you”? How many interviews have you done with Timmo? How many have you read that someone else did? If you don’t know a player, one who is clearly a leader and a great guy, how do you know?
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
Stuff it kimmo. Either add some leadership or keep your trap shut. You didn’t dazzle today either.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 6:13 PM EST via mobile reply actions
One could consider Kimmo’s comments a form of leadership.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
Really Travis. Some guys didn’t play! Their goalie plays well every night!
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 6:38 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Did you ever call out Richie for not being vocal enough?
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 6:45 PM EST up reply actions
Personally, I don’t think we as a fanbase know what we want from our captains and assistants anymore. Given what has been said by people in the past (regardless of whether or not it’s the majority opinion): we’ve had quiet, lead by example guys are perceived as not being leaders at all because they aren’t loud about it (Gagne); guys who talk to people one on one and try not to throw people under the bus aren’t respected either (Richards); ones who say what’s wrong without pointing fingers more than they have to are still too harsh (Kimmo), and ones that are crack heads are perceived by some as doing more harm that good (Pronger).
Honestly, we’re not ever going to be happy, are we?
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by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 11, 2012 7:05 PM EST up reply actions
Not until Clarke himself comes back as captain.
goldomatic, who is King in the art of wishful thinking
That guy broke the mold. He was the best ever.
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by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 7:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Witnessed it first hand on numerous occasions. I am in my 40’s and was a young fan in the 70’s and 80’s. My first and longest lasting memory of Clarke was after a practice at the class of 23 rink on the Penn Campus a group of kids formed at the exit looking for autographs. A few of the guys were looking to hit alternates exits to avoid the group. Clarke made a statement right then and there every player was going to leave through the main exit and sign autographs for those kids. And they did and it wasn’t an issue. It was also noted in the HBO special by Esposito, I believe, that it was like Clarke was Michael Corleone and the team was like his loyal soldiers.
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Nope. I was quite happy with Richards, and I’d love to have a guy like Knuble as an Alternate – someone who is both respected and vocal, but not brash – but that wouldn’t work in Philly.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:07 PM EST up reply actions
See I could be wrong, but I seem to remember whenever we would have a tough loss or a string of losses, Richie would put a lot of the blame directly on himself. I know Kimmo isnt the official captain, but lets face it, he is the current “captain”. I have yet to hear Kimmo place any blame directly on himself. That could be good or bad, I still am not sure.
I know Kimmo isnt the official captain, but lets face it, he is the current "captain"
Really? On a team with Danny Briere, who was the former co-captain of the Sabres? On a team with Scott Hartnell, upon whom Laviolette seems to rely heavily (and who has a lot of leadership qualities himself)?
Kimmo is one of the leaders of this team, no question. But just because he is one of the leaders (not the de facto leader) doesn’t mean he has to say “It’s my responsibility.” He doesn’t have to be Andy Reid.
I heard the 2nd and 3rd periods on the radio today. I heard a Meszaros giveaway lead to a goal, and I heard blown coverage lead to a goal. I did not hear anything in Timonen’s play today which made me think he had a bad game. Because he’s human, he does have them. Why should he put all of the blame on himself if he isn’t the one causing the problems? He acknowledges that EVERYONE has to do a better job, not JUST him or not JUST one or two other guys. It’s on everybody. Isn’t that the message that leaders ought to carry – that we win and we lose together?
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I get what you’re saying and I do agree. I dont know maybe I just feel like by him saying we all have to do better, its just a slightly easy way out of really admitting any blame upon himself. He has had a great season, but surely he has made mistakes. I know he works his ass off every night, but I feel like a captain normally puts more blame on themself than necessary. Get what i’m saying? Kinda delirious right now haha
I understand what you’re saying too. But if we’re going by memory I don’t seem to remember Pronger ever taking more blame upon himself than necessary. I always seem to remember him saying “we have to do this and that better,” like he does here.
I know that the captain has to fall on the sword for his mates sometimes, but this does not seem to be one of those times. At least, it doesn’t seem that way to me.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Vocal isn’t calling out people to the media. And I assumed richie was a good leader until his attitude became juvenile around the media. But enough about ancient history. Timmo is bumming me out.
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by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 7:42 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Who is he calling out?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
The goaltender???
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 8:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
He’s not calling out the goaltender; just saying that the goaltender isn’t as good as Lundqvist.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:09 PM EST up reply actions
I am not able to link and crap but he blamed a loss on his goaltender. And today should have been the whole team fucked up not a couple guys screwed it up. And I’m really pissed they haven’t risen to the challenge of a bunch of punks led by a big punk.
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DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 8:16 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
He didn’t blame the loss on his goaltender. He was asked what the difference between teh two teams was that day. He answered “the goalie”.
To quote Fight Club:
Of course, it’s company policy never to imply ownership in the event of a dildo. We have to use the indefinite article, “a dildo”, never … your dildo.
Kimmo used the indefinite article “the”, never…“our” goalie. And yet people are certain to which goalie he was referring, despite absolutely nothing pointing to which goalie he was talking about.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
HAHAHAHAHAHA!
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by MJDII on Feb 11, 2012 8:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It’s the fact that he said it “quietly” Geoff. If the article said “Timonen felt the goalie was the difference today” it sounds normal – Lundqvist was elite again, what can you do about that? But the article said Timonen added it “quietly” but “just as quickly” – in that it was an impulse but he felt the need to quieten his tone because it might be a little bit out of line. It made it sound like he was saying something that wasn’t the company line; that might be a bit controversial.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:34 PM EST up reply actions
“Quietly” is subjective and is a modifier that was added by the writer. The writer is using that to make his own point out of Kimmo’s words. It may agree with what Kimmo meant, it may not, we don’t know. So it’s best to ignore it and focus on Kimmo’s words, which are ambiguous which goalie he meant.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Was it? Because it was from the Delco Times, but wasn’t ASF. I’m not familiar with the guy who got the byline
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by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 12, 2012 3:41 PM EST up reply actions
“We just need everybody going at the same time. We just can’t have one or two lines going and four D or whatever. We need everybody to get going here.”
I don’t know how anybody can read that and be angry at the person saying it. What is so objectionable about saying not everybody is “going”??
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:46 PM EST up reply actions
Personally, I’d find it far more objectionable to pretend like everyone is going when it’s obvious to the fans that they’re not all in sync. You can’t get a whole lot more vague without reaching the point where you say nothing at all.
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by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 11, 2012 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
Personally, I’d find it far more objectionable to pretend like everyone is going
This is at least consistent with people’s criticisms of Richards/Stevens/Carter.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
It’s like Kimmo is getting bashed for doing the exact opposite of what Andy Reid gets bashed for in this city
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:01 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly what I was going to say. "Well, I take full responsibility. I should have put my players in a better situation to win the game.: Kimmo told it like it was. And he didn’t single anybody out. It sounds like its a problem for everyone. Some guys try some nights and others try on other nights. They all just need to trying every night.
by DrunkHockeyFan on Feb 11, 2012 8:53 PM EST up reply actions
I’m with the ‘Stuff it’ crowd.
For Timonen — a veteran — not to voice his criticism during the game or after the game to the team but, instead, only to whine about it to a reporter is pretty weak. If he’s going to fail to provide the leadership this kind of situation calls for, then at least state your criticism in general terms tersely and move on. He should have just said, “Not everyone is showing up to play and this needs to change.” If a veteran like him isn’t going to answer the bell and be a leader — on a captain-less team with a bunch of young players — then don’t drone on about a problem you’re doing nothing to solve. In fact, the fact that a veteran like him says nothing at all makes it more likely that nothing will change.
It also doesn’t help when you (self-servinglly) identify yourself as belonging to the group that does bring it. I mean, maybe it’s true, but why put it like that if you’re not going to name anyone who does or doesn’t bring it? All you’ve done is said, “I bring it.” Again, not helpful at all.
And why isn’t Lavy’s name coming up more? He deserves some blame here.
by fiveredapples on Feb 12, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
Ask M about the last time the players called out their coach in this city.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
by mikefive on Feb 12, 2012 6:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Calling a coach out and stabbing a legend in the neck is completely different. Bunch of whiners led by a malcontent loser like Primeau.
Is that what you were getting at?
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DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
I do think Kimmo needs to keep comments like this to himself. But from his perspective, the way things have been going lately have got to be frustrating. He’s having a good season himself as the number one defensemen in a D unit which has been mediocre and hindered by key injuries, while backed up by inconsistent goaltending. I think hes just reached his boiling point these past few weeks after key losses to division rivals.
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 6:16 PM EST reply actions
I am amazed the comments so far are negative towards Kimmo. Do people want some more cliche answers like “we have to play better.” “They wanted it more.” “It just wasn’t our day.”?
If speaking up and calling out his teammates – without mentioning anyone in particular – isn’t the correct thing to do, what do you think Chris Pronger would have done? What about Mike Richards?
I am really curious what people want “leaders” to do on this team. Mike Richards was criticized for not caring about losses. Chris Pronger is praised for calling out his teammates. Kimmo Timonen is criticized for calling out his teammates. What gives?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:26 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Thank you. I already get enough of those bullshit cliche answers from the Eagles. Two teams, not gonna happen… I can’t handle it lol. While these comments are motivated by frustration, it doesn’t mean theyre not valid points. Theres been a clear difference in effort level between the Flyers and the Rags in the 3rd period this year
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
As long as he doesn’t call out individual players, which he did not here, then I have no problem with what he said,
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Exactly. Let’s be angry at him for saying “we” didn’t play well!
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
All he’s doing is setting the team up for a complete performance tomorrow.
by Lesion of Doom on Feb 11, 2012 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
He was even given the opportunity to blame it on the young guys and he didn’t take the bait. He said “there are 4 guys on the power play, and they need to work together.” paraphrasing
by DrunkHockeyFan on Feb 11, 2012 8:55 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah the interviewer was kinda baiting him into saying something I reckon.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:57 PM EST up reply actions
I do not have anything against him as far as leadership is concerned
I have a problem with one comment he made, and that comment is up to the reader to decide how they feel it was taken
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 6:36 PM EST up reply actions
And that’s fine, but you have a really strong opinion about something you admit you don’t know. I don’t understand how you can be so angry at someone over something that is admittedly unclear.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 6:44 PM EST up reply actions
I perceived it in a certain way, but acknowledge that it could be taken in various amount of ways
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 7:06 PM EST up reply actions
Right. And I have no problem with people perceiving it differently – afterall, it is vague. But what I don’t understand is taking that vague comment and having a strong reaction, either way.
In other words, people who think he was referring to Bryzgalov and saying “not cool, Kimmo.” I get. But taking it to “having ill will” or all the crap said above by some Red Wings/Rangers fan is what I don’t get.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:09 PM EST up reply actions
that was my reaction, and I’ll admit that was a bit of an overreaction.
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
haha, I’ve never see you get so serious so quickly and stay so serious.
You’re bringing me down, man.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:15 PM EST up reply actions
I will be the first to admit I overreacted, and the first to admit that I overreacted
It’s the weekend Geoff, I have a feeling there will be more arguments coming sunday night and monday morning
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
first to overreact*
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 11, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
That was my attempt at getting you to stop being so serious.
Why you gotta be such an asshole? haha
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry Geoff. It’s just been with the Flyers the last game I enjoyed them in felt like it was ages ago, but it was actually one of the last games in December when the Flyers beat the Pens
It’s just been blah for me. And i usually like to have high hopes
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 12, 2012 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
I’ve been that way since October, so I understand completely.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
Hah, I typed my response to Travis before reading down this far…. But I agree entirely.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 11, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
It’s so hilarious. On one hand, Eagles fans and media alike despise Andy Reid for always giving cliched answers (“we have to play better,” “I need to put the players in a better position to win”) week in and week out during NFL season. But now there is someone who does not give cliched answers, and Timonen is being portrayed as CLASSLESS and not a team player, and the like. The hypocrisy of some people is hilarious.
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I think it’s just frustration from the loss. I know that in the past we’ve all regularly commended Timonen for speaking his mind and showing passion (e.g. when he tells us how much he wants to win the cup, when he speaks about the all star game, when he notes how disappointed he is at losing).
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
Why is this not green?
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
I’ll readily admit, I’ve been uncomfortable with some things Kimmo has said to the media in the past, especially when it refers to goaltending and the ability of our goaltending and defense to work together. But I like every word of these comments today. IMO, this is exactly the kind of thing I want to hear after a loss: not cliched bs answers. He’s giving his straight take of what went wrong for us today. Didn’t call out any individuals. Pointed to needing a more consistent team effort. I can respect that.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
I’m not crazy about this one.
“to be honest I think we got half the guys going half the guys not” is the line that bugs me. It sounds a lot like finger-pointing, like saying “I’m busting my ass here and these other guys aren’t pulling their weight”.
If there are guys who aren’t giving it a good effort, I definitely want the team’s leaders trying to fix it — but this sounds less like trying to fix a problem than unproductively venting. There’s a mountain of difference between telling a guy “it looks like you’re taking shifts off and the team needs you to go 60 minutes” and telling the press “some of my teammates aren’t working hard enough”. Team is all about we, and this feels awfully us-and-them, much more schismy and cancery than anything I ever heard last year.
And I never had a problem with Richards — or Reid, for that matter. Cliche for the media is fine with me.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
Fair enough.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
I think my initial reaction was to like what Kimmo said, because it echoed how I felt. 24 hours later, I see your point. It does present some warning signs of a divide. Let’s hope we’re just reading too much into it.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Because Geoff is asking a group of people with extremely different perceptions, attitudes, beliefs and values to be in total agreement and palatable to a line of reasoning Geoff sees rational. And I am not attacking you Geoff because the question you are asking is valid but probably not possible to settle reasonably.
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That’s not at all what I’m asking, and I’m never going to be naive enough to ask for everybody to be in total agreement.
But since you say what I’m asking is valid, this comment doesn’t make sense. How can a valid question be so ignorant?
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry Geoff I knew it was coming out wrong. In reference to what do people want, I just feel is never going to be answered sensibly by all of these comments. But asking that question is a good one, What do people want, can’t please everyone. I am assuming the comment wasn’t rec’d because people don’t see it your way. People interpret his recent comments as negative towards Bryz, when we are told ad nausea goaltending is not the reason we win win or lose. Yesterday the defense looked completely lost out there, Timmo included. But to say some guys didn’t give an effort is laying the loss on particular members of the team.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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You’re right, that question is never going to be answered. Mostly because different people want different things, but the common thread is that people aren’t happy. When the Flyers lose, people are angry. The object of the anger is two different things, but the reaction is the same. That doesn’t compute with me.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 1:21 PM EST up reply actions
Your too sensible and again not to offend you but I think some people interpret your lack of irrational emotion as a lack of passion for the team. I believe the large majority of the Flyers fanbase is such based on a perceived passion and almost a rage. If your losing start fighting. If the team game plan breaks down the team needs to hit more and not back down to every shove or push. People want a leader to emerge as a fall on his sword at any cost but don’t actually want to see how that works just perceive it is happening. Timmo I think is perceived by many as a leader but don’t want to even think he is inferring a loss is on one guy. Bryz in this case. The people want to kill Bryz for not making some impossible saves or make up for d breakdown but don’t want to witness a leader hanging him out to dry. People want to believe Timmo looks across the room and says hey Bryz come on man we need more from you tonight but don’t want to hear him infer that to a reporter. People like to hear in fables that Pronger aired some guys out but never actually said anything publicly. I am rambling and that usually gets me in trouble.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Well, you’re still talking about one vague comment from last week, which doesn’t explain everyone’s anger at these recent comments. I agree with your perception of the fanbase, but I don’t agree with what you think they want in a leader. I think they want a cliche-riddled emotional person, which just doesn’t exist. Guys who peddle cliches won’t show emotion, because those who show emotion won’t speak in cliches.
The fanbase wants someone who will be angry at a loss and excited about a big win, but they don’t want him to say anything while angry.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Apparently after the game the media are seeking out Timmo, probably based on that “vague” comment hoping he might take it one step further. And perception….. people BELIEVE he hung the goalie out last week and now he says some guys care and some don’t. I read last weeks comments as the goaltending let us down today. It was true! Lundquist really made the difference today and we need to make our goaltender look as good as him might have sounded better.
I do believe someone can sell cliches with emotion. Looking at the ground mumbling we need to be better, blah blah blah. aggravates people. Saying cliches with a passionate conviction is very different.
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When did Pronger call out teammates? I just don’t remember him saying the goalie was the reason for the loss or some guys stunk today. We all perceive Pronger as a dick but what evidence do we have? I actually like the perception without reality. It is easier for me to swallow that a guy is demonstrative in the room but is boring in the media.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren acknowledged Friday that defenseman Chris Pronger was chewing out Claude Giroux after the team’s inartistic 4-1 win over Edmonton Tuesday.
Asked what he thought of the situation, Holmgren was blunt.
"I think it’s great," he told reporters at the Flyers’ practice facility in Voorhees.
As reporters entered the locker room after Tuesday’s game, Pronger could be heard shouting, "Some people just don’t learn."
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
What was said. How does a reporter know Pronger was mad at Giroux and Timmo was not mad at Bryz? And everything noted above is interpretation of what was happening behind closed doors. Pronger didn’t say after the game we lost today because of goaltending.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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How does a reporter know? Because Paul Holmgren confirmed it. How does a reporter know Kimmo wasn’t mad at Bryz? He doesn’t, which is the point.
Further, it’s not behind closed doors when it’s said in front of reporters.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
He didn’t confirm the actual word for word conversation. He only set a stage for people to believe that Pronger is an iron fist. That is easier to swallow then actually word for word hearing the conversation. And no reporter gave the details of the conversation only that it was loud conversation. For all we know he was telling him to not be a bystander in the room speak up and ask for more from other players. Some people just don’t learn might be others , not Claude and Pronger wants Claude to nip others behavior in the butt.
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That’s a lot of interpreting you’re doing.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions
And you are “interpreting” Holmgren saying I like when guys are in each others grills as Pronger called Giroux out for his play and aired him personally out. No one knows what was being said loudly and the context of the loud talking. So I interpret it as what I want to believe is happening behind closed doors. Pronger never said directly to the media that their point leader was better then our point leader today and that is why we lost.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren acknowledged Friday that defenseman Chris Pronger was chewing out Claude Giroux
What does the “word for word” part have to do with whether it was directed at Giroux? First you asked for evidence that Pronger has called out players. When you got some you made it seem as though it wasn’t as plain as it was – within earshot of reporters, confirmed by the GM. Then you shift again and talk about the actual words said as if that’s really the point.
There is so much squirming to get out from under a clear example of an individual player actually calling out another individual player, in front of a third party and confirmed by team management, and yet you are certain that Timonen called out Bryzgalov when he didn’t mention his name, could have been talking about the relative superiority of the other goalie, in a sentence described with an artificial sense of drama by the reporter to tilt you to a particular conclusion.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Feb 12, 2012 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
i’m suddenly out for the rest of the day, in case i don’t return any response.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Feb 12, 2012 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
You are now saying that Pronger DID directly call Giroux out regarding his play. Without knowing what was actually said. That is not an example of Pronger standing in from of reporters and saying the loss to day was the goaltender.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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One more.
Ok. I give up. You don’t believe that Pronger was yelling at Giroux – that the reporter and Holmgren either got it wrong or conspired to lie – and yet you do believe that Timonen criticized Bryzgalov when ANY REASONABLE READING of the quote COULD BE taken either way. It’s madness. This makes me crazier than anything I can see on the ice.
I’m typing in caps so I’m leaving this issue and going away now.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Feb 12, 2012 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
I’m with M on this one.
In the Pronger incident, the person I had a problem with was Holmgren — he’s the one who brought it from behind closed doors to the press.
Within the team, I’m all for accountability and calling each other out when it is necessary and can be done productively. I don’t see much benefit to bringing that to the press.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
Thanks Eric....
In Holmgren’s defense he only said he was on board for friction in the room. He did lend fire to the mix which looked as if he outed the reporters perception of the situation. But he in no way actually define the conversation. Holmgren comes from an era where there was a fighting in practice when guys had issues. It kept everyone honest and respectful of each other.
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It wasn’t Holmgren at all. Reporters heard it, which is why they asked Holmgren.
Unless you consider things said within earshot of reporters “behind closed doors”.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 8:42 PM EST up reply actions
I can buy that it was accidental, but… my one experience in that locker room suggests to me that a) he was either yelling very loudly, without regard for who would hear; b) had waited a lengthy time to start yelling at him; c) had been yelling at him for a very long time; and/or d) had intentionally allowed reporters to hear it.
The amount of time from final whistle to reporters entering the room is more than enough time for players to avoid the media entirely, while most players are down the hall in a room beyond earshot of reporters. But then again, I went when they clinched the Atlantic, so I didn’t have a typical experience, or even a similar one to that night.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
But without knowing what he was actually yelling are we sure he was calling out Giroux personally? And no one actually knows what was said so it wasn’t for public consumption.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Yes, yes we are, M. Multiple reporters heard it, and Paul Holmgren confirmed that they heard correctly.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2012 9:30 AM EST up reply actions
Some people just don’t learn is Pronger calling out Giroux directly to Giroux? Or was he heated telling Giroux that fucking Jeff Carter was out getting drunk with college chicks again last night?
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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The former.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2012 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
I have another hour before the wife comes home...
I believe they were in heated conversation but without knowing exactly what was said doesn’t say he was calling him personally out for his play. That isn’t saying it didn’t happen or was conspired. And I can reasonably say Timmo called out his goaltender after the team lost.
Come back chicago……
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Ok I’m back to calm lower case.
I wasn’t worked up about the opinion that Timonen should not have shared his thoughts with the press. I get that view. I can live anywhere from complete silence by everyone, to the coach occasionally saying something, to leaders (rarely) sending out general complaints like Timonen did yesterday. The more they can work out in the room the better.
I believe there is an obvious difference between the Pronger and TImonen examples that I am embarrassed to say eluded me. Pronger didn’t know he was being heard by the press. So comparing them doesn’t really work. He meant to keep it in the room, at least in that instance (at least I assume he didn’t intend it to be heard, but he’s so devious who knows).
What had me all in caps is the idea that we can know what Timonen meant when said “the goalie.” We can guess, and then we can take those guesses and build a theory and then look for things to support it later and then we have a locker room division and then Richards gets traded because he’s a cancer. Obviously that’s a leap backwards and somewhat in logic but I try to stay away from that kind of speculation and when I see it crystallizing into fact by being repeated enough I start becoming irrational.
Thanks for the callback.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Feb 12, 2012 8:01 PM EST up reply actions
The Richards is a cancer angle is confusing to me. I never believed he was a cancer. I do believe he never used the role as captain to unite a group of players with one goal in mind. He was traded because there was a division in the locker room, not saying he created it, but I believe Richards never bridged the division. The organization, I believe, was bummed out that Richards didn’t unite the team. The organization, I believe, felt this was his role and his job as captain. This organization has always been tainted from the old days because that is what Clarke would have done. Clarke would have gotten the division under control.
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My problem with this is: He was Captain of a team that upset the Capitals and Canadiens before succumbing to the Penguins. He was Captain of a team that upset the Devils, upset the Bruins after rallying from 3-0 down twice, and came back from 2-0 down in the Stanley Cup Finals to tie the series at 2.
He never used his role as captain to unite a group of players around the Stanley Cup? There are two unexpected runs where he was the common denominator. Not Pronger, not Lavy, not Leighton, but Richards.
Just because Chris Pronger had his worst game ever in Game 5 of the Stanley Cup Finals doesn’t mean Richards couldn’t unite a group of players with one goal in mind.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2012 9:33 AM EST up reply actions
Wasn’t Jason Smith the captain in 07-08? And the cup run was all Pronger.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
Yes he was. My mistake.
The Cup run was all Pronger? I think Michael Leighton disagrees with you. I think Simon Gagne’s 4 goals and 1 assist in Games 5 through 7 against Boston disagree with you. I think Danny Briere’s 9 goals and 8 assists through the first three rounds disagree with you.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2012 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
Michael Laeighton was the beneficiary of a defense playing absolutely perfect in front of him. Affording Gagne and Briere to shine. It all starts from the rear outward.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
How is he deflecting blame here? It’s not like he’s saying “my teammates need to play better.” He’s saying “We need to play better.” We includes himself, too.
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Probably reading too much into it, but something about the statement “I was expecting more” can rub people the wrong way and come off as kind of deflecting. Sounds like the kind of thing a disappointed parent would say to their kid, which is kind of what Kimmo is relative to this team.
Not that it’s what happened; just saying, like a few people have said about this and his “the goalie” quote last weekend, it’s possible and not totally ridiculous to interpret them that way. I don’t think it’s a huge problem or says something significant about Kimmo himself, I just think he’s frustrated.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 11, 2012 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know what they need to do better at this point
They just looked bad. Everything looked bad. It was awful.
It's in his wheelhouse!!
Carlos Ruiz, My Nickname is Chooch.
They need to not have 7 rookies in the lineup anymore. A big part of the inconsistency stems from guys learning the game like they are right now. But that’s not going to change. This is a “growing pains” year, which is a nice way of saying it’s a “transitional” year or a “re-tooling” year. All we can hope for is that they make the playoffs and give the kids some more experience there. It will only make things better in the long run.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Good luck convincing the majority of Flyers fans that, as they seem to think every year can be a cup year.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 7:29 PM EST up reply actions
That comes from the organization and the delusional owner.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Preaching to the choir.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
those flyers fans aren’t entirely delusional. the flyers, year after year, are a dangerous, talented, formidable team. even now, at what might be a particularly demoralizing time, they’re within striking distance of the top of the eastern conference. boston has already stumbled; if my rangers do also, who can say where things end up?
that said, someone on another board opined that the difference between the two clubs today was in net. he was right, in a sense, but i thought most of bob’s goals-against were very, very difficult saves to make—and henke let in a similar one at the other end. no, it’s your D… and maybe your system. everybody’s got to commit, and when even one guy’s out of step, the strategy collapses.
you can teach strategy. you can’t teach skill. keep your heads up.
someone on another board opined that the difference between the two clubs today was in net.
What an asshole! Throwing someone under the bus like that?!
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 11, 2012 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
The fans who believe they will win a cup every year are. Neither Mike nor I said anywhere they aren’t in contention, but they are lucky to be where they are right now. The injuries to key players, the amount of rookie production they are getting, all of that and more.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 8:01 PM EST up reply actions
your system. everybody’s got to commit, and when even one guy’s out of step, the strategy collapses.
This is many people’s lasting problem with Laviolette’s system. The problems with it are exacerbated because we have seven rookies in the lineup, some veterans who are fond of passing the puck to the other team, no Pronger, and a goaltender who has struggled for most of the season. The idea coming into this year (sold to us by the organization) was that the Flyers’ defensive deficiencies and mistakes among the forward corps (caused by their running Richards and Carter out of town) would be covered by the Goalie with the Humungous Big Contract. And all of that was well before Pronger was lost and gone forever.
Laviolette needs to return to the trapping style he employed during the 2009-10 season, when the Flyers had seven goalies, few big scorers, and no third defensive pairing to speak of / trust in. The team is fast enough that they can make the transition game hell for the opposition.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
This. The Flyers wouldn’t have gone anywhere in the 2010 playoffs if they didn’t start trapping. Lavy needs to swallow his pride and accept that the system isn’t working. I think we’ve got the personnel to trap.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
some veterans who are fond of passing the puck to the other team
haha
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 8:41 PM EST up reply actions
It might be part of Lavy’s system!
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:43 PM EST up reply actions
I’m looking squarely at The Meszaros and occasionally Carle, when he decides to be Cold Carle instead of Hot Carle.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
gross
"Women should have three breasts - two in front and one in the back for dancing." -Al Bundy
by HankMonahan on Feb 12, 2012 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
I’ve been referring to him as Hot Carle since we acquired him in 2008.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Except when he has a bad game, then he’s Cold Carle. Some days he can be both Hot Carle and Cold Carle.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
.
And on those days, this happens:
And we end up with Lukewarm Carle.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
This sums up a lot of the reasons that I really don’t want them to trade JVR
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:32 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think that’s happening… at least not this year. Hopefully it never does.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
I concur. I bet my friend a shot of everclear that he’d his 40 goals this year. Pretty likely, right?
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:40 PM EST up reply actions
Also, since when did the BSH community become so protective of Bryz? Timo makes a comment that could possibly be taken as a bash at Bryz and people don’t like him now. But he gets murdered on here basically every goal he gives up or even after a shutout because of his shootout play?
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 6:43 PM EST reply actions
This I understand. I just really don’t believe that he directed that comment towards Bryz as much as he directed it towards Lundqvist. Besides, the solar system is so humangous big. Why are we even worried about these problems here on earth?
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:10 PM EST reply actions
Meant to respond to goldomatic. Thank the Steel Reserve for the fact that my response is here.
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions
This much is true. Humangas big. And I have a hot dog. Therefore, life is good.
goldomatic, who is King in the art of wishful thinking
I have 12 steel reserve 24oz cans. Maybe by the end of the night I won’t remember that we’re 0-5-0 against the rags this year. Just gonna keep watching this all night.
by Clutterbuck4MVP on Feb 11, 2012 7:16 PM EST up reply actions
Um...?
Timonen says something like this once a year, whenever the team struggles like this. “Somebody tell me, what the FUCK is the difference now? What’s the problem now?”
I am certain that he brings this stuff up with his teammates before he does so with the media. That’s always the sense I get from these interviews he gives.
But one reason I’ve always said that I don’t want him to be the captain here is that the players never seem to respond to him whenever he gives these kind of talks. That’s not a criticism of Timonen – more so of the team for not listening to reason. It pisses me off because Timonen always calls it like he sees it and doesn’t pull any punches. Is he as abrasive as Pronger? I have no idea, but probably not. Should that matter? Absolutely not.
I agree with what Geoff said above. It’s time for some consistency on the fans’ part. What do we want from a captain? I’ll never forget stupid Al Morganti stirring the pot after the Flyers were swept by the Bruins last year: “Who is the captain of this team?”
Timonen tries to be whenever he sees the need to do so, and we rake him over the coals for it. That’s unfair, I’m sorry.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
by mikefive on Feb 11, 2012 7:22 PM EST reply actions 8 recs
Couldn’t agree more. But that’s nothing new.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 7:23 PM EST up reply actions
Rec’d.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 11, 2012 7:30 PM EST up reply actions
Off with his head!
Just kidding. I have no problem with anything he said. And plus if it piss off his teammates there are two ways they can take it: One, it could light a fire under their ass. Two, they can get their panties in a bunch and play like they have. But I really don’t think it’s that big of a deal in the first place.
-bob
by Rrainone on Feb 11, 2012 7:26 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Gawd. Even the Phantoms, just underway, are going off. Klotz fighting in the first minute, Cullen Eddy a major for elbowing & a game misconduct. 5 minutes into this game and Norfolk leads 3-0.
There's no winning...
… the Garrett Klotz Argument.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
shameless sir, just shameless but it needs to be more shameless with a linked song. That’s not an opinion…in fact it’s fact.
Really guys?
I’m pretty surprised to see the reaction here; given how we reacted to Richards. I get what mikefive says above about Timmo’s comments not having an impact on the team but really we have no way of telling how the locker room feels about Timonen so I’d rather not speculate about that.
But I would like a captain who always pushes for more from his team. Who doesn’t take things for granted. Who knows when his team is outperforming or not playing the system and calls them out for it – not by individual names – but by saying “we” aren’t doing enough.
To be honest, I thought this is exactly what we want to hear.
Sometime you go up and down and then you lose games and that’s not the way the championship teams play.
Things like that are exactly what I like to hear from a leader of this team. That this isn’t what we’re about; this isn’t going to win us a championship.
Well obviously we are in the playoffs but you know we’re not that far off so obviously every game matters and every game matters the way like I said you have to bring it every night
That’s also what I like to hear from a leader of this team. Not taking anything from granted. We’re going to push hard for a playoff spot and home ice and not slip in the standings.
Now I get the criticism if he had called someone out individually, but he hasn’t. I’m perhaps somewhere between CCB and Geoff’s views on the last interview. I think when he says “the goalie” is the difference, then says tonight “their goalie plays very well every night” it’s pretty much saying Lundqvist is an elite goalie. The only thing I could potentially derive from that is that there isn’t much confidence in the goaltending – but can you blame him for not being totally confident in the goaltending? It’s more an indictment of Homer for failing in the quest for an elite goaltender. We were looking for Lundqvist, we didn’t get him.
I also think that when the interviewer decides to note:
Timonen quietly but just as quickly responded, "the goalie."
That makes it sound more subversive than it should. The fact that he apparently responded “quietly”.
My two cents. I don’t mind this interview.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:07 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Amen.
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Feb 11, 2012 8:12 PM EST up reply actions
I’m confused by the reaction as well. I thought Philly fans liked their leaders to speak their minds, wear their hearts on their sleeves. He’s frustrated. Most of the people here are frustrated. Though, honestly, in a year in which there has been so much change, with so many kids, to then have Pronger go out, by far the most stabilizing player on the ice, how in the hell do you not expect to have problems and frustrations? I try not to repeat what others have said but this is insane. And as Geoff and others have pointed out, if Richards is bad for not talking and Pronger is good for talking then how in the holy f*** can Timonen be bad for talking?
How about a poll: Which of the following is the most serious problem facing the Flyers? A.) Bryzgalov’s goaltending B.) Inconsistency C.) What Timonen says to reporters.
Oh, and you can’t have “called out” anyone if nobody’s name is mentioned. It’s the opposite of what the phrase means.
I was also annoyed by the interviewer’s choice of words. If TImonen was quiet and answered quickly about everything else, why is it of note if he did the same to that question?
I’m much less annoyed at the Flyers than at everyone else. We can’t have a blog where half the people make sense and half the people don’t. Oh no I’ve called them out. Watch out for my bus.
/s, more often than not
by flyersfaninchicago on Feb 11, 2012 8:34 PM EST up reply actions
I have here a list of the names
of 207 persons who are known
by the Secretary of Defense as
being members of the Comm-
unist Party… I demand an ans-
wer, Mr. Secretary. There will
be no covering up, sir, no cov-
ering up. You are not going
to get your hands on this list.
It’s all right, it’s Polish caviar !
Also, this is our first real bit of adversity in the win column all year. Remembering that two weeks ago we’d never even lost 3 games in a row.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 8:11 PM EST reply actions
Still haven’t lost 3 in a row…unless I’m mistaken.
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Feb 11, 2012 8:13 PM EST up reply actions
Last week, Devils, Rags and Isles
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 11, 2012 8:15 PM EST up reply actions
Screw the shootout! That was a 0-0 tie! A TIE!
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
I’m with you, but the win/loss column is not.
G, the second coming of Foppa.
Embrace the Jagr.*
by JerseyDriver on Feb 12, 2012 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
We just did as of Tuesday night. We haven’t lost 3 in a row in regulation all year, but we lost in regulation to the Devils and Rangers last weekend and in the shootout to the Islanders on Tuesday.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
And they played well enough to win that Isles game, minus Evgeni Nabokov being ridiculous. This stretch is much worse than our emotions lead us to believe.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
What you said. :)
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
Because Freud’ principle of psychic deteminism states that no thoughts are accidental; all of your “random” thoughts are there for a reason, as are all of the things you ostensibly “don’t mean” to say. (i.e., this is where the whole “Freudian Slip” thing comes from)
So Travis is saying that things are horrible!!!!! Don't blow the team up - pour hydrochloric
acid on them and let them melt!
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
That’s why I didn’t think we had it was a coin flip loss!
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Feb 11, 2012 8:25 PM EST up reply actions
The difference in that game? “The Goalie”
by DrunkHockeyFan on Feb 11, 2012 8:57 PM EST up reply actions
What a POS.
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
by doubleh on Feb 11, 2012 9:46 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
AND IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII…
I go Bananas for Wayne Simmonds.
Also, as much as I love Whitney, Dolly does that song soooooo much better. My dad and I danced to that at my wedding.
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
by doubleh on Feb 11, 2012 9:47 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I won the 8th grade talent show singing “Saving All My Love For You.” I was a big fan of her voice.
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
by doubleh on Feb 11, 2012 9:46 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Right now I think best case scenario is Flyers ending up 6th in the conference. It is the only way I think they would get to the 2nd round.
WTF is going on in here tonight? Kimmo is awesome and does not deserve such derision. Everybody have a drink, calm the eff down and carry on.
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
by doubleh on Feb 11, 2012 8:58 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
Thanks. Also, I hate NY. It’s the lesser known jingle, created by the Philadelphia Board of Tourism.
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
by doubleh on Feb 11, 2012 9:38 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I used the “a tie is like kissing your sister” phrase in front of a few friends a few years ago and they still make fun of me for it. They think I made it up.
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 9:17 PM EST up reply actions
My sports editor in college thought I made up “put the biscuit in the basket.”
Flyers Fans: We've survived Lock-outs, Lindros and Cooperalls. If you want to get rid of us, you'll have to split an atom or two.
by KreiderDesigns on Feb 11, 2012 9:19 PM EST up reply actions
I hope you did not say “samsies” in front of them as well. :)
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Do they live under a rock?
A tie may be like kissing your sister, but it's better than getting screwed by a skills competition.
by doubleh on Feb 11, 2012 9:36 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I woke up a robot, anything's possible
by j reed on Feb 11, 2012 11:05 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
right?
"Women should have three breasts - two in front and one in the back for dancing." -Al Bundy
by HankMonahan on Feb 12, 2012 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
I AM SICK OFTHIS NONSENSE!!!!
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
by mikefive on Feb 12, 2012 12:16 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
that
was amazing
"Women should have three breasts - two in front and one in the back for dancing." -Al Bundy
by HankMonahan on Feb 12, 2012 12:41 AM EST up reply actions
GAIUSSSSS BALTARRRR
"Start playing with some jam in here"
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Feb 12, 2012 12:26 AM EST up reply actions
Favorite part of the interview was the subtle dig at the Rangers when he said “And tomorrow if we’re not ready to play, it’s an even tougher opponent than today.”
How do you know that’s a dig at the Rangers? He could just be saying Detroit are really good.
Simon Gagne AND Mike Richards may move between towns, wear new jerseys and call different arenas home but, at the end of the day, they will both always be Philadelphia Flyers.
One day Sean Couturier will win the Conn Smythe. You heard it here first.
by PursuitOfLappyness on Feb 11, 2012 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
hahaha rec’d
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by Travis Hughes on Feb 11, 2012 9:18 PM EST up reply actions
On Timonen
I don’t have much problem with what he says. I’m guessing most of the time most of us would not, but generally, we’re all a bit jumpy, and that is reminiscent of the style of play the Flyers are engaging in. Mikefive said “Hot carle, cold carle” but that is a bit like everyone right now, especially the D. No surprise with young players, and then add in Meszaros (not a defensive defenseman) and Carle (turnover prone).
Several newbies in the thread suggested that the Flyers need to put up or shut up, trade for a D now. That IMO would be a bad idea, unless you are talking about a Bryan Allen, or less, as a stopgap, who is just trying to plug a hole as a defensive defenseman, and who will be UFA in July (see ya). This team is highly unlikely to win a Cup this year. Let’s hope the Flyers do not spend resources seeking a Quixotic attempt toward that end.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
by Bud in TN on Feb 12, 2012 12:34 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I agree 100% with your second paragraph. Someone like Bryan Allen would be a worthwhile rental – take some pressure off the young guys, stay back in the play, clear the slot. If they could find a way to keep him at a reasonable price I wouldn’t be against that either.
My joke about Matt Carle can indeed be extended to everyone on the team. I pick on him because of his name, and because he is our team’s equivalent of the girl with the curl in the famous nursery rhyme: When he is good, he is very very good; but when he is bad, he is horrid. Again, you could say that about a lot of the team, especially right now.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
When he is good, he is very very good; but when he is bad, he is horrid. Again, you could say that about a lot of the team, especially right now.
Remember when this applied to Braydon Coburn? Every mistake he made wound up in his own net for about 4 months.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
SB Nation Philly - Associate Editor
by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
Oh Yeh. First half of 2009-10 when he was recovering from offseason hip surgery.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
by mikefive on Feb 12, 2012 7:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
+1 for “Quixotic”.
Lightning strikes once, Hextall strikes twice!
"I think there is virtue in pissing off idiots." - Fehr and Balanced
Yes, my spousal unit actually wrote a paper on an 18th century sequel, so I try to use this term whenever possible.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Rentals vs Keepers
Between Geoff’s SBPhilly article the other day, and any other defensemen possibly available, whether or not they’re pending UFA or RFA — Why do we need to consider Zanon, Allen, or anyone else ‘surely a rental’? Is there any other reliable defenseman the Flyers could realistically acquire (without devastating the offense) that folks wouldn’t assume is a rental?
Flyers have a cap crunch; Pronger might not be able to play again next year; Carle’s contract is expiring; Bourdon and Gus just need more experience; and I think Lilja should go via waiver or trade, just cut losses. That leaves room for non-rentals.
If the Flyers went and acquired Zanon or Allen — why not re-sign them and keep them? What would be wrong with Kimo/Coby/Carle as top 3, and Allen/Mez rounding out the top 5, with Bourdon and Gus competing for 6 and 7? Doesn’t that actually help if someone else gets hurt? When Kimo’s contract expires, I think it’d be great to have someone like Zanon or Allen on the team when Kimo isn’t anymore. By then Gus and FMABBAMF will only be more experienced, and presumably more consistent.
by Georgia_Flyer on Feb 12, 2012 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
and I think Lilja should go via waiver or trade, just cut losses. That leaves room for non-rentals.
Uh, not on that one. Lilja is post-35 so he stays on the cap even if sent to Adirondack. (A gift that keeps on giving).
As well, it’s clear you have not actually run the numbers or understand the tagging issue in the CBA. Since I am trying to keep this a “capgeek-free zone” I’ll just state that you should not say “leaves room for non-rentals” until or unless you are willing to study this. Not saying you have to spend mindless hours like I do, mind you, just that it’s way more complicated than you think. Right now, for instance, if you don’t sign Carle you might have room for Jagr and Voracek. But maybe not. It is way more complex to acquire a non-rental with the tagging issue, and it actually might prevent Jagr from being re-signed. Do you really want to acquire an Allenish D that much?
I’m fairly certain DG will back me on this, since she had to school me on this in the thread yesterday.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
As Bud mentioned, maybe you should check the second period thread from yesterday where I explained how we can’t have a roster that commits more salary for the following yeah than the current cap; that might make it a little clearer. We don’t have the cap space available for next year that we’d need in order to keep any rental players unless we give up people who are currently counting toward next year in a trade.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 12, 2012 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
System?
Last night, 3 of the 5 goals that the Flyers gave up were complete break downs in front of the net precipitated by a defensive scheme consisting of multiple players attacking the shooter and not at all worrying about the pass. I will admit, one of those goals was a power play goal that Bob probably should have poked/blocked the backdoor pass. The rest of those goals could have been completely avoided if the Flyers an established"zone" defensive system. My question is, do they; because from watching the Flyers play in the defensive zone, I really can’t tell. What is the defensive system? Are the players not executing the system correctly, or is it just a bad system? Or, are the players not good enough to execute the system. I’m tired of watching the Flyers run around in the defensive zone. It’s out of control and costing us points.
I think....
As a community we need to move on from this post and yesterday. It just divides the group. We need an early game or pre game thread. Anyone else watching the Caps-Rags? Caps wearing the old uni’s.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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It’s not just the FLyers obviously because Rags already have chances from the crease with men camped out there.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Same as yesterday. The game plan for the Rangers if you are in the offensive zone move to the sides of the net and hang out for rebounds or tip ins.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
Kimmo should blame himself a little too. On one of those goals on the penalty kill, he left a guy uncovered in front of the net. That was clearly on him. He had a crap game yesterday. The penalty kill is really where I wish we had a guy like Ryan Suter or Shea Weber to use their size and box guys out in front of the net. That is what Pronger did and it shows how much they’re missing him.
"Fuckin right G."
sigh
We were disappointed with the effort actually
to be honest I think we got half the guys going half the guys not
Obviously it was a tight game but they got three power play goals and we didn’t score any. So, obviously it came down to our special teams.
I felt like we could’ve pushed more and pressured more
Well obviously we could [use Chris Pronger] but he’s not here and we all should get by that by now. He’s not coming back and obviously we would be more than happy to have him back but he’s not here
We just need everybody going at the same time. We just can’t have one or two lines going and four D or whatever. We need everybody to get going here
And tomorrow if we’re not ready to play, it’s an even tougher opponent than today.
Well obviously we are in the playoffs but you know we’re not that far off so obviously every game matters
Overall I think it’s been okay this year but today we had a couple of breakdowns and they scored.
“We” implies inclusion of the person speaking.
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Justin,
“we got half the guys going” infers half the guys shit the sheets tonight. Not we are all shit the sheets. And in no way does it say “I” am part of the guys that shit the bed.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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And in no way does it say "I" am part of the guys that shit the bed.
Show me where he says anything along the lines of “I am busting my ass only for half the team to not care.” How do you know he’s not talking about himself?
It’s vague. He does not throw any person under the bus. In fact, when baited with a question about “youth,” Timonen intentionally avoids the Donovan McNabb soundbyte and instead of saying “we showed our youth today,” he says it is four guys out there on the penalty kill.
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
“to be honest I think we got half the guys going half the guys not” is the part that bugs me. I don’t think there’s any chance that he’s putting himself in the second half of that group; it’s almost certainly “I’m going hard and half the guys aren’t”. And I don’t think bringing that kind of sentiment to the press serves the team well, even if it’s not specifying which players are the slackers.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
It sounds better when Eric write it then myself, even when he is killing me. So I will say I agree with how Eric put it.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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I get where you are going with that, but when he is directly baited with a question from a reporter, he specifically mentions it is a team effort. If nothing else, it does seem Timonen contradicts himself a bit.
Hey Eric! Remember the off-season trades that had finally rid of the team of so-called “locker room issues?” Good times, amirite?
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
I know you are talking to Eric but I will respectfully interject. Mostly because I want to banter. I believe they did rid the team of the locker room issues. This entire argument is not exposing a rift in the room, only displaying a discontent with results. I don’t believe this room suffers from the perceived problems of the past. This room needs a definitive leader but I believe they are a good, unified group. All my opinions.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Yeah, I mean, don’t get me wrong — I care roughly 800 times more how a guy plays than what he says. I don’t really like the line that Timonen is skirting and would prefer the cliches, but it’s not a big deal to me.
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
I care roughly 800 times more how a guy plays than what he says
Oh absolutely. Way too much is said about what players say and don’t say to the media.
I do prefer the cliches to the media as well. One reason why I like Andy Reid is that he is all cliches to the media. From all reports, behind closed doors in the locker room is another matter, but Reid never takes the media’s bait to publicly throw someone under the bus. And he is despised by just about everyone for that because clearly, not publicly throwing people under the bus is a clear sign of no accountability.
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
My dad always gets so annoyed whenever Andy Reid says nothing in his press conferences and I never really got why. I agree with a lot of what you said there.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 12, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
but when he is directly baited with a question from a reporter, he specifically mentions it is a team effort.
Maybe I’m misunderstanding you here, but how exactly is “Was the big difference in this game the special teams?” a question that baits the player to question the effort level of his teammates?
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 12, 2012 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
I’m thinking of the final question: “Is your youth really showing when it comes to (inaudible) and the special teams?”
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Gotcha. Didn’t have anything wrong with that comment.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 12, 2012 3:05 PM EST up reply actions
“Yeah, freaking (inaudible) is killing us. (Inaudible) needs to get its crap together real quick.”
@BSH_EricT
Writer at Broad Street Hockey
“(inaudible) has got to play better for us out there.”
“Wait, who?”
“You heard me. (inaudible). He played like garbage.”
“I can’t hear you.”
“Look, I’m not sure what kind of sh*t you’re trying to pull here, but you damn well heard me. I’m not saying his name again.”
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 12, 2012 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
Can I also say for the record, I love Timmo! He is the best #3 defenseman in the entire league. Hands Down! He is a leader by example. I would speculate Timmo is not really comfortable at all being the point man for the media and I don’t want him to be.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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#3??? haha, that must mean Matt Carle is a #2!
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 12, 2012 8:41 PM EST up reply actions
Timmo is a great defenseman, leads by example and backs down to no one. Timmo is not the alpha male that a number 1 defenseman needs to be on a winning team. He is also not the Robin for the that alpha male. So he is the best second pairing defenseman in the league. Really whoever plays alongside Pronger is not the 2nd best defenseman on the team rather a counterpart of Pronger. Desjardin was the number 1 defenseman on the Flyers for a long time. Chris Therien was not the second best defenseman on any team in the NHL.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
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Is Drew Doughty an Alpha male? How about Duncan Keith? Nik Lidstrom? Sergei Gonchar for the 09 Pens? I completely disagree that the #1 defenseman on a winning team has to be Alpha. Completely.
But if you’re saying #3 based on pairings, fine. That doesn’t mean he’s the #3 based on depth chart.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2012 9:36 AM EST up reply actions
No #3 in pairings is exactly what I am saying. We worry too much about depth ranking around here. Like how insulted everyone was that Richards was not the #1 line, despite the fact his line was shut down not main offense.
Look at the last cup winners and tell me who didn’t have an alpha male as the #1 defenesman. And yes Keith Lidstrom Gonchar(was) and Chara are that
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
You and I clearly have different definitions of “alpha male” then. Further, I don’t see how Gonchar and Lidstrom are Alpha’s, but Kimmo isn’t.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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by Geoff Detweiler on Feb 13, 2012 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
You lost me a little bit, here. I loved Rico, and I love Kimmo, and while they’re not identical there are a lot of traits in common. I have trouble understanding how you can imply Rico was an alpha male on those teams, but Kimmo isn’t now… I mean, Rico was not exactly Pronger-esque in personality. He wasn’t exactly comfortable being the point man to the media either, and it stressed him out, hence why he was more than willing to hand the captaincy over when a qualified candidate came along.
Warning: Arguing the NHL CBA with me could be hazardous to your mental health. Proceed at your own risk.
by DragonGirl0583 on Feb 13, 2012 9:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah Desjardins was not that guy, but I was on the topic of Robins to Batmans at that point.
Commenter formerly known as M from Pdaddy, but still just Call Me "M"!
DISCLAIMER: Information written above may not be entirely factual nor provable with the use of complex statistics. But it may induce thought, humor and possibly laughter.
Since I haven't seen it anywhere else on here
Eric Wellwood has been called up and he may be replacing Jake Voracek in tonight’s game.
No word on goalies. Interesting to see what they do if Bryz is still sick—send in Bob for his 3rd in 4 games, despite a rough outing yesterday, or play the Chihuahua. Bob seems like the obvious choice, but I guess you never know.
by everybodyhitswoohoo on Feb 12, 2012 3:07 PM EST reply actions
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